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  #1  
Old 12-24-2003, 08:22 AM
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Imported Ammo


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My Wolf Ammo post sparked this idea. In general there is a lot of cheap imported ammo, The big manufactures are Wolf and Silver Bear, but has anyone ever used any other the other stuff like military surplus or stuff from different com-bloc countrys. I've seen plenty of stuff from places like Czech Republic ( the one in the toothpaste green box)and Romania or all those countries. Anyone ever use this stuff. Is it any good, I didn't get a chance to see all of it because it was behind the counter so I didn't ask but are they still steel case and have the water proofing seals. Just in general how is this ammo and how does it shoot.
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  #2  
Old 12-24-2003, 01:39 PM
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Most all of it is military surplus, it is what it is. Most is berdan primed and not reloadable, several types are steel cased and laquer coated, not the best for semi autos. I always assume its corrosive. Reliability ranges from being marginal to very good. The Korean 30.06 fires well but is dirty and inconsistent, the Danish 30.06 has an excellent reputation, the Turk 8mm reportedly does well, the Russian 7.62x54 works well also. The Czech ammo is always good but sometimes a little on the hot side. Provided the gun is in good shape and the ammo stored correctly it should be good for target use. Don't expect any super accuracy but the condition of the gun also is a factor. I would have no problem shooting any of it in my military guns but would not use it in my AR or civilian firearms although some shooters do without problems.

rk
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  #3  
Old 12-24-2003, 08:36 PM
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I agree with RoadKill. This stuff was made by different countries as cheaply as possible and put into storage for years waiting for war. Now they consider it too old and obsolete for use. So they sell it cheap. It is good for plinking and playing with in your Mil Surp guns. If you want to put new sights or a scope on one, this stuff is good for starting to sight it in.
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  #4  
Old 12-24-2003, 08:43 PM
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What about sellier and bellot ammo?
Any comments?

For just target shooting would you all reccomend sellier and bellot or spending the extra $60 every 1000rnds for UMS remington?
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  #5  
Old 12-24-2003, 08:53 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 99GrandTouring
What about sellier and bellot ammo?
Any comments?

For just target shooting would you all reccomend sellier and bellot or spending the extra $60 every 1000rnds for UMS remington?
I have had good results with S&B. In my 8mm VZ47/24 Mauser it shoots great. The 196gr Edge Cutters are dead on at 100 yards with open sights. I just wished they used different bullets than what they do. I Africa last July, I used my 8mm as my back up gun with the S&B ammo. My PH borrowed it to go after a large Warthog he wanted. It worked, but the bullets fragmented to much. Not good pentration at all.
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Old 12-24-2003, 09:13 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by density1
I have had good results with S&B. In my 8mm VZ47/24 Mauser it shoots great. The 196gr Edge Cutters are dead on at 100 yards with open sights. I just wished they used different bullets than what they do. I Africa last July, I used my 8mm as my back up gun with the S&B ammo. My PH borrowed it to go after a large Warthog he wanted. It worked, but the bullets fragmented to much. Not good pentration at all.

So in your opinion you would say sellier and bellot is a decently accurate ammo?
I want to find as inexpensive ammo as possible but something to where I'm just learning that the ammo is acurate enough for me to learn...
(meaning that the bullets aren't consisten and I don't know if its me, the gun, or the ammo, do you know what I'm trying to say?)
Thanks!
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Old 12-24-2003, 09:32 PM
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Yes, for it's price, it is a decently accurate cartridge, to say the least. it is definitely better than mil surp ammo. It is made in the Chzech republic by an old ammo maker. It is brass cased and boxer primed. Non corrosive stuff.
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  #8  
Old 12-25-2003, 01:21 PM
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Surplus ammo

S&B is a level or two above the rest, clean, non corrosive, excellent quality control. But then the Czechs have never made junk in firearms or ammo. If anything the Czech ammo is a little hotter than the rest, might just be that its cleaner. Before I started reloading .32s I fired it in my PP, always did very well but with noticeably more recoil than other brands.

rk
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  #9  
Old 12-26-2003, 01:18 PM
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I've seen other post's saying that S&B produces alot of smoke? what is your all's opinion?
I shoot at and indoor range and really need a smokeless type cartridge...
THanks!
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  #10  
Old 12-26-2003, 02:02 PM
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My comments on S&B ammo were from some stuff I fired a few years back. It may be different now... apparently people aren't seeing this at the present time. Try a box.... that's probably the best advice I can offer.
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  #11  
Old 12-28-2003, 07:43 AM
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S&B is indeed a cut above the rest, except in the 7.62X39 Barnaul wins over ALL hands down. This is Russian ammo and steel cased non-corrosive. It comes in FMJ, HP and SP configurations. Velocities are high and consistent, powder is clean and the HP and SP ammo is deadly on game.

If one is to use an AK or SKS, the best choice for hunting ammo is the HP as it does not deform on the tip like all SP ammo. I my tests the HP expands to .753 inches in clay media. Velocity averaged 2485 fps in a 20 inch SKS.

Another discovery is that cheap 223 ammo can be had in mil boxes pf 20 from Federal in LAKE CITY brass for $4.50 a box. This is very hot 55 gr FMJBT that clocks 3378 fps from a single shot 22 inch bbl, 3288 fps in a 20 inch AR, and 3060 in a 16.5 inch AR. When sorted by COL, it is sub MOA in every 223 barrel I have.
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  #12  
Old 12-28-2003, 08:20 AM
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Other people have differnt needs, but I burn up lost of the imported cheap mil.spec. ammo in mil.spec. rifles; it's what it was made for. SKS, AK, FAL, CETME, most bolt guns in full military trim work fine with it. REGUARDLESS of what the importer claims, it does no harm to treat it all like it was corrosive, and clean accordingly.

But I won't hunt with it...won't expect it to shoot MOA groups...and won't feed it to rifles/handguns that don't like it.

Burned up a couple of cases of Russian 9MM, seveal cases of 7.62X39, and some 8MM and .303. The worse of the lot was some bright shinny Eqyptian brass cased 9mm...filthy beyond belief, malignantly corrosvie, and prone to splitting cases...incompaison to that stuff, the Wolf is pure gold.
(Was told later the exporter was making the ammo look pretty by rolling 10,000 found batches in a cement truck full of saw dust...kind of a giant rock tumbler).

SOme guns that work fine with every known US made ammo just flat won't work with it...when a gun gags on ball ammo, you'd normally suspect the gun. WHen a gun ONLY gags on one type of ammo, you've pretty well got to suspect the ammo. In this case, believe the different expansion/contraction character of a steel case is part of the problem.

Other pistols (and revovlers) shoot the 9mm just fine. Do I losae sleep over the pick-and-choose nature of functioning? Nope, just burn it in the guns that work with it.

Last edited by ribbonstone; 12-28-2003 at 08:26 AM.
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  #13  
Old 12-28-2003, 08:27 AM
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The cheap stuff works fine in my MAK90, but the AR will choke on it, this is the steel cases ammo from a variety of mfgs in .223. The cheap stuff also works well in my SKS, this is also the steel cased ammo. It seems that the cheap 7.62x39 doesn't work to well in US made 7.62x39 rifles, such as the Mini-30, according to one poster here.
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