Comment on this Open Sight article:

__________________
Marshall
Romans 1:16



Beartooth: A Bullet Worth Waiting For!

Another great article Marshall... good job!

__________________
Michael

This is one I totally agree with....that's kind of rare for a COB (cranky old b.)

An excellent article. I agree with the premise completely. This is why I have tried never to take shots on game (in the past) beyond 250 yards. Now, as I only shoot an-iron-sighted rifle (I've gotten more traditional in my old age)....I won't consider shots beyond 150 yards (and usually, no more than 125 yards...in actual practice).

A 2.5 inch group at 100 yards means the bullet will hit within 1.25 inch of where you are aiming. Thats close enough for me. I carry small binos and use a 2 and 3/4 power scout scope. If it looks too small in that scope, its too far for me.

ironhead,
I'm right there with you on this. If I can get consistent 2" - 2.5" groups at 100 yards.....I'm quite happy with that. Sometimes, on off days, I can't quite manage it (a few fliers). But, that's ME, not the rifle.

Yes a great article. I remember seeing a similar one on Chuck Hawks site. I think the problem with many hunters today and in the age of super magnums, they believe since their new 300 super ultra mach magnum has enough energy to kill an elk at 1000 yards, that's how far they can shoot. They seem to forget the weak link is them as the shooter.

I was at an ammo sale last year at a local sporting goods store and an older gentleman was asking the clerk how far a certain 30-06 load would shoot. I asked him how good of a shot was he (I was ignored of course) and the clerk replied 600 yards. The man bought the ammo. My problem was this guy if he shot at all before the season was to sight in his rifle. At most, maybe to verify his zero before the season. Now he goes out to the field believing he can take a deer out to 600 yards. And that IMO is a problem that is getting to be worse and worse is hunters not knowing their or their equipments limits and staying within them. Again, great article.

__________________

M1 hit the nail on the head. Sure see a lots of folks at the range with those monster magnums sighting their rifles in a a hundred yards and never actually firing at the ranges their talking about shooting game at. They usually never shoot from field positions either.

I'm not putting down the monster mags, I still shoot my Rem 8 mag, but relying on ballistic tables to shoot living creatures at long range seems to insure wounded animals.

I have two friends whom shoot a 300 RUM and a 300 Winchester Mag whom I helped sight in their rifles. Both were sighting in one inch high at a hundred yards, not realizing how much drop this dials into these high performance cartridges at longer range.

Both of these fellas are supurb shots and excellent hunters, but are not using the trajectories of their rifles to optimize hits out to the 350 yards plus these rifles are designed to shoot with out having to worry about holdover.

I also know that as Marshall said I've ended up in the crosshairs of other hunters a few times and have had friends whom were shot at. Perhaps it was better they had such poor shooting skils at long ranges.

__________________
Bob from Idaho

Marhall,Great article.I could never put together an article like that but I have always felt the same way as you. I an ad that,hunting in the woods,Iv'e had rifle sights pointed at me at less then 100 yards.
My personal limit is around 200-250 yards,but I rarely see any game at that rnge.My personal limitation is 'Running Deer' I rarely shoot at them because I'm not that good a shot offhand.
I would much prefer eating 'store bought'meat then worry about a possible wounded deer.
Frank

__________________
Frank

I also don't have anything against the magnums, and I'd love nothing better than a good old 8mm Rem Mag. I just don't get the guys who get them and figure they can take potshots at game they have no business shooting at.

I can relate to rounds flying my way as well, I've had it happen twice. Both were several years ago. I'll keep both brief but once while hunting the farm, I was walking to my blind while a neighbor was already in his (problems with another neighbor shooting deer on our property was why I was out) and a small buck was bedded on a hill between us. Well the buck stood up as I approached my blind and was almost in a direct line between us. He was about 100 yards from each of us with the neighbor on the far side about 200 yards away. Well the neighbor decided to start shooting and I hit the dirt. I have to say I almost felt like sending a few his way I was so mad...but I didn't.

Another was just off some property we used to own in northern MI, my cousin and I were stalking a ridge on a cedar swamp and as we entered state land, we heard shots that sounded like they were right on top of us. We started yelling so whomever knew there were people nearby and an old guy comes out and asks if we saw that six point. No we said but you were shooting in our direction. We found what he was shooting at and it was a yearling doe, and of course he had no doe tag. I believe we drove that young deer by the guy and I guess I'm kinda glad because the guy could've opened up on us..who knows. I just have a hard time comprehending why "hunters" have such a hard time ID'ing their target (or beyond) before shooting. I'm kinda surprised there aren't more hunting accidents from what I've seen.

__________________

Some of the reasons for buying the super magnums follows these trains of thought:

Advertising says these guns shoot raygun straight for long distances. I know that when I was younger I always wanted the hottest, baddest, fastest and so forth. Wasn't any real reason for it, but you always envied the guy with the hotrod with the most power. One-up-manship is kind of an American Tradition and it takes some growing up to get over it.

Just because folks don't have the latest whiz-bang magnum does not mean they won't take shots that folks with more game sense won't. You see it in the woods all the time. Lots of times these same folks have just sighted in their rifle at that big white rock at an indeterminate distance, Yup right on, lets shoot that deer over on the other side of the vally.

There are lots of beginners whom just don't know any better. Thats why websites such as this one is so important. It allows us to mentor new hunters and shooters all over the country instead just in our local area.

On the reverse side there are lots of sportsman whom are careful with their rifle, cartridge, shooting distance and shot placement selection. Those folks know there is more to hunting than pointing the gun and going bang.

These are the hunters sharing their knowledge on forums like this and to hunters and folks just getting into hunting. When they do this lets just pray that it's presented in a way that those folks listen.

Thank you Mr. Stanton for a great article and giving us the means to discuss it.

__________________
Bob from Idaho

Well said Bob.

__________________

I can do nothing but agree with you gentlemen on this post !It is one thing to shoot of a bench under controled conditions Vs going out in the field ! At the end of the day how many shooters can really say for sure what range their shooting at once it gets past say the 100yrd mark?I learnt by long & expensive experiance ,that long shots are not always paying shots & I feel this post is once again renforcing the fact that although your rifle is capible of taking game at 300yrds+!Dose'nt mean that you have to try & hit that far out!This is a valuble leason for Newbies & seasoned hunters as well

Dave

__________________
"ALL TIMES WASTED WOTS NOT SPENT SHOOTIN"

Great artical Marshall

Many do not practice with proper sized animal targets before going afeild.

__________________
Montanan's Black Powder Chronicles and More

No matter what I'm useing I limit the length of shot that I am willing to take. Even with the flattest shooting magnum I would not take a shot past about 200 yards. Why? Because too many things can happen, and a blood trail can be difficult enough to find under some conditions.

I use to shoot varmints past this point but stalking and actually hunting the animal have become more important to me lately.

As always your primary concern should be safety and harvesting the animal cleanly. I think that your prmary concern should be accuracy. You don't know what shot you may need to take in the feild and extra power, flat trajectory and all the other stuff goes right out the window if you miss, or worse wound the animal your shooting at. True the bullet must have enough power to do the job but once that is accomplished you have to hit the target.

Hitting a paper plate at 150 yards from the bench is a lot different proposition than in the feild with the target in different relative position to the sun, snow flying, wind, hunter excitement a makeshift rest. With all the variables it is a wonder that as many animals are killed each year. theres no such thing as too much accuracy.

Have you ever heard the excuse"I didn't get my buck cause my rifle is too accurate".
Regards
Gene