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  #1  
Old 04-02-2011, 05:37 PM
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will copper plated shot ruin a lead only choke


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Im using remington premium magnum 3in #6 shot and 2ounce i have a mossberg 535 with a lead only xxfull choke and im woried about it wiping out the choke. please let me know
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  #2  
Old 04-02-2011, 07:45 PM
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Depends. I've had one get stuck after a single load. It was a thin-wall aftermarket choke so it can happen.

Contact the manufacturer and see what they say.
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  #3  
Old 04-03-2011, 04:45 AM
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Copper plated (or nickel plated) shot IS lead shot. Won't hurt a thing. It was around long before choke tubes, too. I have shot that and nickel plated thru thinwall tube fitted double guns for years with no issues whatsoever. Blaze away.
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  #4  
Old 04-03-2011, 04:50 AM
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Plated isn't any harder than hardend lead shot, so I dont where there could be any problem.
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  #5  
Old 04-03-2011, 05:46 AM
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I used it in muzzle loaders for years and never had a problem. I have stuck a cheap choke like MikeG with a load of lead shot so it probably wasn't the shot that caused the choke to get stuck.
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  #6  
Old 04-03-2011, 08:49 AM
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OK, you guys who have not stuck a choke tube with copper-plated shot, please do not advise that this cannot happen.

Stick to the manufacturer's recommendation.
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  #7  
Old 04-03-2011, 11:20 AM
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My buddy tells me they now offer copper plated steel shot, so make sure what you are shooting is plated lead. I haven't shot steel in so long I didn't realize they even made that.
If plated lead shot messed up a choke tube, it was already halfway messed up before you pulled the trigger. I have never seen a manufacturer not recommend plated lead shot.
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  #8  
Old 04-03-2011, 01:44 PM
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> My buddy tells me they now offer copper plated steel shot

He is correct. Really nothing different then a Copperhead steel BB by Daisy, imho.

> please do not advise that this cannot happen.

As for the warnings about not using steel shot with a lead only tube, here is why I think the chokes get stuck which no one has mentioned.

When fired down a constricted choke, which will give first. A hard steel ball .177+ in diameter or a thin walled choke tube with a wall thickness of 0.03125+. The choke expands first under the pressure and the thin treads are mushroomed/galled into the harder and thicker barrel. Do this two or three times, the barrel gets hot, then when it cools, the metal already squished into the threads cools and forms a heated press fit.

Just like you do on axle bearings and transmission shafts for vehicles. Which means if you did not use anti-seize on the threads AND heat the barrel up and keep the choke cooler, then it will be about impossible to remove as some people have noted elsewhere in threads.

So, I agree with "Stick to the manufacturer's recommendation."
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  #9  
Old 04-03-2011, 02:21 PM
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I can't say why it did what it did. But I can say for sure that the tube stuck.

My habit has always been to take the tubes out every time the barrel was cleaned, and re-lube the threads with Break-Free. This worked well for a long time and in fact I have never had an issue since. Lots of plain lead #4 through #9 shot had been through all the tubes I owned before, and since, that incident.

Thanks for pointing out that copper-plated steel exists. My own experience with a stuck tube after shooting copper plated lead shot happened almost exactly 20 years ago, FYI.

Again, with a tube that had never given me any indication of trouble, one load of copper-plated lead shot stuck it. Someone else can figure out why.

By the way these were specifically marked as turkey hunting loads. They were not waterfowl loads.
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  #10  
Old 04-05-2011, 09:25 AM
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patrick:

I would definitely subsctibe to Mikes "manufacture's recommendation". I do believe that the Mossberg 535 choke system is of sufficient thickness. (Invector I believe) Nonetheless, if your system was installed on an aftermarket basis, it could be thinner walled, or most any other installable sizing that the installer markets.

Another factor here is that 2 ozs. is an awful lot of shot to squeeze thru a XXFull constriction. Also, in XXFull, and not written into stone, but normally, the tighter restrictions perform better #6 and smaller. The theory is that the smaller pellets allow the shot column to move thru the choke in a more "fluid" manner. Pattern testing, more often than not, seems to corroborate this theory in my personal testing.

Pattern testing might also reveal better performance with less shot.
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  #11  
Old 04-05-2011, 10:38 AM
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I have only had that one tube stick that i mentioned and i use choke tube lube on all my tubes. I am almost positive that it was magnum lead shot that stuck the tube, but it was a turkey gun and at that time i was hand loading buffered copper plated shot as well as testing (that day) magnum unbuffered lead. I guess it's possible that i fired some of the buffered copper plated loads, but i don't think i did. I didn't know that there was any manufacturer's that advised against copper plated loads for use in their chokes. I have some older tubes that say lead shot only on them, but i never assumed it meant no plated shot either.
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  #12  
Old 04-06-2011, 02:03 AM
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As to "Manufacturer's Recommendations", I repeat, show me one tube manufacturer who does not recommend shooting plated lead shot. Bet you can't find one, and that includes Briley's Thinwall tubes. I know, because I have had those too.
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  #13  
Old 04-06-2011, 06:07 AM
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Come to think of it Virginian, ("Manufacturer's recommendation") neither have I.

I just did a little inconclusive test known as the pliers crush. (Inconclusive because I had no way other than "feel" to measure resistance) I crushed a pellet of Lawrence brand copper plated #4, and Western brand "magnum lead" #4. By feel only, there was no perceptible difference.

The Lawrence brand was said to be (by mfg.) approximately 3% antimony, and then plated. The Western brand was said to be (by mfg.) approximately 5% antimony. I would imagine those percentage figures to be a fairly close average, given the overall shot making process, and the fact that BHN is fairly easy to moniter/adjust.

I too have the Briley thin walls in one of my shotguns, and they will take magnum lead, copper or nickel plated with absolutely no indication (micrometer verified) of "swelling".

The thinest tubes I have ever seen (so far) were made by a company named Clearview Products. A friend of mine had them installed in his 870. He did experience swelling, but I don't blame it directly on the tubes themselves. I believe the root of the problem was that the installer should have refused that barrel for installation due to insufficient wall thickness. Admittedly that is unusual for an 870, but closer examination showed that this particular bore was off center, rendering one arc of the wall thinner.
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  #14  
Old 04-06-2011, 07:39 AM
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In one of my shotshell loading manuals... I think i read it in one of the Lyman's, but not sure, anyway it says that copper plated shot is not harder than magnum lead and the reason to expect better patterns is because it makes the shot slippery which aids in less deformation in the barrel and allows it to "slip" through tight chokes with less deformation.
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  #15  
Old 04-06-2011, 09:18 AM
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Well it is harder. Copper is harder than lead. Crushing with a pair of pliers is a very slow, static load as compared to what happens to a load of shot going through a choke constriction in a tiny fraction of a second.

Now, it may not be enough to damage most chokes. It may not damage any other choke on this earth besides the one I fired a single load through and stuck. But to say it is not possible is incorrect, because it did happen.

Again, I do not know why, but I can only report what did actually happen.
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  #16  
Old 04-06-2011, 04:46 PM
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I've never had trouble with copper plated lead shot in my lead-only rated scaterguns.

Mine are 2 3/4 inch chambered. I use a little grease on the threads of the choke tubes ( rather than an oil). Gunslick is the current product that I'm using.

My son's 20 bore is 3" chambered. I can report no trouble there with the same technique. We make sure to put a dab in there anytime we switch tubes!

Thinking about copper-plated lead.....What is the pupose? To make it harder? Lubrication? Prevent leading of the bore? Easyier to spot when cleaning a rooster? Marketing?
Wad protects the bore. Right?

I remember cardbord and paper hulls with lead shot that worked fine.

Hoppes #9 worked fine to take care of that. There where no screw-in chokes then. About 4 dram equivelent to black +/-.

Creating our own problem?

Cheezywan
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  #17  
Old 04-06-2011, 06:30 PM
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The harder the shot, the less it gets deformed by the acceleration down the bore, and the squeeze that the forcing cone and choke put on it.

Then again, Winchester is going backwards by making steel shot that isn't round? Some days I don't know what to think of the industry......
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  #18  
Old 04-07-2011, 02:40 PM
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> Some days I don't know what to think of the industry......

Same as every other, patent something no one else has, then tout it's virtues, even if it makes no discernible difference in real world performance. Just like a tire tread
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  #19  
Old 04-07-2011, 04:09 PM
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The few thousandths of plating do not make the pellets measurably harder. In fact they are usually softer than premium magnum lead pellets. The plating makes them slide over each other better, and is also supposed to help them slip thru the feathers, but that one may have just been marketing hype.
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  #20  
Old 04-07-2011, 04:42 PM
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I have to ask, have you run them through a hardness tester?
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