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  #1  
Old 04-07-2007, 04:32 AM
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35 Rem and Elk?


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I have no experience hunting with the 35 Rem but a co worker who's headed for a trip to CO for elk hunting this fall asked me if his 35 Rem is enough for one (last year he used a 300 RUM). I told him it should be as long as he knows the range limitations. He said where they're hunting shots should be 100 yards or less and probably closer to 50 yards. I said it should do well esp with bullets like the 220 grn Buffalo Bore. He said he has some of the Hornady LeverEvolution. I thought they would work fine also. Any 35 Rem guys or elk hunters have any thoughts to add?
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  #2  
Old 04-07-2007, 05:14 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by M1Garand
I have no experience hunting with the 35 Rem but a co worker who's headed for a trip to CO for elk hunting this fall asked me if his 35 Rem is enough for one (last year he used a 300 RUM). I told him it should be as long as he knows the range limitations. He said where they're hunting shots should be 100 yards or less and probably closer to 50 yards. I said it should do well esp with bullets like the 220 grn Buffalo Bore. He said he has some of the Hornady LeverEvolution. I thought they would work fine also. Any 35 Rem guys or elk hunters have any thoughts to add?
It was my fathers favorite rifle for moose and he shot a lot of them. He used remington ammo and kept all his shooting inside 75yds. With the better ammo now available I wouldn't hesitate. Just keep in mind the distance of your shots
  #3  
Old 04-07-2007, 10:11 AM
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There's been lots of elk killed with the 35 Remington along with the old 30-30. Of course when that was happening there were a lot more elk.

I would tell him to take the 300. It would be better to be over-gunned than not. That is if he was proficient with the 300.

my 2 cents
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  #4  
Old 04-07-2007, 04:02 PM
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Ballistically the 30 / 30 and the 35 Remington are about identical.

An ethical harvest of game should have no less than 2000 fps bullet at the point of impact.

Some of the bullets mentioned barely make it out of the barrel that fast.

You cannot compare a 300 Ultra Mag or Short Mag or Winchester Mag to a 35 Remington which is about as slow a cartridge as was ever made - next to the 30 - 30 winchester which was origionally a black powder cartridge.
  #5  
Old 04-07-2007, 04:30 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by The Rifleman
An ethical harvest of game should have no less than 2000 fps bullet at the point of impact..
Surely you jest.


Quote:
Originally Posted by The Rifleman
next to the 30 - 30 winchester which was origionally a black powder cartridge..
No, it wasn't.
  #6  
Old 04-07-2007, 04:52 PM
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I would, but I use Beartooth 185gr. FNGC bullets, at about 2300fps.

They'll go 2 or 3 feet into a whitetail (but don't exit on a frontal shot). It was messy enough inside that I didn't feel like digging around for the bullet.

The Buffalo Bore 220 Speer 2200fps would be the obvious candidate for this.
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  #7  
Old 04-07-2007, 04:52 PM
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Rifleman:

The 30-30 was designed as a smokless round. The .32 Special was brought out by Winchester using a 1 in 16 twist so that Black Powder could be re-loaded in the primed empty cases that Winchester sold for that purpose. At the time the 30-30 came out smokeless Powder was not generally available for reloading due to safety issues, and the 30-30 had too tight a twist for easy cleaning of black powder residue. Many of the old timers had a distrust in the new fangled Smokeless Powder, and wanted to continue with their old Black Powder.

(Note) My Grandfather was one of them. I still have his Model 1893 Marlin in .38-55 with the Black Powder barrel.
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  #8  
Old 04-07-2007, 04:52 PM
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me thinks the so- called rifleman is going to get a lesson...
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  #9  
Old 04-07-2007, 04:56 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by The Rifleman
Ballistically the 30 / 30 and the 35 Remington are about identical.

An ethical harvest of game should have no less than 2000 fps bullet at the point of impact.

Some of the bullets mentioned barely make it out of the barrel that fast.

You cannot compare a 300 Ultra Mag or Short Mag or Winchester Mag to a 35 Remington which is about as slow a cartridge as was ever made - next to the 30 - 30 winchester which was origionally a black powder cartridge.
A 405 GR 45/70 leaves the muzzle at 1300 ft per second give or take. What effect do you think that very bullet would have on an elk at 50 yds. Would you consider it unethical to hunt with that cartridge?
Way to much consideration is given to a cartridges ballistics and far to less to its proven abilities in the field. Fifty years ago many a trapper in the the NWT and Alaska carried the 30/30 for protection as their only weapon. Then again that's when men were men
  #10  
Old 04-07-2007, 05:15 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by KenK

Quote:

An ethical harvest of game should have no less than 2000 fps bullet at the point of impact.
Surely you jest.
Correct. My bison, red deer, numerous hogs and whitetails, turkeys, a coyote, the odd javelina or two, and the occasional rattlesnake pretty much lept out of the freezer and back to life after hearing that they weren't fatally wounded by sub-2,000fps hits from my .500 JRH, .444 Marlin, .44 Mag, .45 Colt, .45 ACP .357 Mag, .40 S& W, and .35 Rem.



I sure hope Ranch Dog doesn't get wind of this. His Nilgai and desert mule deer will be overjoyed with the news they aren't dead yet
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  #11  
Old 04-07-2007, 11:02 PM
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Interesting discussion and a lot of sentiment for the old favorites...

IMHO, if I were taking the time and expense to travel all the way from Michigan to Colorado for what could be a once in a lifetime hunt for big elk, I wouldn't deliberately take a rifle chambered for a cartridge that would limit my shots to close range. I don't have a 35 Rem, but my 30-30 would definetly stay in the safe.

I've got friends that get elk every year with a bow and arrow...or blackpowder muzzleloaders. I've often hunted elk with a 45-70 in the thick stuff of WA, but if I was going anywhere the shots could possibly be over 125 yards, I'd want a flatter shooting cartridge.

300 RUM, 300 Win mag, 300 WSM, 30-06, 7mm mag...great!

Good hunting!

Last edited by leverite; 04-08-2007 at 12:36 PM.
  #12  
Old 04-08-2007, 04:30 AM
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I don't know if he's also bringing his 300 RUM or not but he asked if we could go to the range so he could shoot some rounds over my chrony (he doesn't load BTW). He seems intent on wanting a lever gun to bring, I don't know, he goes every year, maybe it's something different for him. I thought about offering to let him take my 358 or 348 Win if he wanted a lever gun. I mentioned the Buffalo Bore ammo to him and he has no problem with the cost of it but I agree I think that's his best option if he's set on the 35 Rem, but the Hornady LeverEvolution seems like a good althernative but I've heard little about field results with it.
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  #13  
Old 04-08-2007, 06:04 AM
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I admire the guy for wanting to hunt with the 35 Rem. From what M1 relates, I think he knows what he is doing. I wouldn't hesitate a second to shoot an elk with any one of my 35 Remingtons.

"2000 FPS at the point of impact", now I know you are on crack!
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  #14  
Old 04-08-2007, 07:16 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ranch Dog
I admire the guy for wanting to hunt with the 35 Rem. From what M1 relates, I think he knows what he is doing. I wouldn't hesitate a second to shoot an elk with any one of my 35 Remingtons.

"2000 FPS at the point of impact", now I know you are on crack!
Ranch dog I couldn't agree more.

Some of my most memorable times as a fisherman was not sitting in a $100,000 bass boat looking at graphs and temperature gauges. They were sitting in an old wooden row boat with a bobber and a worm
The pack horse moose hunt I plan to take this year was to be with my fathers old 35 rem. If I get a moose well that's just a bonus. Must be getting old
  #15  
Old 04-08-2007, 12:35 PM
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Out of curiosity, I checked the CO game regs. To be legal for elk and moose, the cartridge has to produce 1000 ft# of energy at 100 yards...per manufacturer's data.

The Federal factory 200 gr load has a 2000 fps muzzle velocity (unknown barrel length) and has the barely legal 1200 ft# of energy at 100 yards. Heavier bullets at higher velocity would better meet the regs.

For comparison, the new 338 Federal, 210 grainer has over 2700 ft# of energy at 100 yards. That's 50% more energy at 100 yards than the 35 Rem has at the muzzle. I expect a 358 win would be in the same ballpark as the 338 Federal.

In my opinion, both are far better choices for big, tough game in western hunting environs...and are at the lower end of the cartridges I'd consider suitable. Even small elk are tougher than whitetail deer.

Can't deny the 35 Rem lever gun makes a nice rifle to carry or pack in a horse scabbard. Just hope you don't have to reach out far to touch that big elk.

Last edited by leverite; 04-08-2007 at 01:13 PM.
  #16  
Old 04-08-2007, 01:31 PM
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Leverite, that is 20% greater performance than the regulations, I don't know if I would call that barely legal!

In my mind, the regs are conservative, so if it meets them, and you want to hunt with it, and finally, if you know the round and it's limitations, and are willing to live within them, then go for it.

I have no problem hunting elk with my bow and arrow and my muzzleloader, a .35 Rem would not make me think twice. However, know your limitations and live within them, pass on animals that are not in your known zone.

--Carl
  #17  
Old 04-08-2007, 01:57 PM
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My first Colorado Elk was taken with a .32/40 back in the 50's. ! was hunting with my Grandfather, and his rule was when you thought you were close enough, get closer, and make sure you have a good clear shot at the vitals before shooting. I'm sure that the loads for the .32/40's back then wouldn't make the restrictions of today, Even tho the old Marlin had a 26" barrel, but one shot was sufficient at 50-60 yards.
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  #18  
Old 04-08-2007, 02:39 PM
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The guy asked if we thought the 35 Rem was adequate as opposed to a 300 RUM. Hades...a bayonet may be adequate if you're close enough...and arrows kill in a different manner than bullets and you're not planning to shoot at more than a few yards.

I say the 35 Rem factory load is "barely legal" because factory ballistics are usually optimistic and I don't know whether Federal uses a longer barrel than 20" for proof testing.

For me...no way I'd waste my time packing that caliber if I had a 300 RUM or even a 308, as I'd like to be confident in taking shots a little farther than 100 yards.

If you like the 35 Rem for elk..go for it. But do you think you can find a COlorado outfitter that will recommend a 35 REm over the other cartridges discussed?
  #19  
Old 04-08-2007, 08:51 PM
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Leverite,

He said last year the guy used a 300 RUM, not that he was wanting to take it this year. The question was, is a 35 Rem enough, and if range and limitations are known, yes it is.

Really, I don't care what an outfitter recommends, since they will always recommend the biggest. They are in the business of getting elk, not trying to judge a shooter, so the bigger the better in their minds.

True, an arrow kills differently, but a muzzleloader kills the same way. I would put the limitations of a 35 Rem slightly further than the muzzleloader, but the point is, if he goes every year, and wants to hunt with his lever, he should.

I have a .338 Mag, and I will leave it home in favor of my lever depending on the area I am hunting, if the shot is likely to be less than 100yds, the lever is a great rifle to take.

With what you posted about the Colorado regs, it is per manufacture specs, so by that law, the 1200 ft# is what is being looked at, regardless of the barrel used. I haven't looked at the specs, but am going by your post, so the 35 Rem is very much in the comfort zone.

I have sat and watched some magnificent elk walk away because they were beyond my zone with the weapon I was hunting with (two of the best elk I have ever seen while bow hunting). One was just beyond my comfort zone, but I watched it walk away (not that I didn't try and stalk closer, but the wind wasn't with me). Knowing your weapon and understanding the limitations are the most important part of the hunt.
--Carl
  #20  
Old 04-09-2007, 12:02 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by pricecw
Leverite,

He said last year the guy used a 300 RUM, not that he was wanting to take it this year. The question was, is a 35 Rem enough, and if range and limitations are known, yes it is.

--Carl
Can't/won't disagree, just would not recommend or use the 35 Rem myself for that type of hunt. Not having a 35 Rem makes it easy to not use it myself.
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