Nope. Not upset at all. My only complain was the broad brush being used by certain posters.

Because I didn't propose any. I posed some questions.

You're right, and I agree. This thread was intended to be nothing more than an echo chamber... serious discussion was never the intent. I will take your implied advice and leave it.

Actually... it's not too ironic... liberals are about liberties and rights... just not the ones that you like and, likely, the ones that you want to stop/prevent/outlaw.

I rejoined the thread because I thought the moderation would set things back on track. It hasn't and didn't.

And with that, I'm done. Continue with your echo chamber. I hope it brings you much enjoyment. I'm sure it will reinforce your bias/opinions that liberals don't want to talk about stuff or whatever fits your world view.

You need truth, Shane.

And, you are indeed talking in circles. In reading some of your first posts from today, I began to wonder why you were arguing in the first place. However, as the posts continued and frustration grew, you became the moderate/liberal that I believe you are.

Look, when someone said choose one side or the other, you responded, in essence, that it cannot be done. THAT's the problem - failure to choose a side. It can be done. One side limits, the other empowers. That doesn;t mean you have to follow in lockstep, but that you have to have some committment on a basic issue. Otherwise you risk being a middle of the road guy, wafting back and forth on these important types of issues like the 2nd Amendment. That leads to doubt, not conviction. It leads to voting for ice cream, not what's good for the country.

You called Mike's claim that medical privacy is not what it's cracked up to be "specious". That's pretty bold.

SPECIOUS: Plausible, but false. Based on pretense. Deceptively pleasing.

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Stretch ®

"If you are a reloader and you don't know Lee, you don't know Jack" - Floydster

DON'T BE SCARED©

Because you can't refute the evidence that the liberal faction in this country is trying to take our gun / self defense rights away?

Just not the right to keep and bear arms - at least not the overwhelming majority of liberals. Because if they were, we would never have had a the crop of anti-gun candidates for the democratic party that we did in 2008 at the national level. Remember, we aren't talking about other rights in this thread (at least as best as I could steer it back on track).

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MikeG

One more thing, and them I'm done. I never claimed otherwise. I have no reason to attempt to refute something that I never claimed in the first place. You're trying to make me refute something that I never said and then you get worked up when I don't try to refute it... saying I'm "talking in circles". Enjoy the rest of your conversation. Perhaps someone else will come along and entertain you.

You don't like that we pointed out that liberals are leading the charge to take away our 2a rights. That's why you joined the thread. You couldn't refute the proposition, so you talked in circles around it rather than admit the obvious truth. If you can't admit the truth, and you are tired of talking in circles, then by all means move on.

Next liberal to challenge the proposition.... step right up!

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MikeG

OK... one more time. I did not join for that reason. I joined because I'm pro-2A and wanted to discuss what we could do, using existing laws to better effect, instead of more regulation and/or bans. I never refuted, attempted to refute, or intended to refute your "proposition". Go back and read my posts. You're an admin, you probably have access to them. Show where I said even ONE time that liberals weren't trying to enact regulations or bans. I dare you.

What I objected to was the trash like "all liberals are commies" type comments (whatever it was... I can't even remember now exactly what it was and it isn't even important) and I spoke my mind about them saying that comments like those are not conducive to real discussion... it just starts elementary school style name calling fights. You guys then took it as all kinds of other stuff... putting the words YOU wanted to hear from my mouth into my mouth and then accuse me of "talking in circles" when I don't try to refute what you wanted me to say.

You aren't interested in discussion. You just want someone to sit around the campfire with you saying "yeah, them dang libruhls is teh debil" and you can all go on being happy with yourselves. Well... you got it now... let's sit around and just say over and over "them dang libruhl's is the debil"... can we throw in a round of Kumbaya in the last few posts?

"them dang libruhl's is the debil"
"them dang libruhl's is the debil"
"them dang libruhl's is the debil"
"them dang libruhl's is the debil"

If all you wanted was someone to say "Yeah, liberals are anti-gun", this thread could have been over with a single post, although it wouldn't serve the purpose of your desires of an echo chamber.

I'll even grant your heart's greatest desire... and you can quote me on it:
Yup. Democrats and liberals are trying to pass more regulations and maybe even bans on firearms, restricting our rights set forth in 2A.

That makes this thread over 8 pages too long and really just kinda worthless from the start.

Now... if you want to have actual worthwhile and useful discussion sometime instead of just confirmation of the obvious and an echo chamber, let me know and I might rejoin you.

Funny, but I'm the only one in this thread that I have seen you use that term with before this post, so I feel safe in deducing here that you are referring to me again.

Kind of lame really since I have said pretty much the same thing as Mike, and every other pro gun person in this thread. Why then, my posts are labeled as "painting with a broad brush" is rather confusing.

How many times are you going to make this statement? Should I go get a cold drink and some popcorn.

Attached Images

 

I'll make it one more time... You should go get a cold drink and some popcorn. Since you asked nicely...

Nope, I was making a general statement. You weren't the only one doing it. If that's how it came across, I apologize. I wasn't meaning to single you out.

Shane, nobody needs to go back and "read" all your posts. The fact is, you feel like you're taking a beating because of things you've posted. You weren;t just picked out of the ring of guys around a campfire. No....it's your posts, your statements, your own claims, that lead to these types of arguements.

But you can't be pro 2nd Amendment and yet still take a liberal view of what's happening. It can;t work - they are two opposing forces. If a man says he's pro 2nd AMendment, but wants to "strengthen what's already on the books", well, there's some of the problem right there. But even that's an aside, becasue this thread is specifically about what Liberals have done, say they'll do, and act on what they say they'll do, regarding limitations (and eventually an outright annulment) of the 2nd Amendment.

SEE the thread for what it really is, and don;t read too much more into it.

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Stretch ®

"If you are a reloader and you don't know Lee, you don't know Jack" - Floydster

DON'T BE SCARED©

Here's where the liberals give us hearburn with double talk:

Just not the right to keep and bear arms - at least not the overwhelming majority of liberals. Because if they were, we would never have had a the crop of anti-gun candidates for the democratic party that we did in 2008 at the national level. Remember, we aren't talking about other rights in this thread (at least as best as I could steer it back on track).

Actually, I like all of the rights in the Bill of Rights, by the way.

And the double-talk from the left regarding our 2A rights IS what the thread is about. You're claiming liberals are about rights ... but what does that mean when you can pick and choose the "right of the day?" ... can you please go amend that statement to specifically exclude the right to keep and bear arms. Something like: "Liberals are (mostly) about liberties and rights that they agree with at the time, and (mostly) against rights that they don't agree with at the time, like the right to keep and bear arms, which has long been out of fashion on the left."

And that's were I'm trying to get folks' heads out of the sand, to understand that our current crop of liberal leadership, whom they may have even voted for, is against their right to keep and bear arms. And that, apparently, is a sore subject for the few remaining liberals who actually do favor the right to keep and bear arms.

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MikeG

I can't send you a PM so I have to reply here.

Perhaps you will find one of those to answer your questions, then, but not likely on this forum since one of them (the ones that hate guns and are anti-gun) will not likely be on this forum. I'm not one of those overwhelming majority of liberals so I cannot answer your questions.

I'm a liberal and I am pro-2A. I never made the statement that all liberals are pro all rights... that would be as false a statement as saying all conservatives/Republicans are pro all rights.

No one's head is in the sand on this. Why do you think anyone would deny it? Have you seen the news in the past few weeks? (probably not... you probably only watch FoxNews! ZING! I kid, I kid )

Shane, here's part of the BIG problem with the left, by no means am I saying some on the right don't do it as well, but it's really bad and much worse on the other side of the aile and this is why I keep saying Hypocrisy and Double Standard. See the link

Anti-Gun Illinois State Senator Gets Caught with Pistol at O

Originally Posted by MikeG
Just not the right to keep and bear arms - at least not the overwhelming majority of liberals.



My opinion is you're incorrect about people's "level of awareness". Aware via the media headlines there' is a debate about firearm control, but unaware of accurate information...certainly not via the news media! Ignorance and apathy is relatively prevalent and Mike is trying to address that issue. Reading all of your responses, you've made no contribution to that well intended effort.

But you folks do play great football, suggest you stick to your strengths? I kid, I kid

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DOK

Too funny. Thanks for the link. It sure backs up what we've been saying about liberals (especially politicians and so called news commentators) in this thread with their "do as I say, not as I do" attidue." or the idea that "I'm better than everyone else and more imporatnt too, so I need a a guy with a gun to protect me" ) See the thread on the potus about him signing a new ex order to allow him and his wife future lifetime protection by SS agents armed with what?...............GUNS.

Dan, it's sad, but there are a bunch of gun owners with their heads in the sand, or worse. I wouldn't waste my time trying to educate the left, the purpose of the thread is to show the dangers and the mentality we are dealing with. I think it's a success, even if most of it could be summarized in a few sentences.

I have some friends who care nothing about guns. They have hot-button issues and vote whichever way the wind is blowing on those issues. Hey, it's their priorities, they can do as they please. They are honest about what is important to them.

I have other friends (a married couple) who are supporters of the current administration on many levels. The strange thing was, as soon as the election was over - the first thing they did was run out and buy guns! Maybe they knew what was coming, I don't know. Anyway, they have their issues that are more important to them than 2A, and they prioritize, I can respect that. Heck we go to the range together. I'm not going to try to change their mind and it's too late, anyway.

Fred, thanks for the link. Needed a laugh but at the same time it's scary the mentality that comes when people get in power.... that they deserve the 'rights' that they would so gladly take away from us little people.

I'm not holding out any hope for the Austin city council. That is a bunch of fruit loops, plain and simple, and it's going to be that way as long as Austin has at large council seats. The left rigged it that way so you have to be one of them to get on the council.

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MikeG

Mike, I've got to say that you and the other posters involved in this long thread showed a great deal of restraint. You could tell where this was headed when it started, but I admire all of your efforts.
it''s hard to communicate with closed minds," when they haven't been mugged yet"
We've got a long battle ahead of us!

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Throw another log on the fire

"...liberals are about liberties and rights."

The right to tell me what kind of gas can I have to buy, the toilet I have to use, the light bulb I have to use, the kind of car or truck I have to buy, the health insurance I must buy and the care I can receive, the kind of guns and ammunition I can and can't buy,....there is no end to the "liberty" the liberals are blessing me with.

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"Had his shooting been as good as his running, he might have given a better account of himself."
James. C. Henderson

I'll fully admit I haven't read every response in this thread, I've just scaned about half of it, so I really don't know how far this thread has drifted off course. But...

Any of the "Liberals" I have known are just for the most part ignorant of firearms. They don't own firearms, they don't shoot firearms, they fear firearms. All they know of firearms is what they hear about on the six o'clock news. So it's no wonder all they think firearms are good for is killing and robbing people.

I for one feel sorry for them, as long as they are not proud, or blissful in their ignorance. I've shown at least three very politically liberal people that there is more to firearms and firearm ownership then what they have been told or brainwashed into thinking by their equally ignorant friends.

Whether or not you agree with a "liberal" when it comes to political, or fiscal issues is one thing, but under the right circumstances you can educate a liberal, and even convert a few when it comes to firearms.

Simply put, they just don't know any better... Just my humble opinion.

BTW... Liberals mostly seem to fall in love with scoped semi automatic .22rf rifles, at least that has been my experience anyway. So, take a liberal shooting... if you don't convert them they're good for a laugh at least. That is if you can get them to go.