Is it any worse than the 12ga I shoot with 1 1/8 oz for sporting clays or say a 30-06 with 180 grains?thanks sj

sjones;

That depends on the rifle and the load. I believe, that in my Marlin 1895ss, with a 1.5x4.5 power compact scope in conventional low mounts, using either Remington 300grain or 405 grain factory loads, the anwser is no. To me, this rifle recoils less than a Remington 760 Pump Rifle I once had, with a scope mounted, using 180 grain Remington 30-06 factory loads.

The Marlin can be used with reloads that are substantially more powerful than factory loads. That is when it starts to hurt. My reloads do not exceed factory levels. However, I do not frequent areas that contain large dangerous animals, so I do not feel the need for more powerful ammunition.

I'll bet a Dixie arms repilca Trapdoor Carbine, in 45-70, with factoy loads of any kind kicks as hard, or harder than most single shot 12 guage shotguns. Maybe some day I'll buy one and find out.

Take care. Sean

Is it any worse than the 12ga I shoot with 1 1/8 oz for sporting clays or say a 30-06 with 180 grains?thanks sj

No, depending on load. Now here's something that might surprise you. My 525gr load kicks a lot less than the 350gr loads folks are pushing up over 1800fps. It kicks a lot less than those loads.

My load is so pleasant to shoot you can plink with it. I think it kicks like your 12ga from my guide gun, which has a good recoil pad. The same load in my 1895 will bruise you. I think it kicks about like 220gr from a 30-06. But that's just me. My daughter shoots my load in my guide gun, she's a wee lassie, and she hits what she shoots at.

So it's a combination of the gun and the ammo, and the shooter. The others who have tried my loads, about half dozen people, all say they are surprised at how easy they are to shoot. And they all get good downrange results. It's a win, win, win in my book.

The thing that surprises me is the massive penetration, and the fact that the bullet doesn't tear up venison, something I checked out closely.

That said, I won't let my wife shoot it because she is recoil sensitive and I don't want her to be jumpy. She is a good shot with her guns and doesn't need to shoot anything else to be satisfied.

Also, you can shoot factory ammo, the factory 405gr load is a "hmmm, is that all there is?" experience, for the shooter. But don't underestimate the effect of a bullet that weighs twice the average bullet weights that are most commonly used. Slow moving heavy bullets are battering rams, they are field artillary, they are hammers.

AND THEY ARE FUN.

Regards,
Grizz

Is it any worse than the 12ga I shoot with 1 1/8 oz for sporting clays or say a 30-06 with 180 grains?thanks sj

In a word - YES.

My unlarded Guide Gun weigh 7lbs. My 405gr @1800fps load generates recoil equivalent to a .375H&H 270gr @2700 out of the common 9+lb rifle. My 12ga Mossberg "rattle gun" is over 8lbs

Is the recoil manageable? Yes. It just requires proper gun mounting technique.

To put it in perspective, about 30% more recoil than a heavy 12ga load and 2X the recoil of the ole '06.

A lot of lever guns have stocks that aren't really well designed for recoil management (and the Ruger #3 has an even worse reputation). My .444 is not too bad... but it has a good recoil pad and fortunately fits me pretty well. Still, you know when you've touched a load off! My .30-06 has had the stock cut exactly for me with a good recoil pad and I don't find it unpleasant at all, although I shoot 165gr. bullets not 180s.

With shotguns.... I used to think they did not kick bad, till I shot one off the bench one day to pattern it. Ouch! They are a lot easier to shoot standing up, that's for sure.

Like the man said "they are a lot easier to shoot standing up". Got a buddy who's nick name is Fat Billy. Need I elaberate why he's called that? Anyways I had great fun letting him shoot my 45/70 loaded with a 425gr bullet and 52 grns of IMR 3031. Wish I had a slow motion camera to replay and watch his jowls shake from the shock wave. Coundn't make him understand DON'T LEAN INTO IT. Like a boxer who leads with his head your gonna get hit hard! Role with the punch and you shound't loose your teeth!