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  #1  
Old 10-25-2008, 11:53 PM
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7mm with 120 grain bullets ?


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I've had some trouble with a once separated shoulder and this year I decided
to go light bullets for lower recoil. I have both Nosler 120 gr Ballistic Tip and
Sierra Prohunters. The Nosler load guide lists 70 gr of Reloader 19 for
3570 fps out of a 24 inch barrel while the Alliant load guide fm 2005 lists
73 gr Reloader 19 as the max load. I guess I will start at 68 gr and work
up with both bullets in 1 grain increments and chart the fps and
accuracy in my 24 in barrel Rem 700 BDL

I see lots of posts about 7mm here on the board but never saw anyone
mention use of 120 gr bullets. I hate to feel like I am breaking new
ground all alone.

I forgot to mention the purpose is deer and hog hunting in North GA

I am a little worried about the construciton of the ballistic tips at
such hi velocities so I may have to limit shots to pure lung shots.

Does anyone have any experience with the Ballistic tips on deer?
How bout the ProHunters in 120 gr ?
Thanks
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  #2  
Old 10-26-2008, 04:30 AM
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My Take.....

.....on it is this.

I have shot, and reloaded, for a 7mm Rem Mag for years, and the smaller bullets shoot great outta a 24"(and up) bbl'ed gun. My varmint bullet of choice is the 115gr Speer.

Gotta tell you though,if your planning to push a 120gr outta a 24" at those(extreme) higher velocities,your shoulder will suffer.(A 120gr @ 3570 is smokin' !!)

Also, at those velocities that NosBalTip will explode. Especially if hitting a bigger deer square on the shoulder at the closer ranges,or a big boar hog on the shoulder plate.

IMO you need to go bigger and alot slower. A well made 140 to 160gr,driven at a slow speed would be the answer. Trajectory at the longer ranges ?? Who cares ..... punch paper prior to the hunt. Put a "cheat sheet" on your stock,go have fun.

Good shootin'. ------pruhdlr

Last edited by pruhdlr; 10-26-2008 at 04:32 AM.
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  #3  
Old 10-26-2008, 05:16 AM
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I second what pruhdlr says. He gives good advice.
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  #4  
Old 10-26-2008, 05:30 AM
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I have been shooting the 140s and 160's in the past so that is not
foreign to me.. This is my first experience with the 120 gr bullets
and the Noslers are so pretty.
I dont need to load them to max but I do need to reduce the
recoil. That is why the 120s.
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  #5  
Old 10-26-2008, 05:37 AM
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The trick is to pick a bullet with the same (or as close as possible) Ballistc coefficient as your heavy round, and then load the lighter one to the same velocity as the heavy.

That does two good things: One, it dramatically reduces recoil. Two, it matches the heavy bullet's trajectory. You don't need to learn any new "holdover" amounts, and you may not even need to re-sight the gun.

The 120 Ballistic Tip is considered by Nosler to be one of their big game and not a varmint bullet. It is constructed fairly stoutly. It can at times, however, produce massive tissue destruction at close range/high velocity. That's a third reason to load them down in your situation.
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  #6  
Old 10-26-2008, 06:53 AM
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To light and fragile, and to fast for your stated purpose!
If you MUST use a 120 gr use a Barns X (or one of their variants there of) it will not totally disintegrate at these velocities. If you do not you are going to very disappointed, not to mention inhumane to the animals you TRY to harvest!!!!!
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  #7  
Old 10-26-2008, 07:24 AM
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Jim, you would be correct with any bullet other than the Nosler BT. But the 120 BT in 7mm is constructed specifically as a big game bullet. See this page at Nosler: http://www.nosler.com/index.php?p=11&b=5&s=5&t=7mm

Now, even at that, if somebody insists on launching one at Warp 6 towards a whitetail standing 50 yards away, well... But that's a judgment failure, not a bullet failure.

The original poster needs a way to reduce recoil. Shooting a lighter bullet at less than maximum speed is an excellent way to do that, and the 7mm 120 BT is an excellent bullet to choose for that use.
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  #8  
Old 10-26-2008, 07:30 AM
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preventec47,

Thats a lot of powder! Its the amount or weight of the powder that makes the recoil greater by 150% over that of the bullet weight.

The formulas for recoil show this.

Not sure what cartridge your shooting but try a faster burning powder and lot less of it. The recoil will be much better for your shoulder. I am talking powders like 4895, 4064, 3031 etc.

http://www.varmintal.com/ashot.htm#Recoil
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  #9  
Old 10-26-2008, 09:10 AM
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Check It out -->

Scanned some of my reloading books and quickly came up with the following :

This for a 7mm Rem Mag and 120 gr bullets --->
*39.6grs/RX7/Rem 9 1/2M primer @ 2689fps
*36.5grs/SR4759 @ 2695fps
*37.0grs/IMR4227 @ 2705fps
*44.0grs/IMR4198 @ 2980

I'm sure that there are other choices out there. With these slower velocities take a look at the ballistic tables. Simply sight in a little lower at 50yds and you will be surprised out how far your PBR is.

I have never shot my 7mag's at these slower vels but would imagine with a "standard" weight weapon,they would recoil similar to a 7-08 or somewhat less.

This also, is what I believe that the 120gr NosBalTip and some of the others were designed for. Also pistol(probably T/C) length bbls with the somewhat slower vels.

Good shootin' -----pruhdlr
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  #10  
Old 10-26-2008, 09:20 AM
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Just load them down, as light as you can find data (and accurate enough to meet your needs). Oddly, the lighter-for-caliber BTs have something of a reputation for being tougher than the heavier ones. Perhaps it's in the jacket forming process? Section a few and see. The .30 cal 125gr. BTs will go through two javelinas, at full .30-06 velocities. At least the box of them I had did.

Anyway, BTs are not normally my recommendation of choice, but understanding this is a special situation, and you are aware the limitations, I don't see a problem. Just go for lung shots and you should be fine.

Best of luck to you.
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  #11  
Old 10-26-2008, 12:41 PM
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Why not either buy a 7mm-08 or 260 Remington and do it right? I don't thing any non-premium of that weight (or even heavier) at that velocity is good for anything but varmints!
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  #12  
Old 10-26-2008, 05:26 PM
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Not everyone can run out and buy a new rifle at will, not to mention setting up for reloading, etc.

I just don't see a problem with using the existing equipment, if a safe and accurate load can be found, and the user is aware of the limitations.

Looking forward to hearing the report from the field.
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  #13  
Old 10-27-2008, 04:49 AM
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those reduced loads look just about perfect to me, i was gonna suggest trying 3031 or 4895 but i'd bet that one of those will work.
i might even try the rl7 loads just to use up the partial bottle that has been sitting on the shelf for the last umpteen yrs.
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  #14  
Old 10-27-2008, 05:09 AM
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i've been watching this thread with some intrest. 4 weeks ago tomorrow i had neck surgery and had 4 of my disk fused. my deer rifle is a 7mm rem mag and since no one is beating the door down to buy it from me i was looking for loading options. not to mention then i would feel comfortable letting my oldest son shoot it too. i was going to buy some remington reduce loads because i don't reload yet, but i know soomeone who does and was going to look into having him reload some for me this winter. then take the time this spring at the range to get them shooting like i want. i'm glad to see Rocky clarifying the durability of the 120 gr balistic tips because i would have thought (wrongly mind you) that they were not tough enough and would be too frangable. glad to see i have options out there. i had my 7mm glass bedded and worked over when i got it because i had plan on useing it for a long long time. never thought i might have an issue down the road some day, but that's what happens with age i guess? turned 50 this year and have been going down hill ever since. :-)

Last edited by Jim H; 10-27-2008 at 05:11 AM.
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  #15  
Old 10-27-2008, 06:00 AM
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Jim,
Sorry to hear you are having health problem. I guess it is inevitable for all of us. Old fartitus, I know it well!!! But the alternative is not an option. I have four sons so I have 'handed down' several of my rifles. I still suggest you get a different rifle. You can get one which is lighter (easier to carry) and still be less punishing on the shoulder.
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  #16  
Old 10-27-2008, 06:11 AM
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Jim i have several lines in mind on a lighter rifle but in todays economic times i must sell this one first. and i don't plan on giving it away. i have an extra 150.00 in smith work done to it and while i don't intend to get that out of it i do intend on getting at least near full value for the firearm, i think that is not unrealistic. so untill i find someone with a desire for my make and calber i'll be toteing it along.
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  #17  
Old 10-27-2008, 06:24 AM
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Jim,
I am well aware of that. I just gave my 7mm-08 to my #2 son and now I have to sell one of my 'big' guns to get another 7mm-08.
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  #18  
Old 10-27-2008, 06:45 AM
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Reduced loads makes a rifle more versital and is allows one to use a rifle that he is allready used to
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  #19  
Old 10-27-2008, 08:48 AM
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I have experimented with reduced loads in Mag calibers and could never achieve the accuracy I did with full power loads.
I did get some to shoot well enough to hunt with them had I wished to do so.
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  #20  
Old 10-27-2008, 08:51 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MikeG View Post
Not everyone can run out and buy a new rifle at will, not to mention setting up for reloading, etc.

I just don't see a problem with using the existing equipment, if a safe and accurate load can be found, and the user is aware of the limitations.

Looking forward to hearing the report from the field.
I agree here. I'm loading my .300 Win Mag for Varmints with 110gr V-Max's, to take out some groundhogs when everyone starts their gardens next year. I'm also loading it heavy with 180gr Partitions for this years hunting. With a little handloading practice, why buy a new rifle for every situation, when you can use the same one loaded differently for those situations. Nothing wrong with reducing recoil. I took my .325 WSM down from 220gr soft points at max loads, to 180 Nosler BT's with mild loads, for my fiance` to shoot it. Works just fine.

For the 7mm Rem Mag, my new Lyman manual shows a MAX load of 73gr of RL22 pushing a 120gr at 3366. 68gr of IMR-4350 @ 3340 with the same bullet. These are the max loads listed though.
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