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  #1  
Old 11-18-2007, 04:43 AM
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Thumbs up 358 Wssm


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I'm a new member. I love wildcatting in WSSM cartridge. Just built 3 win. 70's in .358 cal. on douglas barrels. I'm working on load dev. right now. using 180g. horn. sp bullet, 44 gr. benchmark and getting around 2700 fps. This bullet is Indiana legal this year for deer hunting.

Last edited by sonex184; 11-26-2007 at 04:38 PM.
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  #2  
Old 11-18-2007, 01:49 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sonex184
I'm a new member. I love widcatting in WSSM cartridge. Just built 3 win. 70's in .358 cal. on douglas barrels. I'm working on load dev. right now. using 180g. horn. sp bullet, 44 gr. benchmark and getting around 2700 fps. This bullet is Indiana legal this year for deer hunting.
How do you like the douglas barrel im building a 30-378 weatherby with a 30" barrel it still under construction but need feed back on barrel quality
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  #3  
Old 11-18-2007, 02:18 PM
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douglas barrels that i've used so far are pretty accurate. I've used 6 of there barrels so far.
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  #4  
Old 11-18-2007, 02:20 PM
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Anyone out there with any good load sugguestions out there let me know.
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  #5  
Old 11-19-2007, 12:22 PM
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Location: Northern Ontario
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Quote:
Originally Posted by buk-master
How do you like the douglas barrel im building a 30-378 weatherby with a 30" barrel it still under construction but need feed back on barrel quality
I have 3 from them. 30-06, 243 and I had send them an action since I didn't have the reamer, for a .375X284.
Groups as ragged holes when you do your part of load developing.
In other words...GREAT Barrels.
I'm still deciding on my next project on a Martini action for either .375/303 or .375/348 as a Lead "boolit" shooter!

I can recommend the Douglas Barrels! Since you want to build a "Barrel Burner", I would suggest to have the barrel "Cryo-Treated" since it would about double your barrel life.
http://www.thermtech.net/cryo-treat.html
http://www.onecryo.com/firearms.htm

Last edited by northwolf; 11-19-2007 at 12:24 PM.
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  #6  
Old 11-24-2007, 07:58 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by northwolf
I have 3 from them. 30-06, 243 and I had send them an action since I didn't have the reamer, for a .375X284.
Groups as ragged holes when you do your part of load developing.
In other words...GREAT Barrels.
I'm still deciding on my next project on a Martini action for either .375/303 or .375/348 as a Lead "boolit" shooter!

I can recommend the Douglas Barrels! Since you want to build a "Barrel Burner", I would suggest to have the barrel "Cryo-Treated" since it would about double your barrel life.
http://www.thermtech.net/cryo-treat.html
http://www.onecryo.com/firearms.htm
With 225 accubonds,

H335 most velocity, but wouldn't group
N530 good velocity, groups ok, Im using this
H322 No
R7 NO
H4198 good velocity, seemed spiky
primers didn't seem to make any diff.

After hunting season I will start working with this again. I think with 225's, some thing of varget speed but more dense will be about right.
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  #7  
Old 11-25-2007, 04:45 AM
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358 wssm reloads

Quote:
Originally Posted by lukehalee
With 225 accubonds,

H335 most velocity, but wouldn't group
N530 good velocity, groups ok, Im using this
H322 No
R7 NO
H4198 good velocity, seemed spiky
primers didn't seem to make any diff.

After hunting season I will start working with this again. I think with 225's, some thing of varget speed but more dense will be about right.
Youv got me wondering, have you been shooting a 358 wssm for a while? My win 70 has shot 3 deer between me and my 2 boys, and they have been 1 shot per deer. I could'nt be happier. Here are some of my loads.
180 grain hornady...........Win. 70 24" douglas barrel
imr 4198............44g.........2630fps
rl-7....................44g max..
AA2015..............50g.........2675fps
H4895..............48g..........2600fps
varget...............51g max....2600fps
N135.................51g...........not done testing yet
benchmark........48 g..........2640fps

This is some of the loads I'm working with at the moment.
The N135 shows some promise of hitting 2800 fps . I need to chron. this powder yet to see. Are you from Indiana? Why do you shoot this cartridge? I'm going to do a AR-15 in this cal. this winter. I've got 3 more Win 70 's to build right now.
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  #8  
Old 11-25-2007, 05:06 PM
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Location: Greenville, IN
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lukehalee what kind of velocity are you getting. I started with the WSSM but went WSM cutdown and formed .358 Grant. It holds 1.5 grians more water than a .358 WIN. Chamber 1.625" trim 1.615". Only tried two powders right now. Reamer is set up for 225 GR. ACCU- Bond
IMR 4895 started to show pressure at 2600 FPS @ 90 deg.outside shot .5" goups at 2550 FPS.
BLC-2 2400 Fps 5 of 8 groups @.25" other 3 under .5' no pressure at all but case is full. Used this load for this year ran out of time. Going to try more powders after season. Opening weekend 8 pointer and 2 does. All three droped in their tracks. Shoulder shots through both shoulders on all 3 exit holes size of a quarter. Please keep me posted if you find any powders that get good vel. and groups. I'm in southern IN
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  #9  
Old 11-26-2007, 04:10 AM
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fire forming

Quote:
Originally Posted by D Grant
lukehalee what kind of velocity are you getting. I started with the WSSM but went WSM cutdown and formed .358 Grant. It holds 1.5 grians more water than a .358 WIN. Chamber 1.625" trim 1.615". Only tried two powders right now. Reamer is set up for 225 GR. ACCU- Bond
IMR 4895 started to show pressure at 2600 FPS @ 90 deg.outside shot .5" goups at 2550 FPS.
BLC-2 2400 Fps 5 of 8 groups @.25" other 3 under .5' no pressure at all but case is full. Used this load for this year ran out of time. Going to try more powders after season. Opening weekend 8 pointer and 2 does. All three droped in their tracks. Shoulder shots through both shoulders on all 3 exit holes size of a quarter. Please keep me posted if you find any powders that get good vel. and groups. I'm in southern IN
Hey ,thanks for sharing the info I'll keep you posted on any new data. I read some of your other posts. Sounds very interesting. I fire formed all my brass out of 25 wssm brass and annealed the necks . I put 8 grs. of bullseye and filled case with long grain rice. Than inserted in rifle in upright position so rice don't fall out and fired. only lost 1 case out of 50. I'm from peru, IN. area.
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  #10  
Old 11-28-2007, 07:47 PM
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sorry i forgot about this post.

i have only shot 200 and 225 grain bullets. the 200 were hornady interlocks and they didnt group.

partitions and accubonds are all around 3/4 inch.

the problem i have had is cases getting real tight too soon. i have learned that this is a std wssm issue.

in talking with some sharp ppl this is what i am hearing.

- brass is too hard and too thick. doesnt have the elasticity to come back
- large head diam puts more of the psi on the bolt head
- head to case length ratio has exceed good design. not enough case length grabbing chamber wall.
- extra large case diam removes enough barrel matl that barrels flex out, then come back and grab the case.

given all of that i am getting 358 win ballistics (2400 - 2450fps) and given indiana contraints, might be as good as we can do.

grant, like you, i ran out of time and have gone with N530 for now. I do want to try blc and 4895 and some imr i cant think of right now. maybe n540 also.

what was your reason for the wsm cases, capacity?

im in jasper, where are you? crane? i might have heard about you.

it does have 3 one shot kills so far.

any of you guys having the tight case problem?
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  #11  
Old 11-29-2007, 02:04 AM
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tight cases

Quote:
Originally Posted by lukehalee
sorry i forgot about this post.

i have only shot 200 and 225 grain bullets. the 200 were hornady interlocks and they didnt group.

partitions and accubonds are all around 3/4 inch.

the problem i have had is cases getting real tight too soon. i have learned that this is a std wssm issue.

in talking with some sharp ppl this is what i am hearing.

- brass is too hard and too thick. doesnt have the elasticity to come back
- large head diam puts more of the psi on the bolt head
- head to case length ratio has exceed good design. not enough case length grabbing chamber wall.
- extra large case diam removes enough barrel matl that barrels flex out, then come back and grab the case.

given all of that i am getting 358 win ballistics (2400 - 2450fps) and given indiana contraints, might be as good as we can do.

grant, like you, i ran out of time and have gone with N530 for now. I do want to try blc and 4895 and some imr i cant think of right now. maybe n540 also.

what was your reason for the wsm cases, capacity?

im in jasper, where are you? crane? i might have heard about you.

it does have 3 one shot kills so far.

any of you guys having the tight case problem?
No tight cases here. Shot some cases 10-12 times. Brass is thicker than standard. one of the guys i built gun for over heated cases when he annealed them. He had cases sticking in rifle, he had to beat them out with a dowel rod. When annealing I set cases on a piece of metal and only heat from shoulder up. Might be your problem. Keep info rolling that is the way we learn. Thanks, Ben
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  #12  
Old 11-29-2007, 09:35 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sonex184
No tight cases here. Shot some cases 10-12 times. Brass is thicker than standard. one of the guys i built gun for over heated cases when he annealed them. He had cases sticking in rifle, he had to beat them out with a dowel rod. When annealing I set cases on a piece of metal and only heat from shoulder up. Might be your problem. Keep info rolling that is the way we learn. Thanks, Ben
I didn't anneal. Tried it on a few. I got my expanders from k and m and they worked well wo annealing. Only split one. What action and barrel are you using?
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  #13  
Old 11-29-2007, 03:21 PM
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action & barrel

Quote:
Originally Posted by lukehalee
I didn't anneal. Tried it on a few. I got my expanders from k and m and they worked well wo annealing. Only split one. What action and barrel are you using?
I'm using a winchester mdl. 70 in a wssm. you can buy them for about $400.00 . they ussually come in 223 wssm or 25 wssm cal. I'm using douglas premium barrels. Best groups so far have been 5/8" using 45Gr of reloader 19. with 180gr hornadys. I loaded up some 200gr barnes bullets using 47.5gr of vit 135. If you look up 350 winchester in hornady reloading book you can pretty much follow it for loads , + or - a few grains. Maybe sat I can chrono these loads and check for accuracy. Do you think the 200grain bullets shoot better and are they more accurate? I'm pretty sure I can get 2800 fps with the 180gr hornadys.

Last edited by sonex184; 11-29-2007 at 03:25 PM.
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  #14  
Old 11-29-2007, 05:17 PM
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Location: Greenville, IN
Posts: 66
The necks on the wssm cases showed alot of cracks or stress marks before expanding. Went with wsm brass and made the body longer and the neck shorter with a 40 deg. shoulder. Hornady made the forming and sizing dies. It's 4 step forming plus inside neck reaming, annealing,& fire forming. 100 peices of brass all formed good. 20 peices shot 12 times during testing. Annealing and inside reaming keeps necks nice. I called VihtaVuori and they suggested N530 & N540. That is my next step. The 225 Accu- Bond works perfect and very good accuracy. Barrels are Lilja 1 - 12"
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  #15  
Old 11-29-2007, 05:31 PM
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lukehalee main reasons was bad brass and case capacity. I have had no problem with tight cases. Custom dies full length size . I did weight out brass, did primer pockets, and debur flash holes. I have got to over 2600 fps with 225 ACCU-bonds it was 90 deg out and showed very little pressure not tightest groups but would be fine for hunting. I am from Greenville and hunt privet land Northwest of English. I can e-mail you prints of my reamer if you want. JGS made the reamer Hornady has prints for forming & sizing dies. It's called .358 GRANT
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  #16  
Old 11-29-2007, 05:33 PM
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I ran out of time and didn't get to do too much with the 200's, but for my high end A&B barrel, the Nosler 225's groups came immediately, so I went with them.

I mainly used faster powders because thats what I had, but reading the posts here, I will try some slower stuff.

Friend wants to buy my gun, so I will probably be building another one. Will go with a larger tenon and probably shilen or douglas for the next one.

Has anybody heard anything about cartridge rule revisions?
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  #17  
Old 12-03-2007, 04:09 AM
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Lukehalee, I haven't heard of any, but here's where I look for info. http://www.in.gov/dnr/fishwild/about/rules.html
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  #18  
Old 12-09-2007, 04:55 AM
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deer kills?

Hey how did everyone do this hunting season? Did your 358's do their job? Any updates? I reloaded some more different loads , haven't had time to shoot yet. I plugged a 10 pt. 169 2/8 class buck at 150 yds. . He was coming right at me at a walk. Took shot right under the base of the neck. I dropped like a rock. I'm very pleased with the performance . I got 5 more rifles to build . Any stories? Boys got 2 does , 1 at 160 yds., the other at 60 yds. both were lung shots. They both were down before they went 50 yds.. My 12 yr. old just got a 8 pt. with my savage muzzle loader, his first deer.
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  #19  
Old 12-09-2007, 05:51 PM
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I got a buck and doe, both under a 100yds. Both shots in the heart,,, I guess, nothing left of it. Both dropped with out a step. Friend borrowed my rifle and took a doe through the lungs. Ran 30 yds and dropped. I am building him one of these now.
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  #20  
Old 12-13-2007, 03:06 AM
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AR 15 in 358 wssm!

I got my barrel back from white oak for my ar15 in the 358 cal. . It's all put together and ready to shoot. If I get time today I'll see if it fires and cycles. I hope i got the gas port hole the right size. It was a 25 cal. olympic arms and I took the the thing apart hoping to get this 358 wssm going for deer season. I'll let you'all know if it works out ok. Still waiting on 6 barrels coming from douglas for the win 70's.
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