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  #1  
Old 09-06-2001, 03:59 PM
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This topic has probably been beaten to death already but what the heck.

I'm planning on adding another lever action rifle to my battery. I'm particularly fond of the Marlin 1894 short action. I already have an 1894 16" short rifle in .44 mag.

The new rifle is intended for target shooting, plinking fun and game in the lower 48 (pigs, black bear, deer, elk) at ranges of 125 yds or less.

My question is are there any REAL advantages to going with the .444 Marlin or 45-70 in a Marlin 1895 (G, SS or CB configuration) over an 1894 Cowboy in 45 LC loaded with 330g BTB bullets driven to around 1650 fps?

Thoughts?



(Edited by Stranger at 5:34 pm on Sep. 6, 2001)
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  #2  
Old 09-07-2001, 04:11 AM
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i have been loading hot .45 colt loads for years, my favorite load is a 260 grain JHP on top of 22 grains of 2400, it clocks at a little over 1600 fps out of my Win. 94 with the 20 inch barrel, someday i plan to try 300 grain bullets and work up a load. i think a hot loaded .45 colt has alot of potential, alot of shooters dismiss the .45 colt as being barely adequate, but folks who discount the .45 colt have never tried it and loaded for it, its a very impressive round, it will do ANYTHING the .44 magnum will do, and then some. check out www.sixgunner.com and read some of Paco Kellys articles on the .45 colt, you'll be impressed with what you find out.---------stranger, try the .45 colt in a carbine, you love it.   gutpile
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  #3  
Old 09-07-2001, 07:59 AM
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I am using a load of 19.5 grains of 2400 with a 300 grain bullet. I use a lee mold to cast them, with a gas check. This combo works great out of my Winchester 94 trapper. The Winchester action allows for longer overall length than the Marlin or Winchester 92. I have wanted to try H110 as I think I can get better velocity numbers from it, but haven't had time to work up another load.

Take Care
JuanTedman
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  #4  
Old 09-07-2001, 09:33 AM
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I agree that it does SEEM that a hot loaded, heavy weight 45LC from a rifle will do everything that the 45-70 will do in a smaller package and without the penalty of brutal recoil. That is, of course, if the ranges are less than 125 yds and the game menu doesn't include the biggest bruins.
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  #5  
Old 09-07-2001, 10:45 PM
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I got the Winchester 16.5" ranger, model 94.
I like it so far; the loads were 20 grains of 2400 over 250 grain cast flat points, and 255 swc.
Real accurate...
 Kicks from bench...    
I also think it is enough too, but still gives me an excuse for 45/70.  
 Has any one tried 20 grains of H110 over cast 250s?    
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  #6  
Old 09-08-2001, 03:28 AM
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Under optimum conditions yes it can work for all the game you mentioned if you're religious about your self-imposed range restriction. But even though some interesting numbers can be generated by a stiffly loaded .45 Colt carbine, it is still no better than a .454 Casull handgun. Another good and powerful round, but still a handgun. If you're limited in funds, get the 1894 as it will be cheaper and easier to shoot than the .45-70. But if you really want the job done under less than optimum conditions, the big .45 Government will be the better choice for game at the large end of the spectrum.


(Edited by Bill Lester at 3:49 pm on Sep. 8, 2001)
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  #7  
Old 09-08-2001, 04:08 AM
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i agree with Bill, the .45colt is a very good round and when loaded up to its potential, it becomes even better, out to 100 yards, a fat 300 gr. bullet, moving at 1600 fps delivers quite a bit of shock,  but its still a handgun round. if one were to use it for hunting, you would need to keep your shots to within 100 yards. just my humble opinion...gut
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  #8  
Old 09-08-2001, 06:41 PM
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Hey Guys,

I've been using a Marlin 336 in .35 Rem since 1971 and successfully taken both whitetail deer and blackbear with it.  My shots during that time range from 40 yards down to 24 feet.  Yep, I've passed on a fair number of shots, but I've never needed more than one round.

El Lobo in NM
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  #9  
Old 09-08-2001, 07:01 PM
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I think what enforces my yardage limit is that I can't bring myslef to mount a scope on a traditional lever action rifle (too ugly!) and I don't trust my eyes much beyond 100yds with iron sights or ghost rings.
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  #10  
Old 09-11-2001, 04:29 AM
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A warm loaded 45-70 will do 2300 plus with a cast 300 grain bullet. I like and own a 45 colt or two but 1600 vs 2300 or so aint exactly apples to apples. JS
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  #11  
Old 09-13-2001, 05:30 PM
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Howdy everyone,

Just  thought  I'd add a little friendly controversi (did I spell that right?).

I think you would agree that the old 45-70-350  black powder round (350 gr. bullet at 1,344 f.p.s.) is not a handgun round.  My .45 Colt Cowboy loves the 350 gr. Magma bullet or the original 350 gr. 45-70 bullet (457192) pushed by 20 grains of 296.  Velocity is 1,385 f.p.s. at about 30,000 p.s.i.  I call it my .45-70x1.28.

John
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  #12  
Old 09-13-2001, 08:54 PM
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I guess my point is...

If I don't mount a scope on the rifle then my max range will be 100 yds or so. At that range, the extra 500 fps that the 45-70 offers over the 45LC with bullets of similar weight and construction is NOT going to make one bit of difference to the game animal on the receiving end.

(Edited by Stranger at 9:55 pm on Sep. 13, 2001)
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  #13  
Old 09-14-2001, 05:59 AM
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Against deer, black bear and such, no they would probably never know the difference with a well-placed hit. On bigger stuff like moose, elk, grizzly, and certainly on less than optimum shots against same, I'd like the extra wallop of the .45-70 or 444. There isn't a .45 Colt that can launch 400-500+ grains of lead and that can be a significant difference.

I think the real question you should ask yourself is not .45 Colt 1984 vs. .45-70 1895? Rather it should be
"What would a .45 Colt carbine do my .44 Mag carbine already doesn't?"

Get the .45-70. It'll make you a happy hunter.
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  #14  
Old 09-14-2001, 08:17 AM
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Bill you make a good point and asked the right question. The 45-70 it is.
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  #15  
Old 02-17-2002, 04:22 PM
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45LC VS 45/70   YOURE KIDDING RIGHT?
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