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  #1  
Old 11-28-2004, 06:00 PM
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223 Remington for Small Game?


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I am a newbie.
Is the .223 Remington OK for small games or will it cause too much tissue damage. I want to hunt rabbits, squirrels, ruffed grouse, etc.

Thanks guys,

Alan AKA Tavor.
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  #2  
Old 11-28-2004, 06:52 PM
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Afraid it does tend to mangle small game Even the FMJ bullets taht won't expand on such small critters do tend to transfer part of their bullet velocity to the meat they contact...better results tahn bullets made to expand, but not the puckered .22holes one would expect.
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  #3  
Old 11-28-2004, 07:38 PM
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Hmmmm. what caliber then?

Quote:
Originally Posted by ribbonstone
Afraid it does tend to mangle small game Even the FMJ bullets taht won't expand on such small critters do tend to transfer part of their bullet velocity to the meat they contact...better results tahn bullets made to expand, but not the puckered .22holes one would expect.
So what caliber do you suggest?

Thanks,

Alan
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  #4  
Old 11-28-2004, 07:44 PM
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A 20 gauge pump shotgun loaded with low wall #6's will work wonders.
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  #5  
Old 11-28-2004, 07:46 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by kdub
A 20 gauge pump shotgun loaded with low wall #6's will work wonders.
Thanks! I just thought that a shotgun will mess a rabbit up but I am a newbie so what do I know LOL

Alan
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  #6  
Old 11-28-2004, 07:48 PM
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Better to check with the game department in your area about what's legal to use.

But in general, out to 75 yards or so, seems like those critters are pretty much made to be intersected by a .22LR....or fine shotun targets at up to 40yards.

If you reloaded, then making the .223 shoot at about .22LR to .22mag. velocities would do the trick with minimal meat damage. For that matter, where legal, nearly any centerfire can be loaded with light "gallery" loads and make a good small game gun.
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  #7  
Old 11-29-2004, 01:54 PM
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Sometimes it depends on what bullet you use with it. The 45gr HP's and 40gr V-Max bullets tend to be explosive, but 55gr SP's hold together pretty well on smaller critters; most of the time they just pass right on through.
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  #8  
Old 11-29-2004, 04:10 PM
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thanks

Thanks for your help guys

I am going to buy the Savage model 10FP in .223

Alan aka Tavor
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  #9  
Old 11-29-2004, 04:16 PM
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Probably not a real good idea for squirrels or anything in the trees. A miss, and that bullet could go quite a ways. If it is legal in your area, use a bullet made for big game. I've shot rabbits with a .223 with prairie dog loads, and they do make a mess. I've also shot a rabbit at close range with my 270 with a 130 grain deer bullet, and it made a small hole in and out. Still pulls a lot of stuff out that small hole, but the meat damage was almost nonexistent.

If it's legal, that's where I'd start is with a big game bullet at modest velocities, if you want to eat your quarry.
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  #10  
Old 11-29-2004, 08:05 PM
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Squirrel in Arkansas can only be taken with rimfire or shotgun. Even have to leave my CCW pistol at the vehicle. Got to where I just carry a .22 pistol and hunt with that. Make sure you check your local game laws before hunting Squirrel with a centerfire. A nice 20 or 28 guage makes for a good all round firearm for small game out to 40 yards, and a .22WMR out to 100 yards.

Lee L.
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  #11  
Old 11-30-2004, 11:57 AM
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For small game? Stick to a .22 LR or a .22 Hornet
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  #12  
Old 12-03-2004, 04:05 PM
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Interesting. No takers for the .17 HMR. I've been target shooting with this round, and it is extremely accurate out to 200 yards (and beyond for a better shooter than myself). anyone used this new little wonder on anything small and furry? --Mykal
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  #13  
Old 12-03-2004, 04:10 PM
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The problem

Quote:
Originally Posted by Mykal
Interesting. No takers for the .17 HMR. I've been target shooting with this round, and it is extremely accurate out to 200 yards (and beyond for a better shooter than myself). anyone used this new little wonder on anything small and furry? --Mykal
Well, I agree that it's very accurate ammo. But I also hear that it tends to explode on impact. I want as less tissue damage as possible to the game.
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  #14  
Old 12-03-2004, 04:37 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by tavor
Well, I agree that it's very accurate ammo. But I also hear that it tends to explode on impact. I want as less tissue damage as possible to the game.
Doesn't do much "exploding" out at 150yards or beyond, but small game is a closer affair than that. Does tehnd to pre-chew tree squirrels a bit at typical woods ranges.

But it does fit the Louisiana laws:

"It shall be illegal to hunt or take squirrels or rabbits at any time with a breech-loaded rifle larger than a .22 caliber rimfire or a muzzleloader rifle larger than a .36 caliber"

Seems it specifically outlaws anything but RIMFIRE .22 or smaller. Now I know that law gets broken or bent quite often; by the book, a centerfire of any type (even loaded down to .22short speeds and enegy) is forbidden.
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  #15  
Old 12-03-2004, 07:42 PM
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Quote:

"It shall be illegal to hunt or take squirrels or rabbits at any time with a breech-loaded rifle larger than a .22 caliber rimfire or a muzzleloader rifle larger than a .36 caliber"
And what about other small game? Like Coyote, Red Fox etc.

With all these different laws, I am porbbably going to wind up with 5 or more rifles.

thanks for the replies.

Alan T.
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  #16  
Old 12-03-2004, 08:05 PM
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Just a sample of some other Louisiana game regulations; it's always a good idea to research the local game laws...they don't have to make sense to be a law:



2004-2005 GENERAL DEER HUNTING REGULATIONS

A) One antlered and one antlerless (when legal) deer per day EXCEPT on Wildlife Management Areas, Federal Refuges and National Forest Lands where the daily limit shall be one deer per day. Six per season, (all segments included) by all methods of take.



E) It is illegal to hunt or shoot deer with firearms smaller than .22 caliber center-fire or a shotgun loaded with anything other than buckshot or rifled slug. Handguns may be used for hunting.



I) MUZZLELOADER SEGMENT: It is unlawful to carry a gun, other than a muzzleloader, including those powered by air or other means, while hunting during the special muzzleloader segment. EXCEPT, it is lawful to carry a .22 caliber rimfire pistol loaded with #12 shot (ratshot only).


Legal Muzzleloader Firearms for Special Season: Rifles or pistols, .44 caliber minimum, or shotguns 10 gauge or smaller, all of which must load exclusively from the muzzle or cap and ball cylinder, use black powder or approved substitute only, take ball or bullet projectile only, including saboted bullets, and may be fitted with magnified scopes. This includes muzzleloaders known as "in line" muzzleloaders.


IT IS UNLAWFUL:

1. To carry a gun including those powered by air or other means while hunting with bow and arrow during the special bow and arrow deer season EXCEPT, it is lawful to carry a .22 caliber rimfire pistol loaded with #12 shot (ratshot) only.


2. To have in possession or use any poisoned or drugged arrow, arrows with explosive tips, or any bow drawn, held or released by mechanical means EXCEPT that hand held releases are lawful.


3. To hunt deer with a bow having a pull less than 30 pounds.


4. To hunt with a bow or crossbow fitted with an infrared or laser sight.
--------
Kind of explains why the most used handgun has been a .22Revolver and shot loads. We have a LOT of snakes, and the .22 revolver is spelled out as being the only one legal to have with you during muzzle loading and bow season (so the little S&W 317 gets carried often).

Your .223 would be a legal deer rifle here...proably not a wise choice, but legal. For that matter, so would my .22hornet...or any small cased wildcat centerfire (22/25acp would quailify).

Cut out a lot of stuff about when and where dogs can be used...not shooting from helicopters....leagal sistance from a public road...and a list of unprotected "shoot anytime" critters.

On the bright side, 2 deer a day and 6 deer a season is a resaonable limit.
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  #17  
Old 12-03-2004, 08:24 PM
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Thank you for providing me with that information, Ribbonstone!

Alan T.
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  #18  
Old 12-04-2004, 08:17 AM
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Alan,
It sounds like a delightful problem.....5 or more rifles? Yah baby!! I have seen small game taken with centerfire rifles and most of the time, a great deal of the little critters are wasted due to the excessive power involved. For me, small game is harvested with a Ruger Super Single Six using .22 LR solids. It does a fine job out to MY limits of shooting it well. I do intend to purchase a Marlin 39A .22 rifle and I'll probably even slap a good scope on it. If you haven't looked at the 39A, go to a gun store and try one on.. They do shoot quite well and feel like a REAL rifle.
Best of Luck!
Brian
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  #19  
Old 12-04-2004, 09:57 AM
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Brian,

I hear lots of good comments on the 39A and the price seems fair, so I don't see why not.
Also, I heard the CZ line is (accuracy in particular) superb.
They're just hard to find in my area.

Alan T.
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