Hey yall, I was just wanting to ask, in yalls opinion, what lever action rifle is the best chambered for the .44 Magnum? I tell ya what, it would be right nice to have a Mod. 94 Trapper in .44 Magnum. But I already have a 94 in 30-30, and besides I really dont need it. But you know how it is, when ya get the gun craze, but the funny thing is, it never goes away for me. Any replies would greatly appreciated! God Bless

Hey yall, I was just wanting to ask, in yalls opinion, what lever action rifle is the best chambered for the .44 Magnum? I tell ya what, it would be right nice to have a Mod. 94 Trapper in .44 Magnum. But I already have a 94 in 30-30, and besides I really dont need it. But you know how it is, when ya get the gun craze, but the funny thing is, it never goes away for me. Any replies would greatly appreciated! God Bless


Well, the only lever in 44 I have had experience with is a Marlin 1894PG and I really like it. Its light, holds 10rds, recoil is not to bad, and with the right aperture installed on it its plenty accurate for 125yds and less black bear / hog / deer / plinking :D

Georgian:
Mothing wrong with the Winchester, it's justnot my preference. Like actions scaled to the size of the cartridge, so the Marlin or the 92-cloes are just visually more appealing to me. Not a hoots difference in how well they shoot or operate.

Hey yall, I was just wanting to ask, in yalls opinion, what lever action rifle is the best chambered for the .44 Magnum? I tell ya what, it would be right nice to have a Mod. 94 Trapper in .44 Magnum. But I already have a 94 in 30-30, and besides I really dont need it. But you know how it is, when ya get the gun craze, but the funny thing is, it never goes away for me. Any replies would greatly appreciated! God Bless

I like my 1894 Marlin. It shoots where I point it. I hit the 200 yd gong on the 1st shot at the range at Ft. Jackson last week. The next 10 shots were close but no cigar. I keep tellin myself it is the 1st one that counts anyway.

I'd go with the Winchester myself. If you plan on shooting handloads that may run a little over the max length, you can get away with a lot more excessive length in the Winchester than the Marlin. This has been my experience, as nice as the marlin's are they are "scaled down" as one person put it and as such don't work good with a lot of custom loads. The 320gr loads I use in my Winchester 44 Trapper are way over max length and function fine. As to accuracy, the two are going to be about the same.

George

I've owned both Winchester and Marlin. The Marlin is prettier, but the synthetic stock and forearm on the Winchester will take more hunting and not show the results. Both guns were accurate. Both guns kicked hard with full reloads. Recoil is why I got rid of both guns. My 35 Marlin had less recoil and more range. It's a coin toss.

Well, I just might of found one of the best lever actions for the .44 . Take a look at the Model 94 Color Cased Trails Ends rifle, it is just beautiful. http://www.winchesterguns.com/prodinfo/catalog/detail.asp?cat_id=534&type_id=109&cat=003C

I just wish it wasnt so expensive, thats the only downside, but it looks good enough to be worth it. Man that is a fine piece of shootin iron. God Bless

Have you looked at any of the rossi / puma or winchester 92 clones? They look nice and feel (to me) nicer in my hands than the marlins. Also, I believe the 1892 clones are generally lighter than the marlins and winchester 1894's.

I've just never really been interested in the 1892's. To me, the 73, 66, and 60 Henry, are cool, and then the 94 to me takes the cake. The only wa I'd like a 92, is the way The Duke had his, large loop lever.

It might be ugly, but have you considered the Ruger 96/44? Aesthetics aside, they might be as nice a 44 Mag lever gun as anything else out there.

In the 'traditional' lever gun category, I'd take a Marlin over a Winchester every time--at least with current production models.

My vote goes to the Rossi/Brownchester 92's and clones then to the Marlin 1894's. I've just got this thing for the trim, sleek, compact handling qualities of a well tuned 92.

The Marlin's are really great guns, and easy to work on should that ever become necessary, also easy to pull the bolt for cleaning from the breech.

I had a Marlin 1894 for many years but it never shot loads heavier than 200 grains very well. Seven inch groups at 100 yards were common with 240 grainers. This is less than ideal. New Marlins have a better rifling but same slo-o-ow twist rate.

Ruger 96 is the one to buy. Groups of 2.5 inches or less at 100 yards common with just about any loading. I had my stock "checkered" with a basketweave type similar to Remington's pattern of the 1970's. I like it.
TR

I have a Winchester 94AE, and a Marlin 1894, and they are both fine rifles. Buy what moves you.

Hey AWESOME forum guys... I'm new here, but really enjoying this place.

I've got several Marlin 1894's and they're all wonderful rifles.. and a breeze to tear down for cleaning. Pull out the lever screw and out pops both the lever and the bolt! Fantastic.

But I gotta say, the 92's are really winning me over in a big way... beautiful, compact, reliable, strong, legendary. I really like both the Win/Browning/Miroku's as well as the new Rossi's. You'd do well with any of them. Might plan on getting each at some point! Dang 92's are bit of a PITA to tear down and re-assemble, but they're sure fine rifles. And like other guns, once you've torn-down and reassembled a few times, you get better at it!

I only have one .44mag, the Marlin 1894SS and I love it. But I want to chop it down to Trapper size.

Marlin 1894SS 20" - .44 magnum
http://www.legendportraits.com/Images/Marlin1894SS.jpg

I do have a new Legacy/Rossi Puma 92 Ltd Trapper in .454 and gotta say, this is one fantastic little carbine... most appealing indeed. My intention is to use it mostly with .45Colt and only occasional .454. Something you might want to consider.

Legacy/Rossi '92 Ltd. 16" Trapper - .454 Casull
http://www.legendportraits.com/Images/Puma454.jpg

And lastly, the king of the new production 92's in my view... perhaps the king of all the pistol-caliber lever rifles:

Winchester/Miroku '92 Ltd. 16" Trapper - .45 Colt
http://www.legendportraits.com/Images/Win92Trapper.jpg

Just ordered one from CDNN... they're selling them for $699... that's below usual dealer cost! If you don't mind spending the bucks, these are magnificent.

I've just never really been interested in the 1892's. To me, the 73, 66, and 60 Henry, are cool, and then the 94 to me takes the cake. The only wa I'd like a 92, is the way The Duke had his, large loop lever.
Saw a Rossi just like that the other day in a shop called Doc Holiday's. Loop lever, .44 mag, about $250. You can get aftermarket loop levers for Marlins too. I think Cabela's catalog has them.

Have you tried the Garrett Hammerheads? I've been told they won't fit in the Winchester. The reason the Winchester is longer is because it is the one that is "scaled down" to use pistol ammo. The Marlin is not scaled down, it is made specifically for the pistol bullets. That's why it won't take the Garretts. The .30-30 Marlin is a different gun made for rifle cartridges, not pistol cartridges. If you can fit the Garrets in a 94 I sure would like to hear about it. That would be great!!!!
Thank you for any help you can be?

I'd go with the Winchester myself. If you plan on shooting handloads that may run a little over the max length, you can get away with a lot more excessive length in the Winchester than the Marlin. This has been my experience, as nice as the marlin's are they are "scaled down" as one person put it and as such don't work good with a lot of custom loads. The 320gr loads I use in my Winchester 44 Trapper are way over max length and function fine. As to accuracy, the two are going to be about the same.

George

I got rid of my Winchester 94 due to the sloppy action and less than stellar groups, and got a Marlin 1894. Better action, tight groups, and they ( I've gotten a few more since then) handle everything from plinking loads to factory hunting loads and even Buffalo Bore ammo just fine. My .44 drops deer and hogs just as well as does my .45.

Thank you, I appreciate your input. I have always preferred Marlins. However, I have a Puma 92 in .454 that I had slicked up. The action is sooooo smooth, and it is so good looking. However, I would get a Winchester if it would shoot the Hammerheads, even if I have to have a gunsmith work it over for me. I will try the Buffalo Bore in my Marlin .44 mag.
Thank you.

I got rid of my Winchester 94 due to the sloppy action and less than stellar groups, and got a Marlin 1894. Better action, tight groups, and they ( I've gotten a few more since then) handle everything from plinking loads to factory hunting loads and even Buffalo Bore ammo just fine. My .44 drops deer and hogs just as well as does my .45.

Question, which came up on this forum last week; can you shoot .454 & .45 Colt out of your '92? I thought you could do it using a revolver in .454 but not a rifle, but maybe it's the other way around? Also, what steps did you take to slick up your Puma? I have "Magic Springs" in all my Marlins, including my 336 .35 Rem, and the action gets noticably smoother after installation, which isn't too difficult if you have some basic gunsmithing knowledge, and maybe they are made for your '92. They are worth the nominal price. Also, if you have Marlin 1894's, you need to know how to prevent the so called Marlin Jam, which is caused by the sharp edge left on the snail shaped cam which rides on the bottom of the carrier as you work the lever. After a good amount of shells, as well as the manner in which you work the lever (fast or slow), a notch will begin to be worn into the carrier from this sharp edge. Since I use my .44 and .45LC for cowboy action shooting, I've had to replace the carrier on the .44 I bought used, and even though I talked the pawnshop down quite a bit, it was because of the yellowing varnish the previous owner had put on the stocks, and not because it wouldn't feed right due to the notched carrier, which had to be replaced. If I had known, it would have been a $75 gun, but after refinishing the stocks myself and then having an action job done, it's as smooth as the Cowboy Competition .45 I already have. It doesn't take long or much expertise to radius the cam before the notch starts to form, so it's an ounce of prevention to avoid a pounding headache!
Thank you, I appreciate your input. I have always preferred Marlins. However, I have a Puma 92 in .454 that I had slicked up. The action is sooooo smooth, and it is so good looking. However, I would get a Winchester if it would shoot the Hammerheads, even if I have to have a gunsmith work it over for me. I will try the Buffalo Bore in my Marlin .44 mag.
Thank you.

Yes, my Puma 92 will shoot .45Colt smoothly and reliably. It will shoot the Mag TEch 260gr. .454 fast, smooth, and reliably. It will shoot other .454s, but they won't cycle as fast as the Mag Tech. I want to try some Buffalo Bore and Cor-Bon, but haven't had the chance.
I did not slick up my Puma myself. I knew that although the Puma is getting better, it still has some quality control problems. Steve Young at Steve's Gunz has an offer I couldn't refuse. He bought the gun and did the action, glass bedded the wrist (they will eventually crack there if you dont'), and because I am not a crow I don't like shiny things, nor do I want to tell the animal kingdom I'm coming by signaling with bright flashes, I had him glass bead the SS. It came out beautifuly. Sure enough, the gun had problems with the carrier. It's a long story, but this 92 was practically rebuilt before I ever saw it. I'm really happy I went with Steve's offer. This is the sweetest, smoothest, prettiest, best-handling lever gun I"ve ever seen, and I have several Marlins and a Savage. I've never liked the Winchester 94. They've always felt loose and cheap to me. However, I heard the newer ones are getting much better. I wouldn't hesitate to buy one if I could shoot the Garrett Hammerheads in it, but I would do the same thing I did with the 92.
I know this isn't much help, but maybe it will help a little.
Thanks for the information.



Question, which came up on this forum last week; can you shoot .454 & .45 Colt out of your '92? I thought you could do it using a revolver in .454 but not a rifle, but maybe it's the other way around? Also, what steps did you take to slick up your Puma? I have "Magic Springs" in all my Marlins, including my 336 .35 Rem, and the action gets noticably smoother after installation, which isn't too difficult if you have some basic gunsmithing knowledge, and maybe they are made for your '92. They are worth the nominal price. Also, if you have Marlin 1894's, you need to know how to prevent the so called Marlin Jam, which is caused by the sharp edge left on the snail shaped cam which rides on the bottom of the carrier as you work the lever. After a good amount of shells, as well as the manner in which you work the lever (fast or slow), a notch will begin to be worn into the carrier from this sharp edge. Since I use my .44 and .45LC for cowboy action shooting, I've had to replace the carrier on the .44 I bought used, and even though I talked the pawnshop down quite a bit, it was because of the yellowing varnish the previous owner had put on the stocks, and not because it wouldn't feed right due to the notched carrier, which had to be replaced. If I had known, it would have been a $75 gun, but after refinishing the stocks myself and then having an action job done, it's as smooth as the Cowboy Competition .45 I already have. It doesn't take long or much expertise to radius the cam before the notch starts to form, so it's an ounce of prevention to avoid a pounding headache!

dzrtram... what's "glass bedding the wrist"? I haven't done that to any of my lever rifles... don't even know what it is...

Oh yeah... another dumb question, what are Hammerheads?

This is what Steve told me for butstock bedding for the 454 Rossi. "Rossi has added a nylon bushing to the tang screw hole, but I also glass bed the stock where it mates up to the receiver up by the hammer. This distributes the recoil better"
Here's a link to Garrett's site for info on the Hammerheads.

http://www.garrettcartridges.com/default.asp

dzrtram... what's "glass bedding the wrist"? I haven't done that to any of my lever rifles... don't even know what it is...

Oh yeah... another dumb question, what are Hammerheads?

I got it... but after looking at Garrett's website I have to say that I am definitely not among the "power hungry" rifle guys. Not being a hunter, I find that .44 mag offers all the power that I need or want... I'm actually looking for a moderate to lower-end factory .44 mag loading as a defense load in my 1894SS... that's been impossible to find so far. Closest I've come is .44 special, most of which is really too anemic. However, Corbon's .44 special and Georgia Arms .44 special may be nearly what I'm looking for to use in my 1894SS .44mag lever rifle.

In the quest for the biggest and most powerful, ammo makers seem to forget that in some "power" calibers, like .44 mag or .454 Casull, making a low to moderate load isn't such a bad idea. Or maybe it's just my fault for asking a big caliber weapon to do a smaller job... I just like those big fat bullets! I'm finding that for my particular interest, .45 Colt is probably the perfect caliber. And I do have three awesome lever rifles which will fire that caliber.

I'm sorry, but I've never used any "hammer heads"in my WInchester 94. In fact I havn't used any factory ammo in it since it was new back in 1994. I have put every kind of handload i've come up with through it and it functions fine. The heaviest were some 320gr bullets I loaded up (I can't remember who made them) that were way over max COL and they worked fine. I find it distressing that several of you havn';t had good accuracy with their winchesters, but I guess maybe i've been lucky with my rifle, as it shoots great.

George

Well, I had to get in on this one! As many of you know, we hunt mainly the swamps and our rifles have to be handy, light, and quick. Where some people want a cowboy look or whatever, we care only how the gun hunts.
With that said, we use the dicontinued Marlin 1894P. Yes, we like the ports! We have bought all of these in the area. Most of the group shoot the 265 gr. Truncated Cone Wadcutter, which was designed for postive feeding in the 94's, but a few have been using the 240 gr Hornady XPT.
All in all, I think it is one great brush gun.........James

James... what's the barrel length on the 1894P? And if it did not have the ports, would you be as pleased with the guns? Do you think the ports are important on the gun?

To each his own. That's what makes the world go round. Everyone has his own use, however, imagination, creativity, and curiosity is what got us most of the inventions we have, including ammunition. About the ports, DHart; Marlin got so many complaints about them, especially on the .45-70s that I've heard they've discontinued them. Not a big deal on regular .44 magnum out in the field, but I sure wouldn't want them on a defensive gun that might be shot in a closed area. Even Taurus finally got the message, I hear, and is discontinuing them on most of their handgus. Personally, I hate them on a handgun. I had my beautiful S&W Mag na Ported and the ports leaded up the front sight and ruined the bluing, which was almost as pretty as if it came out of the Colt Python shop. Not a big factor in a relatively lower-powered rifle with pistol callibers, like a .44 mag, but they only really work on high pressure loads in high-pressure calibers. That's another reason why Marlin and Taurus discontinued them, on most of their guns. A million complaints can't be wrong. ;)


James... what's the barrel length on the 1894P? And if it did not have the ports, would you be as pleased with the guns? Do you think the ports are important on the gun?

Buffalo Bore makes .44 special ammo; 185 gr. JHP 1150 fps, and 255 gr. Keith type bullet at 1000 fps. They are not for the Charter Arms Bulldog, but for a defense load from a rifle, they might be what you are looking for.

I got it... but after looking at Garrett's website I have to say that I am definitely not among the "power hungry" rifle guys. Not being a hunter, I find that .44 mag offers all the power that I need or want... I'm actually looking for a moderate to lower-end factory .44 mag loading as a defense load in my 1894SS... that's been impossible to find so far. Closest I've come is .44 special, most of which is really too anemic. However, Corbon's .44 special and Georgia Arms .44 special may be nearly what I'm looking for to use in my 1894SS .44mag lever rifle.

In the quest for the biggest and most powerful, ammo makers seem to forget that in some "power" calibers, like .44 mag or .454 Casull, making a low to moderate load isn't such a bad idea. Or maybe it's just my fault for asking a big caliber weapon to do a smaller job... I just like those big fat bullets! I'm finding that for my particular interest, .45 Colt is probably the perfect caliber. And I do have three awesome lever rifles which will fire that caliber.

I'm going to answer your question about the ports on the Marlin 1894P even at the risk of the poster against them. First of all they do reduce the recoil with the heavy bullets like the 265 and 300 grainers. The Marlin 1894P's barrel is 16 1/2".
Second, we have never had any leading in the ports when using jacketed bullets or the alloy that Marshall uses, only grey dust, that might or might not be lead, that is blown out with the next shot. Soft lead bullets may fill the ports? I don't know about the 45-70 as we don't use them. Marlin droped the 1894P due to low sales. The traditional and cowboy gun shooters raised the most complaints with Marlin.
By all means shoot whatever turns you on.......I just happen to post that the 1894P is popular with our swamp hunters. If you don't think a hard cast 265 gr bullet at 1800'/" kills in the swamps, then you just haven't been there. If you don't think a super short fast 16 1/2" doesn't help when you have a large boar hog on your butt, you just haven't been there.....James

On second thought......I just noticed the name of the thread is what is the "Best"......I answered as what we "Liked" the most and simply said why. The "Best" covers a lot of ground.
Best groups? Best machining? Best finish? Best fitting? Best price?........or whatever. The "Best" for you, is what you "Like".......James

Well said, James. I have no doubts that what you use for your needs is quite suitable.
I am not a bear hunter, but bears have become quite a problem in the NW. It seems someone is killed or badly mauled every year. Black bears seem to get bigger every year. I've been reading on many sites about the size of some black bears some people are encountering. Where I fish and fourwheel, high in the Montana mountains I have a very good chance of some day encountering a bear. The last thing I want to do is shoot it. I've never understood why people want to go kill a bear.
Anyway, although black bear is the most common bear, there is always a chance for a Griz now and then. Normal .44 magnums aren't going to stop a charging bear unless it is hit exactly right, or multiple times. The Garrett Hamerheads will kill even a Griz if shot placement is correct. Do I want to bet my life on a Hammerhead? No, but I can repeat-shoot a lever .44 mag faster than a heavier, harder-kicking .45-70. If a bear is charging, one pull on the trigger may be all you get with a 400-500 grain .45-70 load. If you are totally calm and can aim, one shot may be all you need. If the bear is not charging, and is standing upright, the Hammerheads will drop him, otherwise the lever gun makes for fast follow-up shots.
I've had some experiece with bears. My cousins have a logging camp in Canada. They have a lot of problems with bears, and often have to kill them. They use a .303 British Enfield--about the power of a .30-30, which will also kill them, if shot placement is good. This is very marginal, but the bears are rarely ever charging. Sometimes they have had to kill them because they were trying to rip their way into the cabin, and were standing up, so shot placement was an easy kill for the .303. The Hammerhead has been used in handguns for big game all over the world, as has the .45 Colt, when loaded correctly, so I'm not afraid to use either.
Truth is most bears usually stand up and growl, giving a great target for shot placement. Most bear incidents aren't charging bears. I said "most", "usually", not always. If you have seen the article on the monster bear that killed the naked hiker in Alaska you probably remember he had time to get off two shots. Problem is he had a .38 revolver. The bear was probably just tickled and laughing as he tore the guy apart. There was no way that guy could have stopped that bear with the .38, but, if I remember correctly, with a more appropriate caliber, the shot placement would have been correct, and a Hammerhead or two would have killed him.
My question was only to research the possibility of upgrading my .44 magnum. I may not do that, but if I don't ask I won't learn. My situation is a whole lot more dangerous than most of what you may hunt in the swamps--the big "lizards" not included. ;) I mean gators. And, I don't use a lever gun for self defense. Overlooking the "power hungry" remark I use a revolver with the biggest, most powerful load I can handle and get off multiple shots. That's the what I gauge my use of ammunition by. If I'm going to bet my life on it, I'm sure not looking for a weak load.
You may be correct about the reason for the discontinuation of that particular Marlin. However, I wasn't referring to that gun specifically. On the old "Marlin Talk" site the complaints about the ports came in on a daily basis. This is just one site, there are many others. I would suggest that anyone skeptical of this information should call Marlin or Taurus and hope for a straight answer. Due to "lawyer-proofing" I doubt they will admit the ports on the most powerful levers were hurting ears and they were getting complaints from customers. That would be tantamount to setting them up for law suits. However, you might ask them if they are porting their guide gun and others, and ask Taurus the same. It's not personal opinion, it's fact. Check out the 2005 catalogs when they come out.. If you feel the ports help with the load you are using then that's great. I've found that except for the most powerful loads ports are generally not a big help, but that's just me.

On second thought......I just noticed the name of the thread is what is the "Best"......I answered as what we "Liked" the most and simply said why. The "Best" covers a lot of ground.
Best groups? Best machining? Best finish? Best fitting? Best price?........or whatever. The "Best" for you, is what you "Like".......James

well I thought I would put in my 2 pennies. I have several lever action rifles from Winchester and marlin and 1 ruger. I like them all. I think in "traditional lines" I like the marlins best. 94's have that loose feeling to me too. I am a 44 magnum nut and do most of my hunting with them. My Ruger 96 44 mag shoots great with 310 hardcast lbt ahead of 21.5 grains of 296. Kills like a lightning bolt. These don't shoot as good out of my marlin or winnie. But the marlin loves 250 keith ahead of 22 grains 2400. Never got what I thought as a "great load out of winchester yet though. I would not get rid of my 1895 for nothing. I love the old 45/70. A quick touch on bear protection. I live in the Upper Peninsula of Michigan and see black bear all the time. I have never had to kill one to protect myself or family. Had alot of "close calls" with them. Came face to face at 25 feet in the swamps here. I used to carry a Superblackhawk I had cut to 5 1/2 inches loaded heavy. I knew I would only get 1 shot. Never carried a rifle for defense. We have a lot of people come up to hunt with "guides" I use that term very loosely. I was hired 2 years ago to help track a wounded blackie down in the swamps near Channing. I though long and hard about what weapon to take. I decided on my Remington sp10 with 22 inch barrel and screw in chokes. "Home rolled" some 3 1/2 inch 00(none available here) and went in. Met him holed up in a cedar swamp at about 50 yards. He did come after me. He bellowed and ran toward me, At about 25 yards I emptied the Remington. First shot rolled him back on his haunches second knocked him down third was prbably not needed, But I wanted to make sure. Now I carry a shotgun for protection for bear. Bear will almost always avoid you. But better safe than sorry. Pepper spray is a real joke. All you are conna do is pi&& him off with that and that is not good. And don't worry about recoil in defense situation. You will never feel it. Adrenalin will be pumping. All else fails pick up a Ruger 44 carbine. I have one and enjoy it alot. I wish I could use cast bullets in it though. Well my 2 cents turned into a nickel. Above all have faith in your weapon, Be able to use it effectively and God bless Oh yeah. The blackie had been belly shot with a 200 grain 30-06. That is why he was in a bad mood.

Nice information. I sure hear a lot of conflicting advice on using a shotgun on bear. When that goofball got his girlfriend and himself killed by bears up in Alaska, the rangers who went in to the scene said not to use a shotgun on a bear. Of course, those were Grizzlies. I like your choice of bullets in your .44 mag. No matter what gun I take, some kind of lever, I suppose, I think the hardcast 310-360 is the way to go. I did get confused on the Ruger 96, though. You said you used 310 hardcast, but further down you said you wished it used cast. Are you talking about two different guns?
Nice infromation, though. Thanks for the input.






well I thought I would put in my 2 pennies. I have several lever action rifles from Winchester and marlin and 1 ruger. I like them all. I think in "traditional lines" I like the marlins best. 94's have that loose feeling to me too. I am a 44 magnum nut and do most of my hunting with them. My Ruger 96 44 mag shoots great with 310 hardcast lbt ahead of 21.5 grains of 296. Kills like a lightning bolt. These don't shoot as good out of my marlin or winnie. But the marlin loves 250 keith ahead of 22 grains 2400. Never got what I thought as a "great load out of winchester yet though. I would not get rid of my 1895 for nothing. I love the old 45/70. A quick touch on bear protection. I live in the Upper Peninsula of Michigan and see black bear all the time. I have never had to kill one to protect myself or family. Had alot of "close calls" with them. Came face to face at 25 feet in the swamps here. I used to carry a Superblackhawk I had cut to 5 1/2 inches loaded heavy. I knew I would only get 1 shot. Never carried a rifle for defense. We have a lot of people come up to hunt with "guides" I use that term very loosely. I was hired 2 years ago to help track a wounded blackie down in the swamps near Channing. I though long and hard about what weapon to take. I decided on my Remington sp10 with 22 inch barrel and screw in chokes. "Home rolled" some 3 1/2 inch 00(none available here) and went in. Met him holed up in a cedar swamp at about 50 yards. He did come after me. He bellowed and ran toward me, At about 25 yards I emptied the Remington. First shot rolled him back on his haunches second knocked him down third was prbably not needed, But I wanted to make sure. Now I carry a shotgun for protection for bear. Bear will almost always avoid you. But better safe than sorry. Pepper spray is a real joke. All you are conna do is pi&& him off with that and that is not good. And don't worry about recoil in defense situation. You will never feel it. Adrenalin will be pumping. All else fails pick up a Ruger 44 carbine. I have one and enjoy it alot. I wish I could use cast bullets in it though. Well my 2 cents turned into a nickel. Above all have faith in your weapon, Be able to use it effectively and God bless Oh yeah. The blackie had been belly shot with a 200 grain 30-06. That is why he was in a bad mood.

Quick comment on bear hunting; although I have no desire to hunt black bear, and can't afford to go for a brownie to have mounted in my trophy room (first you have to have a trophy room!), I have several friends who hunt blackies regularly, and they quite enjoy the meat as well as the hunt. One of my buddies uses a 45-70 or .458 as back-up while his wife is hunting with her .35 Remington. Another friend uses a .44 mag so she can have the same ammo in her pistol and rifle. Yes, I said she, and I am quite confident in her shooting skills that if she encountered a mad griz, she'd put it down just as easily. This isn't to say that since it's possible, everyone can do it. Elmer Keith's 300 yard (not sure of the right distance so correct me please) shot that killed an already wounded deer with his .44 wasn't probable, but for Elmer, it was possible. Please don't confuse the two and read something else into this post, I am just pointing out what some people use for bear hunting.

The more I think about the word "best", the more I don't think there really is any "best" anything, usually anyway, there are, however, often two or more excellent choices when qualified for specific attributes.

I've now got two .44 magnum lever rifles. The first is a Marlin 1894SS, a stainless steel, 20" barrel. Great rifle... strong, reliable, great looking, very practical finish.

Marlin 1894SS 20" - .44 magnum
http://www.legendportraits.com/Images/Marlin1894SS.jpg

I love the rifle and I'm happy to have it, but as nice as it is, it doesn't satisfy my desire for a really short .44 magnum carbine.

So today I bought my second .44 magnum lever rifle, a Winchester 94 Trapper with 16" barrel.

Winchester '94 16" Trapper - .44 Magnum
http://www.legendportraits.com/Images/Win94Trapper.jpg

After shooting this rifle tonight, I've found it to be every bit as reliable with a wide variety of ammunition (including .44 special Silvertips) as the Marlin is, but it's a whole different feel and style of rifle.

Both can definitely benefit from action and trigger jobs. But neither is "best", they're both great. Just different.

For hunting or situations where I need the most corrosion resistance, the Marlin would be my choice.

For a camp gun/truck gun/personal defense gun, or just "lay it across my desk while I work" gun (home office)... I'd take the Trapper over the Marlin because it's so much more maneuverable, quicker to shoulder, quicker to swing, handier in general, especially in close quarters, like the home or RV.

So, they're both great guns and I don't believe either is necessarily "better" than the other. Good excuse to buy more than one!

;)

dzrtram;
I use the 310 lbt in my Ruger 96, But I also have a 44 carbine Ruger. This is an automatic. Cast bullets foul up gas system in her. A real pain to clean out, Total disassembly of gun. That ain't easy. I know alot of people wil say bad about using a shotgun on bear, But I know from experience a shotgun is one awsome weapon. If I am going into a tight spot looking for a wounded animal that may bite back, I will definitely have a shotgun in my hand.I would not pick it to hunt bear with. I have been fortunate enough to pretty much live all my life in the bush and have hunted and fished since knee high. I have seen lots of game taken as well as taken myself and I know what works when it has to. If I were going to meet even a grizzler in tight quarters I would have my sp10 loaded with 00 buckshot. At 25 yards 3 1/2 inch 00 is barely opening up. That is 18 pellets hitting all at once. Take that times 3, Alot of firepower. In WW2 the Germans tried their hardest to get shotguns banned from warfare, Because they tore up whatever they were pointed at. Any American caught with a shotgun by Germans were pretty much killed on the spot. If I were going to hunt bear from a stand, I would use my 454 casull with 300 grain hardcast wfn at around 1500 fps. My rifle? My trusted friend- Marlin 1895. Also with 300 grain bullet but jacketed at 2200 fps. Both stone cold killers. Good luck and God Bless All

dzrtram;
I use the 310 lbt in my Ruger 96, But I also have a 44 carbine Ruger. This is an automatic. Cast bullets foul up gas system in her. A real pain to clean out, Total disassembly of gun. That ain't easy. I know alot of people wil say bad about using a shotgun on bear, But I know from experience a shotgun is one awsome weapon. If I am going into a tight spot looking for a wounded animal that may bite back, I will definitely have a shotgun in my hand.I would not pick it to hunt bear with. I have been fortunate enough to pretty much live all my life in the bush and have hunted and fished since knee high. I have seen lots of game taken as well as taken myself and I know what works when it has to. If I were going to meet even a grizzler in tight quarters I would have my sp10 loaded with 00 buckshot. At 25 yards 3 1/2 inch 00 is barely opening up. That is 18 pellets hitting all at once. Take that times 3, Alot of firepower. In WW2 the Germans tried their hardest to get shotguns banned from warfare, Because they tore up whatever they were pointed at. Any American caught with a shotgun by Germans were pretty much killed on the spot. If I were going to hunt bear from a stand, I would use my 454 casull with 300 grain hardcast wfn at around 1500 fps. My rifle? My trusted friend- Marlin 1895. Also with 300 grain bullet but jacketed at 2200 fps. Both stone cold killers. Good luck and God Bless All
I heard that same story about WWI. No doubt the pumpsters were the real deal for hopping in and out of other people's trenches, especially with that bayonet lug. Now THAT would be a pig sticker!

Also heard some of the boys in the trenches would do some trap shooting on incoming grenades from the other side of "no man's land". Don't know what their score was, but I'll bet they were focused.

I have the Trapper in 44 mag and the Marlin 16" 1894P, also in 44 mag. The big difference I notice is that the action of the Trapper jerks the gun around much more than the action of the Marlin does. The Marlin hardly moves, and its sights stay fairly well on target during the cycle. But I hate the Marlin's ports and intend to sell it. adk

adk... yep, I've noticed that a lot with my Win 94 trapper in .44 mag. I do have a Marlin 1894SS w/20" barrel and a soon-to-arrive 1979-made Marlin 1894 .44 mag in blue steel with straight, non-checkered stock, and no safety. One of these two 20" rifles will be cut to become a 16" Trapper, not sure which one just yet. Like yours, these don't jerk around when you cycle the lever.

I think it's mostly overcoming the heavy hammer on the Winchester 94 which causes the movement... that and the loose fitting of the levering mechanism itself. I guess that's why the Win 94's are priced fairly economically. I still love the little 94 Trapper, but I'd like to find out the jerking during levering action can be reduced with some tuning. Plus the trigger pull on the Win 94 is really heavy. On the Marlin 1894's the trigger pull is delightful.

I love my Ruger 96/44, as I've never really gotten on with traditional lever guns - they feel to skinny and the comb is too low for a scope for me. My 96/44 gets used on pigs, with a 1.5 to 4.5 Bushnell shooting 240 grain Sierra JHC's.

The Ruger 94/44 is a favorite among some of my hunting buddies when it comes to pig killin'.
Dhart, ADK, you should try putting in a Marlin "Magic Spring" fpr your 1894's. It makes a lot of difference in the action and trigger pull, and is a drop in part so minimal gunsmithing knowledge is needed. Also, a one piece firing pin makes a great deal of difference as well.

I'd like to try those things, but in a new Marlin without ports. Maybe that stainless model. I'll sell the 1894P first. Thanks. adk

I just wanted to say "Thank You" for all the input. I have been in the hospital the last ten days, and didn't have access to the internet. I just wanted you to know that you have given me some valuable information. I'm glad to see the truth coming out about the ports. I hate those things. I'm glad Marlin finally listened to their customers and is mostly doing away with them, from what I hear. Great thread. I hope it continues. I enjoy the education. Thanks again. Ross

Whoa! That doesn't sound like much fun, glad you've made it back out!!!!!

Before I bought this little Trapper I had read so many statements saying that 94's aren't very good in pistol calibers and "yada yada bad mouth". I think some of that must be repetition of hearsay rather than direct experience with recent vintage 94's. I also heard a lot of folks saying how much they loved their 94's! Anyway, I just liked the look and feel of the 94 Trapper, the price was reasonable, so I bought one in spite of the 94 naysayers just because I didn't have a 94 among my lever rifles and just to see what the "94 Experience" would be like for me.

Well I've shot it a little on a few occasions just to chronograph some loads in my laundry room. That was all well and good and fun, despite the limitations of the setting.

But today I put it in an XXS junior size cordura gun case (fit perfectly) and strapped it across the passenger seat of my Road King Custom and headed into the National Forest for a little plinking session. The width of the rifle case was just about as wide as from the end of my clutch lever to the end of my brake lever, so it wasn't too wide at all across the back of a motorcycle. (Usually I have to decide between "taking a ride" and going shooting, and riding almost always wins unless it's raining. But today I decided to combine the two activities so I wouldn't have to give either one up! GREAT idea!

Anyway, I fired about 110 rounds of .44 mag in a wide variety of brands and bullet types... mostly JHP bullet types. Everything from Silvertips to semi jacketed soft points, to hollow soft points, to Hornady XTP, WInchester Partition, etc.

Everything fed and fired like a charm. And the recoil was not the least bit uncomfortable! No need for a butt pad. The gun performed wonderfully and was surprisingly accurate for simple open iron sights and such a short sighting radius. With a lighter trigger, I could have been even more accurate with it, but HEY, this isn't intended to be a target rifle.. it's a plinker/fun gun/camp gun/close range hunter/defense carbine... and for those purposes it's accuracy is more than up to the job.

Even though I have a number of wonderful Marlin 1894s, two Win/Miroku 92s, a Legacy/Rossi 92 Trapper, and a Henry, I could not be happier with this little beauty. It's reliable, handy, powerful, accurate, fun to shoot, economical, and great looking! Most importantly, it's compact size makes it perfect for taking on a motorcycle ride! It's a keeper indeed and a bargain for such a nice Trapper. It carries wonderfully and feels great in the hands. I even prefer it's larger loading gate over the much smaller loading gate found on the wonderful Winchester/Miroku 92's.

Thanks Dan and others for encouraging us to embrace the wonderful 94! Now I want one in .45 Colt also.... lever rifle glutton that I am. :rolleyes:

Yes, the trigger pull is heavy and the lever needs to be cycled with authority. I would like the trigger to be a little lighter, but that can be accomplished. As far as I'm concerned, the rebounding hammer is no big deal (no awareness that it's even there) and the slick little tang safety is actually a nice, convenient, good looking safety feature which I appreciate having when carrying the rifle loaded and cocked - ready for action. Just a thumb flick on the safety lever and BANG! For those who may be considering one, I say GO FOR IT! :cool:

Winchester '94 16" Trapper - .44 Magnum
http://www.legendportraits.com/Images/Win94Trapper.jpg

ROCK ON 94's! :D

My Trapper was in .45 Colt, and the accuracy was lousy, the action jammed quite a bit and the only thing I liked about it was the finish on the stocks was nicer than the awful Mar-shield. It left as soon as I could save up enough to trade it in and pay for the difference for a new Marlin CB II Ltd. in .44. Glad you like yours Dhart, and I hope it gives you years of great service, it's just that in my circle of friends who shoot CAS and/or hunt with pistol cartridges through lever guns almost never chose the 94 Trapper to begin with, and if so, it never stays in their collection for long. I have no experience with the regular rifle length action; just the above mentioned calibers.

Hey SFT... no, I don't see using a 94 Trapper for CAS use or serious hunting by any means. There are plenty of other rifles which serve those purposes better. So I can see why your circle of friends prefer other guns.

I see the Win 94 Trapper strictly as a fun gun/plinker/truck gun/camp gun/defense gun.

For CAS, I use a Marlin 1894CBC in .45 Colt, a Marlin 1894CS .357 mag. and a race tuned Browning B92 .357.

I'm not a hunter, so long range hunting needs are of no concern to me. I do have an older (1979) Marlin 1894 .44 mag. and a new Marlin 1894SS in .44mag which are great "all around use" lever rifles, not bad for hunting either.

No, the Win 94 Trapper is not a replacement for other guns, but an addition to. Judging from how it's worked for me so far, I think it's a great little blaster. Very handy to just have around along with my Mossberg 500 "Persuader". It's small enough to lay on my desk at night just in case something goes "bump" in the night while I'm enjoying my favorite Harley and gun forums.

A Win 94 Trapper would not be my first choice if it were to be the only rifle I owned. But fortunately, I have enough other rifles to consider buying the 94 as a "Lark". Turned out the lark is a good one indeed!

By the way, my favorite Trapper is the Winchester/Miroku 92 Ltd. Edition Trapper in .45 Colt... got this one laying across my desk right now as I write this:

Winchester/Miroku '92 Ltd. 16" Trapper - .45 Colt
http://www.legendportraits.com/Images/Win92Trapper.jpg

My other favorite Trapper is another new one, the Legacy Puma 92 in .454 Casull. I shoot almost entirely .45 Colt in it, but the capability of .454 Casull is nice to have (if I ever come upon a need for that kind of power!). This is a wonderfully featured Trapper with Hi-Viz sights (bright red front sight and bright green rear sights), two loading ports (the up front port is a lot easier to load without tiring your thumb), a very well cushioned ventilated butt pad, and black finish hardwood stocks which look like ebony against the stainless steel. Great little Trapper indeed.

Legacy/Rossi '92 Ltd. 16" Trapper - .454 Casull
http://www.legendportraits.com/Images/Puma454.jpg

So the Winny 94 isn't exactly the "top dog" in Trappers, but it sure is a great little gun for someone who wants a great looking, excellent handling fun/truck/camp gun and doesn't want to break the bank to buy it.

Ranch Dog shot a pretty good boar hog with a .44 Trapper. Depending on the circumstances (range, cover, etc.) it does seem to be a very useful hunting rifle!

Oh I think I might have kept my Trapper even if not for CAS events, but for hunting if it had any accuracy at all. The wood was really nice, one of the nicest pieces of black walnut I've seen on regular production guns, but none of the loads I tried in it ever worked well, and I just couldn't see any purpose in keeping it. Then again, I got rid of a Marlin 1894 .44 mag. that I bought a couple of years ago, so I could have something else besides my CB II Ltd. to ding up in the woods, plus have a much shorter barrel length and sling studs. It functioned flawlessly, but there wasn't a single .44 load, cowboy or hunting, that went straight out of it either, so there always the possibility of getting a lemon NIB. My current 1894 CB Comp. in .45 is a sweet shooter that just begs to knock down steel targets as well as kill hogs, and my PCB, ballard style pawn shop project gun in .44 looks to be the same. Either way, if it works for you, go with it.

SFT... I have one of these also... and I sure like it. But at 20" the barrel sure seems looooong to me! ;) I won't hold that against it though... it's a great rifle!

Marlin 1894CBC 20" - .45 Colt
http://www.legendportraits.com/Images/Marlin1894CBC45C.jpg

I think it will become my main CAS rifle. For CAS I'm shifting over from .38/.357 to .45 Colt because I've decided these big fat .45 Colt cartridges are just THAT cool! :D

Man, mine shoots like a house a fire! I actually thought I'd be less accurate going from my CB II Ldt. and it's 24" barrel to the comp., but I don't seem to hit any more targets with it than the other. I've taken it into the field too, and hogs get just as dead, but there was something about that loong barrel that keeps me on the lookout for a used one; there aren't any right now, so I guess it's one of those "geez, what was I thinking?!?" deals, but, that's life.

Now, my project gun has continued to remain unusable, despite an action job, new carrier Magic Spring and one piece firing pin, so my .44 ammo sits alone and lonely. Just can't seem to figure out why the frsh round won't get centered as the bolt closes, and it's been a puzzling gun just for the fact that no one has seen a Marlin 1894 exhibit these problems. My guess is that Marlin went to making two carriers, big bore/small bore 336 or 1894, as the old one was the original 1976 production and Marlin doesn't make them that way anymore, but swears that this new one fits all 1894's; BUT?.......does it work in all 1894 designs?

Anyway, I got a really nice cut of walnut on my newer CBC, and the "mar-shield finish seems a bit less milky than before, what do you think about that?

SFT, I"m gonna guess you had a lemon on your trapper. I bought one of the 100th aniniversary models in 1994, and it hshot horible out of the box. I had a little go around with Winchester, and they put a new barrel on it, and the thing shoots great now. When they shipped it back to me they included a target shot at 50yds that had three shots in about 1-1/2", and using my handloads I have been able to get 2" at 100yds with it off the bench using a Lyman #2 tang sight.

I'm not disputing your accuacy wqoes with your gun, I'm saying that I can belive iut because I got a bad one myself, but it is now my favorite rifle in my collection, and even though it sits at home mosat of the time during hunting season due to bigger and longer range guns I have, iut does get shot a lot, and will be shot about 300rnds today.

George

I'm pretty sure my Winchester Trapper, which I bought some 4 years ago I think, was a lemon, but I wasn't willing to wait and see, so I just traded it in for a Marlin 1894 CB II limited. That gun was superbly accurate, with both low powered CAS as well as hunting loads (.44 mag.). I switched to .45 LC all the way around around two years ago, and traded that in along with some other guns for my 1894 Cowboy Comp. and got a Beretta Stampede in place of my Rugers. The revolver was a mistake and I'm back to one Ruger right now, leaving having to borrow a second pistol for CAS matches, but maybe I'll get my medical bills paid off someday and actually feel good enough to start shooting regularly again, but I digress.
In between the .44 CB II and the CBC switch to .45, I began to think I was just asking for trouble taking the .44 into the field, plus the longer barrel, despite a better sight picture and added velocity, coupled with the lack of sling studs made me buy a regular Marlin .44 mag. The shorter round barrel seemed okay, although I'm partial to the octagonal design, but it had sling studs, drilled and tapped, and it was less than $350, tax included out the door of Walmart. I know I can't use Marlin's standard sights, so I put on the Marbles semi-buckhorn, but to no avail. Even putting a scope on it, trying different loads, breaking in the barrel, etc., could put it on a satisfactory level, but I was having money problems again and it wasn't hard to get rid of it at one of the local gun shows for nearly what I had paid for it. Goes to show you can get a lemon from any maker, but all the other Marlins I've ever owned, either used or bought new, have been shooters from the first shot.
The action of my CBC just begs to be cycled, and I know I'm not the only one who opens the gun case just to hold a favorite rifle, so don't try to deny you do the same!
The Winchester was dog-gone nice looking though, with a small burl in the buttstock that you don't normally see in the usual offerings, but I could afford to keep it as just a wall hanger.
You can really improve on the action of any of your leverguns by having a full blown action job to some simple drop in springs and bring it up to the level of a CBC, just be sure you check out the gunsmith or parts first to see if it's going to turn out right. That's not to say anything bad about the smith who's working on my Marlin pre-cross bolt .44, but that is to say that the first guy who worked on it tried to pass off the old parts as new by just polishing them up and stating that he had no problem cycling shells through it. Impossible I said! However, I strongly suspect that the new parts that are now in the gun weren't the right ones, or there's some kind of a defect in them that we just can't see right now. My friend and gunsmith has what has become the gun from ****, and right now he won't take any more money from me above his normal fee for action jobs and the new parts already put in. I don't like making my friends mad at me like this, but he's just as frustrated if not more due to this one Marlin seemingly unlike any others he's ever seen, worked on and fixed. I spent three months refinshing the stocks so they'd be A+, but I may end up selling those pretty pieces of wood for cash to replace everything internally in the stupid thing! Again, I digress, and I apologize for "hijacking" this thread; just felt like typing today I guess.:rolleyes:
SFT, I"m gonna guess you had a lemon on your trapper. I bought one of the 100th aniniversary models in 1994, and it hshot horible out of the box. I had a little go around with Winchester, and they put a new barrel on it, and the thing shoots great now. When they shipped it back to me they included a target shot at 50yds that had three shots in about 1-1/2", and using my handloads I have been able to get 2" at 100yds with it off the bench using a Lyman #2 tang sight.

I'm not disputing your accuacy wqoes with your gun, I'm saying that I can belive iut because I got a bad one myself, but it is now my favorite rifle in my collection, and even though it sits at home mosat of the time during hunting season due to bigger and longer range guns I have, iut does get shot a lot, and will be shot about 300rnds today.

George

SFT... someday you might try a Win 94 Trapper again... I love mine (.44 mag) and at reasonably close distances it's plenty accurate enough for me. Like I said earlier, it ain't no target rifle... not made for that. I sure do love it for plinking and as a home/camp/truck defense rifle... it's quite up to those tasks. The thing I really love about it is the size, weight, and convenience of the Trapper size. Now I'm a confirmed Trapper freak. I've got three with more on the way.

Regarding the wood on my 1894CBC .45 Colt... it's gorgeous. And I love the straight stock without checkering. Even the forestock is slimmer than my new 1894SS .44 mag.

I just bought a used 1894 .44 mag. from 1979. Finish on the wood and the gun is gorgeous, beautiful bore. But usually on trying to chamber the first round, when the lever gets all the way open, the gun hangs up like a bank vault with the bullet still poking into the tube magazine and the lifter starting to take up the rear end. I fussed with it for a bit and decided to let Marlin make it right. Pissed me off for sure because the gun looked so nice... I guess ya never know. Had I not done some action tuning/polishing I would have returned it to the seller, but I'd done som work on it trying to get it to feed right, so I didn't feel right asking the seller to take it back. besides I really want the gun... no cross bar safety, beautiful stocks and metal. Hopefully Marlin will make it run right. Live and learn...

Have you considered sending your 1894 to Marlin?

No, I was under the impression that Marlin wouldn't work on older guns like this. Mine is a 1976 make, and I believed it to be too old. I really think that Marlin did not send the right carrier, although I know they discontinued the original configuration and went with a one size fits all for the 1894 series. It's either that or something else needs to be replaced, but I'm down to the bolt and the screws as the last original parts on the thing. I do need to call Marlin and order another "bullseye" for the stock, so I will ask them about the malfunction and possibly shipping it back to them. Keep you posted of course.

I'd like to thank all you guys for sharing what you know, it's appreciated. I don't get to shoot my 16" 44 Wrangler nearly as much as I want, but haven't had a single problem with it using Specials to 300 gr JSP's. It shoots better than I do, and is lots of fun. Reading these posts has me wanting a good '92 more than ever.......

Tumbleweed:

Where is that Doc Holiday's? There used to be a guy that posted under the name of Doc Holiday in the Marlin Talk forum. He was an incredibly knowledgable contributor.

Paul

The 1979 vintage Marlin 1894 .44 mag. I recently bought that wouldn't feed is with Marlin now. They told me it would cost about $56, including shipping, to repair it. Probably just needed a cleaned out mag tube or something simple like that. Oh well, live and learn. I should have it back any day now and I expect it will run just great.

Can't beat that price with a stick! Please let us know how it shoots when you get it back.
The 1979 vintage Marlin 1894 .44 mag. I recently bought that wouldn't feed is with Marlin now. They told me it would cost about $56, including shipping, to repair it. Probably just needed a cleaned out mag tube or something simple like that. Oh well, live and learn. I should have it back any day now and I expect it will run just great.

The problem with my 1976 model is still not been solved, but the guntechs(smiths?) at Numerick gun parts have exchanged e-mail with me and even called Marlin in order to diagnose the problem with it. So far a new carrier has not solved the jamming problem, nor has extensive adding metal then removing it slowing in order to get the perfect shape. Marlin suggests that a new lever and checking the carrier rocker spring and replacing it if it's worn or broken will fix the problem, and the new style carrier will work with no feeding or jamming problems. I hope so, as it's been 8 months since the "Marlin" jam became so bad it was only a single shot rifle! I took my time refinishing the stock, which now has about 7 coats of Tru-oil on it, revealing the beauty of the wood, and that took about 3 months. Not that I was working on it day and night, just whenever I had some time. Refinishing the stocks and even buying a slimmer forend or reshaping it yourself makes a world of difference in both the looks and feel of the rifle, and puts it in line with the Winchester stocks.
So far the feeding/jamming problems are caused when the rear of the carrier does not come up far enough to get the new shell in line with the barrel, and the bolt comes forward on it and can't push it into the barrel due to the angle. That's why the folks at Marlin think the carrier rocker spring is weak or broken and that the lever had been improperly polished or shaped before I owned it. If you do attempt to radius the snail shaped cam on the lever (1894 models only) yourself in order to preclude the so called Marlin Jam, do it carefully and slowly, as you can easily remove to much or shape it in the wrong way.

PS-putting in a Magic spring makes the action of the Marlin 1894 noticably smoother, and it's a good first start that most folks can do themselves if you're the least bit handy. If not, then your local gunsmith can just drop it in in a matter of minutes.

Marlin invented the .444 as a long-cased .44 Mag to fix the (then disapppointing) performance of the .44 Mag as a lever action cartridge.
As you'll see in the Cartridge comparisons (way down below ...), a Standard 240 gr Rem in the 1894 doesn't even come close to the performance of a modern, 340 gr .44 Mag load in a 5-1/2" RedHawk !!!

But, a standard 1894 can not cycle a Heavy (longer) .44 Mag Stopper, i.e., cycle Commercial .44 Mag ammo that feeds/functions in more robust hanguns such as the RedHawk.

My goal, 2 years ago, was an 1894 wish list idea that came true 2 weeks ago.
Be able to:
1) Cycle the Heavy (long) .44 Mag ammo that feeds RedHawks.
2) Stabilize Heavy (long) .44 Mag bullets i.e., the slow (1:38") twist of a Standard .44 Mag 1894 can not stabilize a 350 gr bullet.

David R. Clay finished/shipped my converted 1894 2 weeks ago.
I spent Sunday (10/3) at the range beginning Break-In.
I call this new beauty the 1894DRC.

Here's some of the changes performed by Dave:
1) Long (Heavy) .44 Mag cartridges reliably cycle thru this reworked Lever Action.
2) A 1:26", 22" Badger Heavy Octagon barrel. Ernie Stallman (Badger) picked a 1:26" twist about 2 years ago when this project started.
3) A TakeDown action ... a common 19th century feature, makes cleaning/transport easier.
4) Full-length, heavy-walled (3x the Marlin tube thickness) mag tube. Stainless Steel magazine follower.
5) A magazine Lock allows the magazine to be loaded then "locked" while the Barrel is separated from the Receiver: no need to use the Loading Gate.
6) Ashley GhostRing sight.

While this 1894DRC project was progressing, Tim Sundles (Buffalo Bore) developed (just released) his high performance .44 Mag +P+ cartridge.
This cartridge employs a custom, gas-checked, 340 gr bullet with a unique ogive/shape that helps minimize bullet length.
Dave Clay (Texas) lives near Ashley Emerson and, Ashley had some of Tim's preproduction .44 Mag +P+ cartridges.
Ashley put 5 rounds of .44 Mag +P+ thru my 1894DRC after initial sight-in using Garrett 330 gr.
The 5, .44 Mag +P+ rounds made a tight (under 3/4") "C" pattern at 50 yds ... as Dave says, "Ashley is down right scary" w/ his GhostRing sights.
This is also a testimony to Dave Clay and Ernie Stallman since, these were the first shots thru a brand new TakeDown Action and Barrel !!!

Prior to starting Break-In last Sunday (10/3), I thoroughly cleaned all Lead from the Badger. That is, since Ernie Stallman recommends using Jacketed bullets during Break-In (see his site) I first had to remove the Lead from Ashley's initial testing. Since only Hard Cast Lead (Buffalo Bore and Garrett) had been used by Ashley during his initial 11 shots, I was surprised to find a very blue green first patch! I talked this over with Dave and found that he had fired one (1) Jacketed 180 gr round to see if the Badger could stabilize short (180 gr) bullets. We came to the conclusion my very blue green first patch must have been the remains of gas checks(!) ... Tim's 340's and Garrett's (experimental) 330's. BTW, I cleaned out the Lead and the Copper using an 18-hour soak in Wipe-Out ... an odorless white foam. Concerning Lead, Wipe-Out breaks down components of the lead alloy such as tin and antimony. This allows the lead to flake-up and comes out as tiny black flakes.

I'll soon post all my Oehler 35P velocity readings from Sunday (10/3) but, that initial Break-In session had 3 goals.
I'd like to focus this first report on (below) goal 3 since, goal 3 is the reason behind this 2 year development, i.e.,
Cycle/Stabilize the same Heavy (long) .44 Mag ammo that can feed RedHawks but, not Standard 1894's.
That is, run the same high performance ammo in my RedHawk and 1894DRC.
Then, compare high performance .44 Mag +P+ results to 45-70, .444 and 30-06.

These were my 3 goals for that first range session:
1) Compare 7-1/2" Super BlackHawk velocity to 22" Badger velocity.
2) Run 4 types of Jacketed ammo
a) 180 gr Federal JHP
b) 240 gr Federal JHP
c) 240 gr PMC TCSP
d) 300 gr Buffalo Bore JFN (Speer bullet)
3) Compare .44 Mag +P+ results to 45-70, .444 and 30-06.

The 1894DRC, 340 gr .44 Mag +P+ result is:
1700 fps ... 35.4 Taylor KO ... 2180 ft-lbs
1400 fps ... 29.2 Taylor KO ... 1480 ft-lbs ... 100 yds (guess!).

The Standard 45-70, 405 gr is:
1250 fps ... 33.1 Taylor KO ... 1405 ft-lbs
950 fps ... 25.2 Taylor KO ... 810 ft-lbs ... 100 yds (guess!).

The Standard .444, 240 gr is:
2350 fps ... 34.6 Taylor KO ... 2940 ft-lbs
1820 fps ... 26.7 Taylor KO ... 1760 ft-lbs ... 100 yds.

The Standard 30-06, 180 gr is:
2700 fps ... 21.4 Taylor KO ... 2910 ft-lbs
2510 fps ... 19.9 Taylor KO ... 2520 ft-lbs ... 100 yds.

The 5-1/2" RedHawk, 340 gr .44 Mag +P+ is:
1400 fps ... 29.2 Taylor KO ... 1480 ft-lbs
1100 fps ... 22.9 Taylor KO ... 910 ft-lbs ... 100 yds (guess!).

The 1894DRC, 240 gr Standard Rem result is:
1480 fps ... 21.8 Taylor KO ... 1170 ft-lbs
1180 fps ... 17.4 Taylor KO ... 740 ft-lbs ... 100 yds (guess!).

Preliminary conclusions ... this 1894DRC experiment has been worth the time and effort.
In comparisons with 45-70, .444 and 30-06, looks like Hog, Deer and Black Bear can be taken out to 100 yds with this 1894DRC / .44 Mag +P+ combo.


Bill

sounds like you had a lot of work done and it was worth it. Glad it all turned out for you.

mattpair,sounds like you had a lot of work done and it was worth it. Glad it all turned out for you.Took about 2 years, I agree this was worth the effort :D

Now Breaking-In this 1894DRC Badger barrel and TakeDown action like I did my 1895DRC ... in this case, 150 rounds of 300 gr JFN ... 300 gr because the Break-In needs to go beyond the (usual) 270 gr upper limit of a standard Marlin .44 Mag twist (1:38") to show this faster twist (1:26") stabilizes heavy bullet weights ... Jacketed because Ernie Stallman of Badger recommends thatz the best way to fire-lap-finish his hand-lapped barrels in preparation for Hard Cast Lead bullets. Since I did the first 20 shots the hard way, I now Take-Down the action every 5 shots to clean, i.e., the Receiver/Barrel joint also needs Break-In.

But, waiting for Break-In to end so I can finally shoot those new, 340 gr, Buffalo Bore .44 Mag +P+.

Bill

Bill, What length barrel does the DRC have?

This has been an excellent debate so far, but you guys are leaving out an important contender that deserves more attention.

Henry Big Boy 44 mag/45 Colt


Big Boy .44 Magnum
Model: H006
Action Type: Lever
Caliber:
.44 Mag /.44 Special

Capacity: 10 rounds
Barrel Length:
20'' octagonal with 1:38rh rate of twist

Length: 38 1/2'' Overall
Weight: 8.68 lbs.
Stock:
Straight-grip American walnut

Sights:
Adjustable Marble semi-buckhorn rear with white diamond insert and brass beaded front sight

Finish:
Solid top brass receiver, brass buttplate and brass barrel band

Price: $775.00*

Is there anyone else on this board aside from myself that ownes one of these rifles?

Bill, What length barrel does the DRC have?
Charlie,
My particular Marlin 1894DRC has a 24" Badger Octagon.
This Marlin 1894 has gone thru a TakeDown Conversion and a barrel replacement. As such, the choice of barrel length was mine. I chose 24" because I wanted maximum velocity from those (see up above) 340gr Buffalo Bore loads.

Bill

I am the proud owner of a Henry Big Boy .44. My son knew that I wanted a Henry and he got one for me for my birthday this year. It is by far the best rifle I own. Others are Mod. 760 Rem .06 and .308 pump [southpaw] and a Springfield .06 Sportsman 78 bolt Rt. Hand. I'm not that big and the .44 mag. was scary at first due to the possible kick. There practically isn't any. I can compare it to my Browning 12 ga. from Belgium. The action works better than the others mentioned, smoother trigger and just the best American manufactured gun period. By the way have I mentioned that in all tests the Henry matched up against the competitors and the Henry won hands down.