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  #1  
Old 02-12-2004, 05:11 AM
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bedding a model 70 w/ wooden stock


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This is a continuation from "model 70 stock, removing and reinstalling stock" discussion in the rifles section.

After finally removing the stock on my Winchester M70 XTR Featherweight (83") I found it to be factory bedded around the recoil block w/ a brownish glue like compound size on size to the block. This accounts for the difficulty in removing the stock and I would like to re bed the original wooden stock w/ either brownell's metal bedding compound or their "adjustible pillar" system which they say is suitable for wooden or synthetic stocks.

Any conventional wisdom on traditional rifle bedding techniques Vs a pillar system? Bottom line I want to correct the lack of clearance around the recoil block so that I have around .001" cl to the front, side, and bottom of the recoil block but maintain contact with the back of the block to the bedding compound and I might as well do the whole thing right if I am going to correct this area.\

Thanks
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Old 02-12-2004, 11:22 AM
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Very simple to add the required clearance.

Put a one or two layers of vinyl electrical tape anywhere you would like some clearance. Trim off the excess. Cover the tape with your release agent so the epoxy won't stick to it.

Bed the action, then when the epoxy is dry, free-float the barrel. That should go a long way toward solving the problems you had.
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Old 02-12-2004, 03:04 PM
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Like Mike said, pretty simple to do. That brownish stuff is most probably an epoxy bedding compound. It will have to be removed to put the Brownell's bedding compound in, anyway.

The directions provided by Brownell's is pretty clear. The kit comes with about everything you need to get it mixed up and slathered in. I've never used their supplied release agent - found the old Johnson's hard wax in a can for auto's is the best release agent you can find (old Wyoming gunsmith taught me that one). Any paste car wax will work, just let it dry somewhat before installing the barreled action. Be sure to rough up the inside of the stock so the epoxy can get a good bite on the wood.
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  #4  
Old 02-13-2004, 09:36 PM
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Thank you for the tips but I am still trying to get opinions on brownell's adjustable pillar bedding system Vs their traditional epoxy bedding. Is one system better than the other?
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  #5  
Old 02-14-2004, 03:00 PM
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If your looking at the diffrence between the two types of bedding You can do either one or both on your rifle.
The piller bedding is to put a tube of auluinmin between the reicever and the floorplate This prevents the action screws from compressing the stock and any normal wood swelling from afecting the rifle.
The glass bedding is to provide a exact fit around the recoil lug and bottom of the reicver and the stock.
I have a Win 70 classic that i put on a faigen stock several years ago the stock was piller-bedded at faigen and i glass-bedded the action wit a brownells kit. It shoots great and hasn't changed point of impact in 5 years.
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Old 02-14-2004, 06:49 PM
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I haven't seen a huge difference when bedding hunting rifles for big game. In theory the pillar bedding should be most stable, however in my experience if you free-float the barrel and seal the inside of the stock well, it should shoot reasonably well and the point of impact should not move with the change in seasons.
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  #7  
Old 02-15-2004, 09:02 AM
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Both points well taken. It is a versitile hunting rifle and not a competition target rifle. I agree that free floating the barrel and a combination of pillar bedding that maintains .030 to .040 epoxy bedding between the top of the pillars and conventional bedding epoxy with aluminum filler would be the all out best way to go. At the same time I know that I have some contact point w/ the barrel so free floating would go a long way to improving the accuracy without a lot of time and expense.
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Old 02-21-2004, 01:26 PM
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idzombie, I thought that I would throw at you a couple of thoughts, One is piller bedding is better for harder recoiling cartridges, that aids in keeping a wood stock from cracking in the tang a recoil lug areas, and from compressing the wood under the trigger guard, not so necessary with synthetic's. Now as for glass bedding, Industry Standard is that you free float heavy barrels and fully glass bed light barrels in wood stocks. In a light barrel it tends to heat up faster and will start to move off zero with quick repeated shots. Also if the barrel channel is routed out to the sides and under the barrel and filled with glass bedding it will keep the wood from being affected by the weather and temp. and humidity and will hold the barrel in position to help keep your zero. because the glass bedding is much stronger than wood and is not affected by these. Here in Alaska we have a real problem with the weather and bedding does a lot to solve these problems. Good luck Bobby
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Last edited by Bobby; 02-21-2004 at 01:31 PM. Reason: need to add something
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Old 03-09-2004, 10:15 PM
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Originally Posted by Bobby
idzombie, I thought that I would throw at you a couple of thoughts, One is piller bedding is better for harder recoiling cartridges, that aids in keeping a wood stock from cracking in the tang a recoil lug areas, and from compressing the wood under the trigger guard, not so necessary with synthetic's. Now as for glass bedding, Industry Standard is that you free float heavy barrels and fully glass bed light barrels in wood stocks. In a light barrel it tends to heat up faster and will start to move off zero with quick repeated shots. Also if the barrel channel is routed out to the sides and under the barrel and filled with glass bedding it will keep the wood from being affected by the weather and temp. and humidity and will hold the barrel in position to help keep your zero. because the glass bedding is much stronger than wood and is not affected by these. Here in Alaska we have a real problem with the weather and bedding does a lot to solve these problems. Good luck Bobby
Thanks Bobby,

This all came about due to a very wet white tail deer hunt. This is a light barrel rifle in a wood stock but it would be a rare occasion that I had to cycle out 2 or 3 shots in a row (no big predators left down here in S. Texas save a occasional report of mountain lions that keep extremely low profiles). I am still leaning towards a combination of glass bedding w/ the pillars to keep the wood stock from compressing. I might even play around with carbon fiber tubes Vs aluminum if I can find them. As for the barrel I will stay with free floating.
I have heard of systems w/ extra bridges or support in the fore stock but I did not know that full bedding of the barrel was a option. Or did I miss understand and you are saying that the fore stock is routed out, bedded w/ the barrel wrapped in "clearance tap" to free float it and the epoxy is just to seal the wood?

Terry
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  #10  
Old 03-10-2004, 11:06 AM
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idsombie, You can free float the barrel with the barrel channel fully glassbedded, in fact I belive that is the best thing that you can do for your stock strength and for accurcy, because the bedding is stronger than wood and will not let the wood move with the effects of moisture and heat and such. I think that you will be pleased with the results of piller and glassbedding. Best wishes Bobby
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Old 03-22-2004, 09:17 PM
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idzombie -

Dunno if you're still following this thread, but for all who may read this:

Another approach is to full-length 'glas-bed the barrel and free-float the ACTION. Still must properly bed the recoil lug, of course.
No need for clamped-down rcvr screws, no prob w/minor changes due to humidity, etc.
Works just as "gooder" and, in the case of a restocking, can be easier for an inexperienced woodbutcher. :-)

A thought to ponder :
If humidity changes in a peice of wood can move a chunk of 1/2" or more STEEL around, d'you think will a few thou' of plastic (that's what the compounds are) will stop it?



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  #12  
Old 03-31-2004, 08:51 PM
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Brownells has several exceptional books on glass or steel bedding rifles. The glasbed or steelbed offers several times the strength of wood. When I glasbed Model 70s I usually bed the barrel channel full length. I use a radial arm saw and groove the barrel channel from the recoil lug to 1/2 inch from the end of the forarm 1/2 inch to 3/4 inch deep. If you want a free floated barrel wrap it with tape as above and see how it shoots. sometimes a gun shoots better with five to nine pounds of pressure on the end of the forearm Sometimes better free floated. I've found that grooving the forearm and bedding in the grooves along with the recoil lug and bedding in Brownells pillers give a wood stock exceptional ability to not warp the wood into the barrel. The wood warping into a barrell is one of the causes of poor accuracy. I piller bed both the front and back action screws so that there is a solid lock of aluminum and glassbed beween the floorplate and the action. If you do much horse hunting I also drill a 1/2 inch hole 12 inches deep from the back of the action into the buttstock and glasbed in a 3/8 by 11 inch steel rod. I have had a horse roll on the gun, break the wood stock, but the rod and glasbed held solid and I finished the hunt with that rifle. I did have to bend the stock back and put on some tape to keep the splinters out of my hand. It broke the scope, but the iron sights still were ok.

Good hunting
Bob
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  #13  
Old 03-31-2004, 09:29 PM
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Now, that's what I call a diehard hunter!

Thanks for the tip - all of them.
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