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  #1  
Old 05-03-2006, 11:54 PM
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A beginner's F-Class rifle........where to start?


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I think I should point out right here and now that I have zero experience in any sort of target disciplines and my paper punching and silhouette experiences end at toying at the local range with my .22LR hunting rifle.
That said I'd like, eventually, to get into fly shooting and have a rifle built for the purpose.
Of course, it would be great to buy a purpose built rifle.
Problem is anything written F-Class rifle written in front of it seems to come with a price tag of at least $2500 and, in addition, I'm not a fan of 6mm cartridges, prefering 25 cal.
So it would be excellent to start without selling my children for medical experiments, if you get my point.
After casting about and asking a Canadian friend who's an avid F-Class shooter about it I decided that 250 Savage AI would be a decent cartridge.
Can I obtain a decent short action, have it rebarreled, fit new trigger, target scope & suitable stock and still expect to enjoy F-Class?
I know I'll be zero threat to those people with much deeper pockets than mine but I can see little point in blowing multiple thousands on rifle when I'm doing it for fun, not serious competition.
BTW, does anyone know of a company that makes a match bullet in .257 cal?
And now I'm going to be really difficult.......I hate Remingtons.
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  #2  
Old 05-04-2006, 03:36 AM
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You hate Remingtons.....are you related to kdub? Oh well, he lives in another country also.

Best way to get an education would be to attend a match as a spectator. You can learn alot by seeing what you will be up against and I'll bet most shooters will be more than happy to offer advice.

Sierra offers match bullets in .257 as do many others.
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  #3  
Old 05-04-2006, 11:24 AM
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Good advice from lumberjak - attending the matches and observing what the other shooters are using is a great idea. Plus, sometimes one of them will decide to try another cartridge or rifle and will be will to sell his present one at a reasonable price.

And, I don't hate Rem's - just don't have any use for them!
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  #4  
Old 05-04-2006, 01:21 PM
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Hello,
Well, what you "hate," like, etc. is really not that important if you are wanting to obtain skill in rifle shooting. I have been shooting matches, prone long range, 600-1000 yards for many a year now and can tell you without any reservations you will see more Remington or Remington clones on the firing line than all the others combined. No question about it.

Are they stock Remingtons, no, but the heart of the rifle is the action and the rest can be modified to suit the shooter, but that is the reason so many Remingtons are used. No end to the mods one can do and the marketplace is full of items only for Remingtons. Rare do you see a Mauser, few Winchester model 70's, occasional Savage, but tons and tons of Remingtons. Other than the ease of modification, price and performance, out of the box, Remington 700 PSS in 308, 300 Win. Mag very hard to beat for value. This is a somewhat restricted sale item in the U.S. and probably not available at all in your land, but perhaps the 700 Varminter is and it is close copy and they will delvier .5 moa with decent ammo. Might want to rethink your likes and dislikes and with the budget you have, hard to beat the Remington 700 or some custom version thereof. Universal "designated shooter" weapon around the world for many a military unit and law enforcement. It works, simple in design, cost effective, deadly accurate. What more can yo ask??
Good Luck.

Last edited by dsiteman; 05-04-2006 at 01:23 PM.
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  #5  
Old 05-04-2006, 02:06 PM
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Used rifles. That's probably your best bet.

Remingtons are cheap to get, and very cheap to work on. Try a Savage, but if there are weight restrictions, that makes it tougher.

Mausers are fun to mess with, but you'll not have much luck being competitive with them, without spending a heck of a bunch of money....

If it's just to have fun, then just get out there and have fun, and don't worry about the rest.
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  #6  
Old 05-04-2006, 06:27 PM
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I don't know anything about F-class shooting, but I would be willing to bet you would be happy with a savage, or even a stevens. They are easy to rebarrel, easy to put a trigger on, stocks are readily available. check out www.savageshooters.com I believe they even have a forum for F-class
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  #7  
Old 05-04-2006, 11:17 PM
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Part of the reason I'm not buying a Rem is that they are pricey to buy here, both new & second hand.
Everything is pricey and Rem aren't the guys keeping their prices down.
I realise that the Rem 700 is the small block Chev of rifle actions......lots of relatively inexpensive "go-faster" parts available.
But since they aren't really inexpensive here in Oz(although admittedly there are bits available for the M700 that aren't available even for M98s) then it seems like false economy, especially when I'm not crazy on them to begin with.
What I may do, after suggestion from some other guys, is buy an Omark/Sportco palma match rifle for around $300, get it drilled and tapped and use it until I decide whether or not to change to another cartridge.
Again, .308 Win is a little boring for me but I can easily compete in Standard class until I change my mind.
And let's face it, I probably will.
Perhaps 7mm Ackley since all of you have been dissing 250 AI.
Pity you can't make a large frame Martini suitable for the job.
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  #8  
Old 05-07-2006, 05:11 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by kombi1976
Part of the reason I'm not buying a Rem is that they are pricey to buy here, both new & second hand.
Everything is pricey and Rem aren't the guys keeping their prices down.
I realise that the Rem 700 is the small block Chev of rifle actions......lots of relatively inexpensive "go-faster" parts available.
But since they aren't really inexpensive here in Oz(although admittedly there are bits available for the M700 that aren't available even for M98s) then it seems like false economy, especially when I'm not crazy on them to begin with.
What I may do, after suggestion from some other guys, is buy an Omark/Sportco palma match rifle for around $300, get it drilled and tapped and use it until I decide whether or not to change to another cartridge.
Again, .308 Win is a little boring for me but I can easily compete in Standard class until I change my mind.
And let's face it, I probably will.
Perhaps 7mm Ackley since all of you have been dissing 250 AI.
Pity you can't make a large frame Martini suitable for the job.
Hey neighbor!
Happened to see this thread on your inquiry about "F" class rifles. Since Remingtons are not an option..my choice would be a Savage 10 series and go from there. Best caliber/cartridge? Well, you know me....6.5 caliber and my choice for cartridge would be 6.5/08 AKA .260 Remington. The bullet would be from Sierra...107gr MK. Michelle Gallagher won her first 1000yd Wimbleton Match shooting a rifle chambered for the 6.5/08. Now I know the cartridge didn't win the match......the shooter is the more important.....but I am sure the cartridge helped. Take care, my friend and good fortune to you on your "F" class quest!

Ol' John
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  #9  
Old 05-07-2006, 07:40 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by HondoJohn6508
Hey neighbor!
Happened to see this thread on your inquiry about "F" class rifles. Since Remingtons are not an option..my choice would be a Savage 10 series and go from there. Best caliber/cartridge? Well, you know me....6.5 caliber and my choice for cartridge would be 6.5/08 AKA .260 Remington. The bullet would be from Sierra...107gr MK. Michelle Gallagher won her first 1000yd Wimbleton Match shooting a rifle chambered for the 6.5/08. Now I know the cartridge didn't win the match......the shooter is the more important.....but I am sure the cartridge helped. Take care, my friend and good fortune to you on your "F" class quest!

Ol' John
Hi John.
Didn't know you were member here.
You and your 6.5s!
You're incorrigible!
Yeah, I know they're good cartridges but I've always wanted a decent 7mm and I'd really love a Mauser so with the Ackley version for improved efficiency I think I'd have quite a good unit.
The Omark action, if I can make it work, is a tube type like the Rem 700 but is a single shot target design.
My only concern is actually fitting the longer cartridge in as it's designed and generally chambered to 308, although an extra 6mm shouldn't make too much difference.
Correct me if I'm wrong.
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  #10  
Old 05-07-2006, 09:19 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by kombi1976
Part of the reason I'm not buying a Rem is that they are pricey to buy here, both new & second hand.
Everything is pricey and Rem aren't the guys keeping their prices down.
I realise that the Rem 700 is the small block Chev of rifle actions......lots of relatively inexpensive "go-faster" parts available.
But since they aren't really inexpensive here in Oz(although admittedly there are bits available for the M700 that aren't available even for M98s) then it seems like false economy, especially when I'm not crazy on them to begin with.
What I may do, after suggestion from some other guys, is buy an Omark/Sportco palma match rifle for around $300, get it drilled and tapped and use it until I decide whether or not to change to another cartridge.
Again, .308 Win is a little boring for me but I can easily compete in Standard class until I change my mind.
And let's face it, I probably will.
Perhaps 7mm Ackley since all of you have been dissing 250 AI.
Pity you can't make a large frame Martini suitable for the job.
kombi, You could always send that large frame Martini to me, and I will give it a good home.

Could always use the .307 Win case necked down to 7mm and use the 7mm/08 AI dimensions with the Martini. The .307 Win case is nothing more than a .308 Win. with a rim.

Lee L.

Last edited by M1894; 05-07-2006 at 09:44 AM.
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  #11  
Old 05-07-2006, 11:17 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by M1894
kombi, You could always send that large frame Martini to me, and I will give it a good home.
Mmmm, how can I put this?
Does the expression "you'll have to prise it from my cold, dead hands" convey my feelings clearly enough?

Quote:
Originally Posted by M1894
Could always use the .307 Win case necked down to 7mm and use the 7mm/08 AI dimensions with the Martini. The .307 Win case is nothing more than a .308 Win. with a rim.
Well, to be honest there are a couple of easier routes should I wish to go a 7mm route and make the Martini Enfield an F-Class rifle.
The first is to chamber it to 7mm/303 Epps, although this would involve a custom reamer & dies and a fair bit of fiddling.
It would however avoid the extractor mods.
The other, and arguably the easiest, is to chamber it to 7x57R with 7x57 AI dimensions.
Brass isn't cheap but it is plentiful as is factory ammo from Norma and Privi Partizan.
But, as things stand I'd rather build it to sporting rifle specs than target.
As the other guys have said Savage, Remington and other target specific actions are a better bet.
The amount of fiddling involved in making an action that old shoot really tight groups with modern cartridges is almost inconceivable.
Trigger modification, serious bushing of every moving part, not to mention a custom stock & really difficult bedding job.
And then there's scope mounting.
Nope, there are more enjoyable methods of spending copious amounts of money and slowly going insane.
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  #12  
Old 05-08-2006, 07:26 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by kombi1976
Mmmm, how can I put this?
Does the expression "you'll have to prise it from my cold, dead hands" convey my feelings clearly enough?
Can't blame a guy for trying. The Martini action has always been my favorite single shot action.

I have one Large action left, and have been trying to figure out what to re barrel to for quite a while, and your 7MM/303 sounds good, or the 7X57R. Was also considering a 6.5X57R. Also the .444 Marlin case necked down opens some possibilities as well.

Good luck in your Quest. Don't much care for the Remingtons either, but they do rule the roost in Bench Reat.

Lee L.
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