Guys,

If I bought a '94 or knock-off in 30/30, would the magazine/action be able to handle the shorter 357Max cartridge? Before buying the gun and replacement barrel, I just want to make sure the action wouldn't jam up all the time because of the shorter, smaller diameter cartridge.

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I won't pretend to know whether the cartridge would work through the 336 action or not. But I will say that I wouldn't bother with a conversion to that cartridge when I could just go out and find one in .35 Remington and know without a doubt that it would work just fine.

I agree with you completely, but the 35 Remington is not legal for hunting deer, where I live. If it were, I would probably have a variety of other cartridges that I would prefer even more, but I'm stuck with "pistol-chambered rifles". The 357Max is one of the best (easy) options out there. If it will work through a Model '94 that was originally chambered for 30/30, I will start looking to buy one.

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Broom_jm, another suggestion would be to shorten & reform, a .30-30 case, to the same lenght as a 7.62X39 m/m then expand the neck to .357". I couldn't see why this wouldn't work in a Model 94 or Marlin Lever Action.

Wasn't there a .35 Herrett? I don't know the dimensions, though.

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MikeG

I've thought about basically making a 357Herrett, just shortening it a little more, to 1.625" from 1.750". That would make it Indiana-legal.

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That would seem to be a simple course of action.

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MikeG

I believe that would be possible.

YEP! It's a shorten .30-30 case necked up to .357". Mainly used in single shot pistols.

The .357 Herrett has a 1.75" case length. Instead of the .357 Maximum or .357 Herrett, I'd suggest the .375 SuperMag. It is the .375 Winchester shortened to 1.605" and can also be made from the .30-30 (with more work). It should feed thru the '94 action with no problems, easily has power equal to a .44 Magnum with a flatter trajectory and is well-respected for inherent accuracy among silhouette shooters.

The 357 Herrett is a bottleneck cartridge. No good for your laws. Find a model 94 Win in 357 mag and an intelligent smith to make it work in the 357 Max.

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"Use a big enough gun!"

Actually, Indiana is one of the PCR (pistol-chambered rifle) states that does NOT specify a straight-walled case. (Thus the 358GNR wildcat I've been working with, which is a 445SM, necked down.) I believe Michigan does require a straight-walled pistol case be used, but in Indiana the restrictions are simply that the case be no longer than 1.625" and shoot a bullet no smaller than .357".

The .357 Herrett is a very good option, but to be legal, I would have to get a custom reamer made, (and possibly dies?) because I need it to be .125" shorter than the standard specification. With the 357Max, you just use the standard reamer and existing 38Special or 357Mag dies. That's why I was wondering, from a gunsmith's perspective, if the smaller diameter, shorter COL 357Max would run through the magazine/action of a Model 94 originally chambered in 30/30.

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You don't need custom dies and reamers for what you are looking for. Simply use .357 SIG components. A .357 SIG lengthened .750" with a rim can be formed from .375/.38-55 Win brass to give you a 1.615" case. You can use .357 Herrett data for this cartridge as the shoulder will be approx. .030" further forward and .020" larger in diameter than the Herrett.

OK, I "think" you're saying I could use a .357 SIG sizing die and .375 brass, cut to length, and formed into a case that is nearly twice as long as the dies are made to size cartridges for. While I'm not convinced that would work, I kinda get the idea. Where I am REALLY confused is how this negates the need for a custom reamer? How would I get a chamber cut for such a cartridge (which isn't an altogether bad idea, so far...)?

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Why don't you trim the .357 Herrett brass to the right (Indiana-legal) length, shoot it in the standard chamber, and be done with it? Is is a restriction on the chamber, or ammo?

If they aren't going to stick case gages in the chamber.... then wouldn't that fix the issue, within the rules? Just a thought.

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MikeG

Mike, that's a very good question!

I have thought the same thing, but worry that the restriction may be on the actual CHAMBER size, not the case. It would probably never come into question, but if it did, the fact that I "could" chamber a full-length .357 Herrett case might get me into trouble. I guess you could say I'm avoiding even the very appearance of evil...or, just being a chicken, but I value my hunting rights a great deal and would hate to have them rescinded on such a minor technicality.

I suppose I could be safe, talk to a DNR officer, get a written statement of what is, and what is not, legal. If I had it in writing, the 357 Herrett would be a really good choice. I want to stay within the letter of the law, even if I question the intent?

Still, the 357Max is easier, all the way around, because the case is certainly short enough, they require no fire-forming chores, plus they're very affordable and available. The Max doesn't give as much velocity as the Herrett, but it has better range and trajectory than a standard 44Mag, while creating much less recoil than the 12" slug guns that most deer hunters use, in Indiana.

Is the consensus that a 357 Herrett, shortened to 1.625" (and with bullets loaded long?) would cycle reliably through an unaltered Model '94 action, originally cut for a 30/30? If so, I think I need to revisit that idea more seriously.

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You could just go with my favorite .35, and buy a 1894 Marlin in .44 Mag., and a .357 Mag barrel. re-chamberthe .357 barrel to .357/44 Bain and Davis. Re-place the .44 barrel with the re-chambered 357 barrel. Shortening the mag tube and reshaping the front barrel band will also be necessary. The ballistics are very close to the .35 Remington.

Makes a nice fast handlin, light weight carbine for deer up to Muley's.

(Note Grandson just talked me out of mine, so I guess I will have to buld another one.

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Lee L.

America= Land of the Free, Because of the Brave. == May God Bless Them All.

Have a look at Mcpherson's website. He has a few short rounds that are really quick.

http://www.levergun.com/Marlin/index.html

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Eric

Eric,

Thanks a lot for that link...there are quite a few interesting cartridges listed on that page. Several were wildcats I had wondered about and proof positive that if you can dream it up, someone's probably done it!

Jason

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Not a good idea