The web's most comprehensive user-interactive handloading database! Find the loading data created by handloaders, for handloaders, post your pet loads, or access and develop your own online loading database with our LoadNotes personal handloading database software. This feature, unique in its concept and intuitive in it's data presentation is fast to access, superbly organized and comprehensive in scope.Our online forums for questions and answers on many shooting and outdoor related topics. A dynamic, active, and well-informed resource for your enjoyment and interaction. Our most used resource on this website! Come share the experience with us!
» Advanced

Go Back   Shooters Forum > Rifle and Rifle Cartridges > Rifles and Rifle Cartridges
Register FAQ Members List Donate Calendar Search Today's Posts Mark Forums Read



Like Tree1Likes

Reply
 
LinkBack Thread Tools Rate Thread Display Modes
  #1  
Old 04-14-2011, 06:11 PM
Jakeway's Avatar
Beartooth Regular
 
Join Date: Jul 2008
Posts: 549
257 Roberts vs. 25-06 vs. 270 WIN


Registered Users do not see the above ad.


Just some crazy comparisons to kill some time.

I was thinking, is there any "real" advantage, other than subjective, to the 257 Roberts over the 25-06? Assuming the guns themselves were equivalent (say, a Ruger M77) would a down-loaded 25-06 perform just as well as the 257 R, with the option to get another 200 fps with full loads?

And if so, would there be any "real" advantages of a 25-06 over a 270 WIN in the same bullet weight? I haven't looked at the load data, but I assume a 120 gr .277 bullet would start out about the same velocity as a 120 gr bullet in the 25-06, but the superior BC and SD of the .257 bullet would have flatter medium to long range trajectory and deeper penetration (in similarly constructed bullets). Also the light-for-caliber bullet in the 270 might not be as accurate.

Make sense?
__________________
It's not rocket surgery, for crying outside!
Reply With Quote
  #2  
Old 04-14-2011, 06:23 PM
Beartooth Regular
 
Join Date: Feb 2009
Location: Huntsville, AL
Posts: 1,334
Given the same pressure, the 120gr .270 Winchester bullet will be a little faster than the 120gr .25-06 bullet at the muzzle. The .257 will have better BC/SD. The .277 will have more frontal area (larger diameter).
Reply With Quote
  #3  
Old 04-14-2011, 06:42 PM
Beartooth Regular
 
Join Date: Sep 2009
Location: Mooresville, IN
Posts: 8,388
If you want to split hairs, the Roberts can be loaded down for a more efficient varmint cartridge and the 270 can be loaded with heavier bullets that might make it a little more potent for the tougher big game animals, like elk. Real world? There isn't enough difference between the three that a well-placed shot won't dispel.
Reply With Quote
  #4  
Old 04-14-2011, 11:40 PM
Beartooth Regular
 
Join Date: Jul 2008
Posts: 194
More about which caliber you prefer and shoot well with. they are all great choices. 257 a classic but perhaps a little slower than the other two. 270 is a great option but kicks quite hard and a very loud report. Havn't shot the 25-06 myself but hear good things about it.
Reply With Quote
  #5  
Old 04-15-2011, 03:33 AM
Beartooth Regular
 
Join Date: Nov 2006
Location: Missouri
Posts: 1,859
Just to throw a wrench in the mix, I'm not sure I agree that there is no real difference at least as far as big game goes. For the record, I am not a .25 shooter and have just general experience with the .270. I have a few friends that use both extensively. My reason for wondering if there is not a significant difference lies in direct experience I have comparing two other rounds that are very similar - the .270 WSM and 7mm WSM. Indeed, I find them nearly identical at all bullet weights and actually inefficient and prone to splash wounds....until that is you go up to 160 grain premium bonded bullets, i.e. TBBCs or A-frames. Here, the 7mm WSM just flat shines. These 160 grain flat base bullets are accepted in the WSM case with no compromises in powder capacity. There is no such option readily available for the .270 WSM, so it gets left in the inefficient / inconsistent terminal performance category. So I see a big practical difference in the field with these near indentical rounds. I have to wonder if the .270 with premium bonded 140s or 150s wouldn't likewise out do the .25s for big game. Just my 2 cents.
__________________
A well regulated militia being necessary to the security of a free State, the right of the People to keep and bear arms shall not be infringed.
Reply With Quote
  #6  
Old 04-15-2011, 03:33 AM
Jakeway's Avatar
Beartooth Regular
 
Join Date: Jul 2008
Posts: 549
I guess I should have clarified things a bit more. Mostly my head, since I was sitting at the 'puter with my third beer when I wrote the original post.

I've already got a 270, a 260, and a 243. Thinking of candidates for the next rifle, and the 257 caliber seems to fit in there. However, I don't know if the 257 Roberts is closer to the 260 REM than the 25-06 is close to the 270! Thats when I got to thinking that if I got the 25-06, with the larger case capacity than the 257 Bob, it would be more versatile. I could load it down to the same specs as the 257 R, yet load it up to about thesame as my 270 with lighter than 130 gr bullets. Either way, these two rounds have a pretty neat history, and are slightly rare cartridges with a good fan base yet not as hard to come by as true wildcats.

Bandit is to blame for this, BTW. His post on the 284 WIN Marlin got me to thinking of a similar project, but it doesn't come in a .264 bore. It does come in a 25-06. Or, perhaps I could just get a whole new barrel in 6.5-284.

Decisions, decisions!
__________________
It's not rocket surgery, for crying outside!

Last edited by Jakeway; 04-15-2011 at 03:39 AM.
Reply With Quote
  #7  
Old 04-15-2011, 03:43 AM
Beartooth Regular
 
Join Date: Sep 2009
Location: Mooresville, IN
Posts: 8,388
The 257 Roberts and 25-'06 are both capable of extreme varmint-hunting as well as medium, thin-skinned big game, so they're both pretty versatile. The Bob does it with a little less powder and a little less range but neither can really be considered a deciding factor. The Roberts is probably easier to load down, due to its lower operating pressure, but there again, that is really making a stretch to find a difference between them.

Personally, if I had a 243, 260 and 270, I couldn't get excited about either of the 25's you mentioned. You've got varmints and deer blanketed with those choices. I'd probably go up to a 30 caliber or down to a true varmint round, like the 204 Ruger or 22-250.
Reply With Quote
  #8  
Old 04-15-2011, 03:51 AM
Beartooth Regular
 
Join Date: Feb 2004
Location: Panhandle of Nebr.
Posts: 161
I have shot mule deer with the 257 Roberts, 25-06 Rem and 270 Wiin. With bullets of the same weight the bullet out of the 270 will be the fastest ,while the bullet out of the 257 roberts will be the slowest. Recoil increases as the powder capicity increases when a round with the same bullet weight is fired from the same weight rifle. You can go to the Remington web site click on ammo and compare the the cartridges. The 270 Win is the best for longer shots when hunting in wide open country.
Reply With Quote
  #9  
Old 04-15-2011, 04:06 AM
Beartooth Regular
 
Join Date: Mar 2009
Location: FL, WV
Posts: 328
I hunt with a 25-06 a lot of the time. My buddie hunts with a 270. I shoot 120s usually, he normally uses 130s. We have both shot deer out to 250 yards on his place. My opinion? Theyre both great. With proper shot placement, both rifles have performed equally well on average whitetail deer. They both make the deer just as dead as the other. I have never shot his rifle, so cant compare recoil, but I would think mine might be a little less, but probably not enough to matter to most deer hunters. His 270 does seem to create a larger wound, which could make a difference on bigger game, but then again it could be bullet selection as well. I like that mine ruins less meat, as I like venision. Moral of the story? Shot in the same place, with either rifle, they die just as fast, in my experience anyway.
__________________
MattM
Reply With Quote
  #10  
Old 04-15-2011, 05:26 AM
Tnhunter's Avatar
Beartooth Regular
 
Join Date: Dec 2009
Location: Tennessee
Posts: 2,888
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jakeway View Post
I guess I should have clarified things a bit more. Mostly my head, since I was sitting at the 'puter with my third beer when I wrote the original post.

I've already got a 270, a 260, and a 243. Thinking of candidates for the next rifle, and the 257 caliber seems to fit in there. However, I don't know if the 257 Roberts is closer to the 260 REM than the 25-06 is close to the 270! Thats when I got to thinking that if I got the 25-06, with the larger case capacity than the 257 Bob, it would be more versatile. I could load it down to the same specs as the 257 R, yet load it up to about thesame as my 270 with lighter than 130 gr bullets. Either way, these two rounds have a pretty neat history, and are slightly rare cartridges with a good fan base yet not as hard to come by as true wildcats.

Bandit is to blame for this, BTW. His post on the 284 WIN Marlin got me to thinking of a similar project, but it doesn't come in a .264 bore. It does come in a 25-06. Or, perhaps I could just get a whole new barrel in 6.5-284.

Decisions, decisions!
I own, shoot and hunt with all three. To my mind the .270 & 25/06 are interchangeable as a deer round. The .257 is maybe a half step behind, but adequate for any deer that ever walked with proper loads. The +P loads for the .257 wring out plenty of performance from it's way smaller capacity. The .270 has an advantage (again, to my mind) when animals get larger than CXP2 sized, allowing for larger, premium bullets.

There is no discounting the "cool factor" that the .257 Roberts brings to the table as it's as classic a round as the venerable .270, just not quite as versatile for the big game realm. When it comes to deer and varmints, it gets no better than the .257 (wanna guess where the 6mm Rem came from?). For inclusion into your stable, my vote would definitely go to the Bob with it's added panache and excellent crossover versatility.
__________________
A veteran is someone who, at one point in his life, wrote
a blank check made payable to "The United States of
America" for an amount of 'up to and including my life.
That is honor, and there are way too many people in this
country who no longer understand it.
Reply With Quote
  #11  
Old 04-15-2011, 06:29 AM
Beartooth Regular
 
Join Date: Jan 2007
Location: South Dakota
Posts: 5,694
I've used all three chamberings. They've taken everything from prairie dogs to mule deer. I personally feel on game elk sized or bigger, I want something .30 caliber or bigger. My favorite is the 25-06 over the other two. Not so much the round as the rifle I have it in.
__________________
Still Learnin' as I go!

NRA Life Member
Reply With Quote
  #12  
Old 04-15-2011, 07:04 AM
MikeG's Avatar
The Hog Whisperer (Administrator)
 
Join Date: Jan 2001
Posts: 26,474
I'll agree with Tnhunter. Well said.
__________________
MikeG

Quote:
Originally Posted by faucettb
Welcome to the forum. Rules are simple, be nice and join in.
Reply With Quote
  #13  
Old 04-15-2011, 07:13 AM
Tnhunter's Avatar
Beartooth Regular
 
Join Date: Dec 2009
Location: Tennessee
Posts: 2,888
Quote from MontyF:
I personally feel on game elk sized or bigger, I want something .30 caliber or bigger.



I could not agree more!
TH
__________________
A veteran is someone who, at one point in his life, wrote
a blank check made payable to "The United States of
America" for an amount of 'up to and including my life.
That is honor, and there are way too many people in this
country who no longer understand it.
Reply With Quote
  #14  
Old 04-15-2011, 03:23 PM
Beartooth Regular
 
Join Date: Apr 2009
Location: perth-west australia
Posts: 233
Smile 25/06-257-270

Quote:
Originally Posted by Farrier Matt View Post
I hunt with a 25-06 a lot of the time. My buddie hunts with a 270. I shoot 120s usually, he normally uses 130s. We have both shot deer out to 250 yards on his place. My opinion? Theyre both great. With proper shot placement, both rifles have performed equally well on average whitetail deer. They both make the deer just as dead as the other. I have never shot his rifle, so cant compare recoil, but I would think mine might be a little less, but probably not enough to matter to most deer hunters. His 270 does seem to create a larger wound, which could make a difference on bigger game, but then again it could be bullet selection as well. I like that mine ruins less meat, as I like venision. Moral of the story? Shot in the same place, with either rifle, they die just as fast, in my experience anyway.
i totally agree.-my own love is a 25/06 in a ruger tang safety which i load a 90gr@3560 fps. that shoots like stretched string.-very hard to beat.in reality,all three will do the same job.a 284/25 sounds like a nice toy.
Reply With Quote
  #15  
Old 04-15-2011, 03:59 PM
Beartooth Regular
 
Join Date: Mar 2009
Location: FL, WV
Posts: 328
Sounds like a pretty hot load at 3560.
__________________
MattM
Reply With Quote
  #16  
Old 04-15-2011, 05:26 PM
Super Moderator
 
Join Date: Feb 2005
Location: Idaho
Posts: 6,707
Quote:
Originally Posted by Farrier Matt View Post
Sounds like a pretty hot load at 3560.
Yes, that's a hot one. I'm at 3500 fps with 75 gr bullets in the 25-06. Individual rifles will take that without a hiccup, sometimes. The brass will not be as forgiving in the long-term. Daily temperature swings may stick an action closed at some point.
__________________
NRA Endowment Member
SCI Member
Reply With Quote
  #17  
Old 04-15-2011, 06:59 PM
Guidedfishing's Avatar
Beartooth Regular
 
Join Date: Aug 2009
Location: Northwest Wisconsin
Posts: 280
I have to admit I am pretty biased on this one, and having killed an elk with a 120 nosler partition out of the Bob I have to say that elk was just as dead and the elk I've killed with a .280.

Although I have found my roberts shoots 75 gr sierra's in a inch at 100 yards, it will shoot 100gr hornady inside 3/4 of an inch all day. Actually very versatile when compared to the .280. Have never had a 270, but it only lags slightly behind the .280 more so with heavier bullets.

good luck
GF
Reply With Quote
  #18  
Old 04-16-2011, 04:50 AM
TMan's Avatar
Beartooth Regular
 
Join Date: Jan 2006
Location: NJ - But Not For Long :)
Posts: 2,718
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jakeway View Post
I've already got a 270, a 260, and a 243. Thinking of candidates for the next rifle, and the 257 caliber seems to fit in there.
Now I understand, this is not a either/or scenario, but rounding out a collection. I'd go with a .25-06 as you can move brass from the 25-06 to the 270, or back, with minimum fuss.

There are always arguments, experience, and opinions to go either way, and your wife might have an even different idea , but the real answer is what rifle do you want it in, and what's available. A Marlin in .25-06 would always have the ability to switch a barrel, and turn it into many things with a minimum of fuss and tools.
Reply With Quote
  #19  
Old 04-16-2011, 06:16 AM
Jakeway's Avatar
Beartooth Regular
 
Join Date: Jul 2008
Posts: 549
Yup, you get the picture now, TMan. This is mostly a playing around gun at this time, but since 90% of my hunting is for Tennessee whitetails, with the remainder being coyotes, I have no reason to go larger than 270 at this time. But whatever I get, it has to be deer-compliant.

Also, I'm not sure how long the .243 will be in my safe. My 12 year old grandaughter got her first deer with the 243 last fall, and I might give it to her outright if she continues to show interest in hunting. Even if it doesn't become her gun permanently, she has a younger sister that will start hunting year after next, and there's another grandaughter and grandson coming along in a few more years. We'll need a whole arsenal of guns before we're done, and it gives me a great excuse for trying out new stuff. But being anal, I don't want two guns in the same caliber, so I can keep all the reloads optimized for each gun without marking the brass somehow.
__________________
It's not rocket surgery, for crying outside!
Reply With Quote
  #20  
Old 04-16-2011, 06:34 AM
tpv's Avatar
tpv tpv is offline
Beartooth Regular
 
Join Date: Dec 2003
Location: fort worth texas
Posts: 2,495
Talking

I always come to the defense of my favorite, the 270 Winchester. I have three of them. Having grown up with the 130 grain partition, I was slow to try the newer 140 grain bullets. But now that I have some experience shooting the heavier round, I think I have found my load. The 140 grain Accubond works very well in all of my 270's and I have no doubt it would stop anything I ever shoot at out to 400 yards. That's my maximum.
I also have a Remngton classic, older model, with a new 24" Shilen barrel in 257 Roberts that 'ol Kdub keeps trying to trade me out of. If it weren't for the cheap Ziess scope on top of it, we would have traded already.
It is a great little round and I load the 110 grain Accubond in it to about 2900 fps. It drops hogs fast with full penetration. I would compare the girth on one of our larger hogs to that of a cow Elk. The longest shot I made was around 250 yds, and it only made it ten feet.
I use to think that if I couldn't get 3000 fps out of my cartridge, it just wouldn't work.... Baloney.
2600 - 2900 works great and just may penetrate better once it hits the animal. That speed sure gets better accuracy,too.
Going after Antelope this fall and will bring the Bob and my twin 260 Rem.
For my mule deer hunt, I'll bring my favorite 270 and my next favorite 270.
Go get a Bob.
Good luck
__________________
Throw another log on the fire

Last edited by tpv; 04-16-2011 at 06:38 AM.
Reply With Quote
Reply

Thread Tools
Display Modes Rate This Thread
Rate This Thread:

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is On
Trackbacks are On
Pingbacks are On
Refbacks are On


Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
270 or 270 WSM Cbrown2008 Rifles and Rifle Cartridges 38 03-06-2011 05:30 PM
rem 700 chambered in 270 win 066logger Rifles and Rifle Cartridges 27 02-23-2011 05:24 AM
How to tell the difference of 270 and 270 WSM Muse Rifles and Rifle Cartridges 9 01-27-2010 05:31 PM
270 wsm vs 270 win gbolt903 Rifles and Rifle Cartridges 14 12-05-2009 07:24 PM
270 win problems scottg Handloading Procedures/Practices 7 08-20-2008 11:31 PM


All times are GMT -8. The time now is 08:11 PM.

< Contact Us - Shooters Forum - Archive >

 
 

All Content & Design Copyright © 1999-2002 Beartooth Bullets, All Rights Reserved
View Privacy Policy | Contact Webmaster | Legal Information
Website Design & Development By Exbabylon Internet Solutions
Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.7
Copyright ©2000 - 2014, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.
SEO by vBSEO 3.6.0 PL2