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  #1  
Old 02-08-2010, 07:32 AM
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ruger#1 in standard or varminter


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Would be used for hunting whitetail deer in open country. Trying to decide between 25-06 or 270 (laminate-stainless) standard, or 25-06 varminter.

Leaning towards the 270 primarily because its cheaper to shoot(don't reload) and its stainless, however, I've been very impressed by hunting parners that have used the 25-06 caliber. Is the varminter version inherintely more accurate because of the heavier barrel? Is the target block scope mounting system better than the type used on the standard? Are there any differences in how the forearms are mounted? Is the weight/balance better or worse in either model? Finally, is the laminate stock mounted the same as the walnut version? Any other info would be greatly appreciated!
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  #2  
Old 02-08-2010, 08:03 AM
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I don't have either, but will say that heavier barrels tend to be easier to make accurate. The reason is that the rigidity of a cylinder increases with the square of the diameter. Thus, a barrel that is 1" diameter is 4 times more rigid than one 1/2" in diameter. That said, if you have to take a quick standing snap shot or hike a long distance, you will appreciate minimized rifle weight. Minute of deer at 200 yards is much larger than minute of Prarie Dog at 200 yards, so you don't need varmint accuracy for the white tails.

I don't know how much shooting you will do? The .25-06 will be more comfortable to shoot (less recoil) but will also eat up the bore throat faster. Since the same volume of powder is being shoved down a smaller bore at higher speed, barrel life will be shorter. I would guess about half. Maybe 1500 peak accuracy rounds verses maybe 3000 for the .270? If you just take it to the range for sighting once a year then hunting in the fall, that's not a concern, as you will never get to the lower number that way. If you're going to run 500 rounds or more each year at the range, then it is a consideration.
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Last edited by unclenick; 02-08-2010 at 08:05 AM.
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  #3  
Old 02-08-2010, 08:50 AM
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Some things I should add to this post. This gun is for my 14 year son, who is right handed and left eye dominant. I've looked at every rifle make and model offered from bolt to pump. I want this to be something unique that he can hand down to his son. I was diagnosed with colon cancer this winter(I am 41 years young), and although it was caught early it has impressed upon me how special and unique I want this rifle purchase to be. This is one small material thing I want him to remember me by in case things don't go as well as everyone is telling me right now.

I am considering a nikon monarch or zeiss conquest scope but don't know which size or make would work best on this paricular rifle. I would really like to get as much info as possible from all the great experienced individuals who frequent this forum.
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  #4  
Old 02-08-2010, 05:09 PM
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This from the heart; given the same situation, I would vote for the 270. Reason is for how common the ammunition is and the likelyhood that it will last longer.

25-06 is a good cartridge and all. Is also "more likely" to get used as a varmit rig.

Reasons that unclenick posted are very relivent here!

Great gift either way.

Cheezywan
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  #5  
Old 02-08-2010, 06:09 PM
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Your 14 year old son will get tired of carrying a heavy
barreled rifle. Get him something lighter. The Ruger
#1 isn't the most accurate rifle out of the box. I have
one in the heavy barreled model in .223 caliber. It
took two trips to the gunsmith to make it accurate and
for him to do a good trigger. Some of the guys may jump
on me for this, but that was my experience. Now that all
of that is done it is a very nice rifle. It shoots an inch and
better at 100yds.
Zeke
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  #6  
Old 02-08-2010, 09:18 PM
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25/06 is my all time favorite and I have a No. 1B in that caliber. Its very accurate and I'd go with it in a heartbeat again.
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  #7  
Old 02-08-2010, 11:01 PM
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I went with the 25-06 in #1V. I'm not looking back.....




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Last edited by StretchNM; 02-08-2010 at 11:04 PM.
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  #8  
Old 02-08-2010, 11:36 PM
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Here is a suggestion and these suggestion are from years of experience and personal preference. 25-06 is an absolutely amazing caliber and works beautifully on whitetail all over the US in close range or long range. With Ruger no 1 your son would benefit from the 1-B with the 26 inch barrel rather than the varmint. The weight is very different. Though the Ruger no 1's are heavy anyway, they are very solid guns and the extra weight vs. lighter guns is of no consequence in the long run. The 25-06 is versatile as well for varmint long range and target long range but the key to the Ruger no 1 is reloading and the reduction of headspace of the bullet per individual gun and the reloading will increase your accuracy drastically. I have a Ruger No 1 25-06 I have been shooting for years and I have shot consistent groups with factory loads to about 3/4 inch to 1 inch, and with my reloads my father and I worked up, I can shoot and have repeatedly recorded 0.3 inch groups at 100 yards.

As for the 270, it is a good caliber and a strong flat shooter but it has very little versatility compared to a 30-06. A 30-06 can load a range of different weight bullets for a range of game sizes in the deer and elk families. A 270 on the other hand has a limited versatility due to the lack of variety in the bullet weight of that caliber off the shelf or from reloading components.

If you have to chose between the 25-06 and the 270, I would choose the 25-06 every day of the week and twice on Sundays. I would not be scared to hunt anything in the world with my 25-06. It also has a lot to do with how well you know your gun and your load and you personal experience as well as confidence in your gun. Ruger No 1's are fine guns and very special. I have the stainless laminate in 300 Win Mag as well as a standard model in 338 win mag. My brother and I grew up shooting single shots as my father wanted us to learn to make our shots count.

Last edited by Iraqimedic; 02-08-2010 at 11:38 PM.
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  #9  
Old 02-09-2010, 03:13 AM
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whitetail rifle

Quote:
Originally Posted by north1 View Post
Would be used for hunting whitetail deer in open country. Trying to decide between 25-06 or 270 (laminate-stainless) standard, or 25-06 varminter.

Leaning towards the 270 primarily because its cheaper to shoot(don't reload) and its stainless, however, I've been very impressed by hunting parners that have used the 25-06 caliber. Is the varminter version inherintely more accurate because of the heavier barrel? Is the target block scope mounting system better than the type used on the standard? Are there any differences in how the forearms are mounted? Is the weight/balance better or worse in either model? Finally, is the laminate stock mounted the same as the walnut version? Any other info would be greatly appreciated!
several points . a 270 will always hit harder on game in the same hands than a 2506.The last thing you want your boy put off by is wounding game if the shots a bit off. Ruger std laminate will resist twistin better trhan a timber stock .s steel will be easier to clean and last longer.Consider also Browning lever action 270/ 308, a second shot is a mighty handy thing for a newbie .Leupold are hard to beat as is Bushnell 4200 3x9 or 4x12 good luck..
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  #10  
Old 02-09-2010, 06:31 AM
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I've got a 25-06 laminated/stainless for sale right now sporting a a Sightron 4X16X42 for sale right now reduced to $800.00 on a local board if you're interested



http://blacktailcountry.com/forums/i...showtopic=1428

1885
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  #11  
Old 02-09-2010, 08:42 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by markstark View Post
several points . a 270 will always hit harder on game in the same hands than a 2506.The last thing you want your boy put off by is wounding game if the shots a bit off. Ruger std laminate will resist twistin better trhan a timber stock .s steel will be easier to clean and last longer.Consider also Browning lever action 270/ 308, a second shot is a mighty handy thing for a newbie .Leupold are hard to beat as is Bushnell 4200 3x9 or 4x12 good luck..

I will politely disagree, we've hashed this out a million times, but the bottom line is that the .270 doesn't "kill better", because both calibers are way more than is necessary to kill a deer. The .25/06 does have significantly lower recoil and lighter bullets.

Also, nearly all of my rifles have a timber stock, and seeing thousands more, I've NEVER seen a quality stock "twist". Finally, stainless steel still requires maintenance, you still have to clean the bore the same, and SS will still rust if its ignored.
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  #12  
Old 02-09-2010, 11:42 PM
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Well since both are a great choice I'm not even going to try and tell you what you should buy, but just share my thoughts on the options.
Varmint configuration guns tend to shoot better. Reasons that this is the case for me are as a general rule the varmint configuration gun should be built to a higher standard, but aside from that the heavy barrel is easier to be steady with. That could just be my bias because I have several heavy guns and I like how they feel. If a gun feels good and you have a good history with it you will have to confidence that makes you a better shot. That being said, the same may not hold true for your son. He may be more comfortable with the lighter gun and therefore shoot better with it.
As for choice of calibers, both are great deer guns. The 270 is everywhere and you will always be able to find ammo for it wherever you go. The 25-06 has the advantage of starting him out with something out of the norm. It might make him develop an appreciation for ballistics and thinking outside the box. That is good for his future with firearms since he's not stuck with only thinking about the calibers that his friends or the magazines talk up.
Probably a good place to start is by letting him handle and shoulder the heavy and the standard guns to see what feels right to him.
As for the left eye dominant part all I can say is good luck. It took a few years but I figured out that was my wife's problem. I'm still trying to get her over it. The boy being young and maybe a little more open minded than my wife may be willing to try more things like a patch over the left eye when you go shooting.
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  #13  
Old 02-10-2010, 06:39 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 45_70Sharps View Post
..........
As for choice of calibers, both are great deer guns. The 270 is everywhere and you will always be able to find ammo for it wherever you go. The 25-06 has the advantage of starting him out with something out of the norm. It might make him develop an appreciation for ballistics and thinking outside the box. That is good for his future with firearms since he's not stuck with only thinking about the calibers that his friends or the magazines talk up.
...........
That's an interesting take that I agree with (I just realized), but would never have thought of myself.
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  #14  
Old 02-10-2010, 07:44 PM
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I may be wrong on this, but to my knowledge the varminter in 25-06 weighs the same as the 270 with the 26" barrel. I guess it comes down to how the rifles are balanced, especially when adding a scope.

Now for scopes I am considering either a zeiss conquest 3-9x40 rapid z or a nikon monarch 2.5-10x42. Both scopes offer 4" of eye relief but I think zeiss opics are clearer and like the reticle setup better.
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  #15  
Old 02-10-2010, 11:26 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by north1 View Post
I may be wrong on this, but to my knowledge the varminter in 25-06 weighs the same as the 270 with the 26" barrel. I guess it comes down to how the rifles are balanced, especially when adding a scope.
I just looked and you are right. The 25-06 varminter is lighter than the other varmint calibers. Probably because it has the bigger hole in the middle of the barrel.
Same weight as the 270 standard.

Last edited by 45_70Sharps; 02-10-2010 at 11:33 PM.
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  #16  
Old 02-16-2010, 03:32 PM
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While I no longer have it,

and that is another story, about 30 yrs ago I had a #1 in 25-06. It was the standard model. All my other #1's were V. Taht would be 223, 22-250, 243. Can't remember which Leupold on the 25-06 but it was a variable. The others were 12XLeupold's with the CPC fine wire cross hair. They were staright varmint guns and that is all I used them for. A friend and I would re-load all winter for two weekends worth of shooting up in LAke Co, CA at this fellows cattle ranch. WE generally murdered ground squirrels at short to ridiculous ranges. The 22-250 was a great gun, but I loved that 25-06. Today I would take it again in the standard as it is giving a 26" vs 24" barrel on the V. It handled extremely well and shot real well. I was a better shot because I had confidence in that gun.

To your sons rt hand/left eye issue. I too have that issue. When I carry and snap shoot I have to do it rt handed. Never had the co-ordination to do it from the left eye and I worked at it. When I shoot from a rest or at least in position, I do it left handed. My rt eye is heavily astigmatic, which means I can't see a darned thing without specs, and they have to be properly positioned. With iron sights I have to shoot lefty. Taht has become an age issue as well, but I can pick up irons with my left and can't see the front sight with my right. Anyway, for the most part for me it is the eye, not the hand that rules. You and your son are fortunate to know this at an early age. I didn't really understand this issue until I was in my late 20's. AS you can see it has made for some interesting combinations for me. The reason I tell this is that while you understand the issue, do you thoroughly understand how his vision issue will impact different activities. He is lucky that you guys get it!

This is my first post on this forum. I think your son will love a #1 25-06 in the standard config. As well, it would be hard to argue with the 270. Given your situation, it doesn't make a **** what it is. It comes from you and that is what will matter. I wish you and your family the best in this task you have before you. My prayers are with you all!
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  #17  
Old 02-17-2010, 12:14 PM
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Twist?

What's the rate of twist on the .25-06? It's not a cartridge I'm really familiar with, but with cartridges that bridge varmint/deer, manufacturers seem to barrel for the lighter bullets (see .243 Win). I generally prefer the heavier bullets so I can never find rifles I'm perfectly satisfied with.

In .25, I'd want to be able to shoot the 115-120gr bullets accurately, and I'd think you'd need a fairly aggressive twist to stabilize them. 1-9"?

I could easily be wrong here since I don't know the .25-06 at all.
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  #18  
Old 02-17-2010, 02:36 PM
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Ruger uses a 1-10" twist, but each rifle has its own preference of bullets. Mine all seem to like 110-115 grain bullets, while some guys achieve success with 75-90 grain bullets. I have shot the 90s and they do okay in my guns, but I don't varmint with my 25/06s anymore, so I don't shoot them.
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