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  #1  
Old 03-31-2012, 05:07 AM
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7x57 Ackley Improved


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As a young man my family was not too well off.But we ate good qn the farm and my Dad always
always made do.
Somehow he finageled a Win 94 25-35 and it got me a nice blacktail buck at the ripe age of 8 years old.Man was my father proud because all the other kids were older.
Then for my birthday he got me a Rolling block 7x57.
Shortened the barrel and put a Redfield peep on.It was like a small carbine.Way cool.
I've had a couple more 7x57 through the years.
Forward to 2012, just picked up a Ruger 77 tang safety long action, the perfect gun for an Improved cartridge.I will be able to seat the bullets out.
Shot it yesterday and does it shoot.Used Nosler 120 grain bal.tips with 46.75 grns RL15
Any one else have one of these?
Randy
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  #2  
Old 03-31-2012, 07:17 AM
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Well, I can't say I have one of those, but that sure is a cool story on how you got yours. I hope you get a nice buck with it this fall and the whole thing comes full circle for ya.

Last edited by broom_jm; 04-02-2012 at 03:12 AM.
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  #3  
Old 03-31-2012, 08:33 AM
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7x57 and 7mm-08 are two chambering I'd love to have. Although I've never owned 7x57 I had a .257R and a ,257AI which are decendents of the 7x57...all of the above are great rounds in my opinion
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  #4  
Old 03-31-2012, 09:59 AM
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Had a Brazilan 1908 Mauser in 7x57 that was rechambered to A.I. Used 160 gr bullets to anchor a couple of elk and deer with one shot each. The 7mm AI was extremely accurate and only a bit slower than the 7 RM that I owned, also. The original military barrel finaly gave way, so to have something different, had a Shilen SS fluted bbl chambered in 6.5-06 installed.

There's no moss growing on a 7mm AI, if you desire one.
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  #5  
Old 03-31-2012, 11:17 AM
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measure three times and cut once

Hi Nifrand, and welcome to the wildcat forum threads.
I think you might reconsider this re-chambering job.

1. This is probably your first 7x 57 Mauser with a true sporting rifle chamber.

2. If you even throat it out, you will degrade it to the old military chamber cut for the really long 175 gr. bullets. But I don't know if our modern classic 175 gr. RN loaded ammo has a two diameter bullet. So, why don't you buy a box of Hornady classic ammo with the long 175 gr. bullet and see if it will chamber in your Ruger. If so, then see what kind of groups they cut.

3. The Hornady Light mag 7x57 Mauser ammo, is finicky, but it just may shoot fine in your sporting chamber, and your Ruger bolt rifle is fine with it.

4. As others in this forum have noted, the A.I. concept requires you to set your stock barrel back a thread, to where the Go Gauge becomes a no go, and the factory loaded 7mm Mauser ammo now becomes your Go gauge. And going the other way, with a Rem 7mm Express, creates a dangerous situation, where the original 7mm Mauser cartridge would still accidentally chamber.

I ran into this with my 8mm x 06, re-chambered from a military 8mm Mauser. You can't ever have the shorter round anywhere near your shooting bench. So, if you have a tack driver as is, maybe you should leave it "as is". You can't help but mess with the factory bedding when you cut back your barrel to get the proper head spacing for the A.I. chamber.

A couple of days ago, I phoned the Ruger tech. line, over whether my MK II, 270win. might have an oversize barrel. There was a problem before about 2001-2. After that, Ruger has done all their barrels in house. So, there are a few early MKII's out there, along with some of the tang safeties, that have oversized pockets in their bores. It sounds like yours is O.K., and my serial #, puts mine later.

The rub is that a rule of thumb said that letting these bad barrels get really, really, dirty, was the only way to get them to shoot. My stainless hammer forged barrel was absolutely filthy, and that's why I was worried enough to phone Ruger. But it's mirror clean today, and now I'm going to play with getting a load with the lighter Barnes copper TTSX bullets to print a tight group.

This is the game changer, that you may want to try with your 7x57. While you do lose some velocity with all weights of copper, you make it back up with the deeper penetration of these homogenous bullets. The Ruger tech thought I would have a good chance, using the Barnes, with my 270, and I believe if you phone in, you will get the same reply, as long as you already have an accurate barrel.

Right now, you are miles ahead of your previous military 7x57 chambered rifles. And that old Remmie Roller, never did have correct head space for modern 7x57 Mauser ammo, unless it's barrel had been set back, and re-chambered. My Federal 110gr. TTSX ammo boxes show game up to Buck Deer, but not Elk. And for some unknown reason, they show the icon of a medium sized African plains game head.

So, right now, you have some wicked ways to gin up lethal combinations, which may work out of your particular rifle, and out-perform the older 140-160 gr. lead cored, 7mm Mauser ammunition.

The icing on this cake is that by using H-4895, and these light Barnes bullets, you can make up Youth Loads, somewhere in between full power and 60% of the manuals', Maximum printed loads. The lighter bullets won't change impacts as bad as down loading a standard weight bullet, which hangs in the barrel too long. The trick is to find out which load in this range will group best with your own rifle.

So, good luck and good shooting.
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  #6  
Old 03-31-2012, 03:53 PM
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The first rifle I bought was a Montgomery Wards sporterized 7x57 Mauser. It loved the 175 gr factory loads and hated the 140 gr loads but I still I killed a lot of White Tail with it. I finally had it re-barreled and tricked it out a bit in the late 80's and I had it throated for 140 gr bullets. It was also one of the first rounds I cut my reloading teeth on and it is still my go to rifle for White Tail and it is very accurate. If your Ruger shoots the lighter bullets well, I wouldn't see a real need to AI it unless you really want one or are looking for a little more down range oomph than what the newer +P loads offer or what you can load up to yourself. The 7x57 round is a inherently accurate round and I doubt you would see any improvements of accuracy by going to an AI version of that round.
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  #7  
Old 04-01-2012, 11:27 AM
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Rechamber

Well guys thanks a bunch for all your input.That being said, as we speak the Rifle is being rechambered for the 7x57Ackley Improved.One reason is that is a long action and I can seat the bullets out.
Again thanks for the opinions.I will keep you posted
Randy
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  #8  
Old 04-01-2012, 10:29 PM
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Nifrand

I hope it all works out for you. Please get back to this thread with some groups, shooting factory rounds to make the A.I. improved ones. I know I'm happy with my 270 Ruger MKII, and your A.I. will be awful close to mine. Barnes new #4 reloading manual says to only use their longest 7mm bullets with twists of 1 in 9 or faster. Using lead cored bullets will get around this. But I do agree that the 7s57mm Mauser should be put into standard length bolt actions, like yours.
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  #9  
Old 04-02-2012, 08:32 PM
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I have a Win model 70 classic that started out as a 30-06 fwt. I bought a take off Win model 70 fwt barrel chambered in 7mm-08 and had it rechambered to 7x57 AI. With the long action, it was chambered to be able to stretch COAL for the larger bullets and shoots them very well in fireforming loads. It also shoots down to the 139 grain bullets very well.I haven't tried 120 grain bullets yet but am very pleased with the modification so far. I have fireformed about 200 cases so far and am just getting started with actual load development.
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  #10  
Old 04-06-2012, 04:48 PM
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Well weather cooperated and I went to the range yesterday.I am very pleased with the rifle so far.Shot some 120 grain Nosler ballistic tip, and they all touched.Shot some Nosler 150 grain ballistic tip and they were on then same point of impact and all almost touching.
Using RL15 with the 120's and 4064 with the 150's. Also found out the rifle has a Timney trigger.No wonder I can shoot it.
I am going to marry it, the next time I get the chance.
Does any one know what the twist is on this? It was made in 1980 7x57.

Thanks Randy
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  #11  
Old 04-07-2012, 10:02 AM
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right in front of you

Nifrand,
If you have the rifle, just fit a tight cleaning patch, mark the top dead center of the cleaning rod, and pull it through until the mark is again at top dead center. Then measure the distance for one complete turn in the riflings. This way, you are sure of what you have got. Just remember that the tip can unscrew, if you pull it through, the wrong way.

The Ruger tech told me that they made all their barrels in house, after 2001. So yours might have come from a custom barrel shop. But if it's as accurate as you claim, it has to be a good one.
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  #12  
Old 04-07-2012, 11:05 AM
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Randy, My first Ackley was the 7x57AI on a ruger tang safety action early 1980's supposedly they had 1/9.5 twist barrels.

I got most of my data out of Speer wildcat manual #4 and I still have my data and velocity. Lightest bullet I shot was the 145gr @ 2991fps and heaviest was the 175gr @2762fps and those were max loads.

I got 8 boxes of RWS 7x57 brass and I still have 4boxes of that brass that was never fireformed.

I worked up some loads for the 7x57 using 140gr bullets as I didn't plan or having it rechamber but things worked out for the best. Well good luck
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  #13  
Old 04-18-2012, 01:45 PM
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Many years ago I ask Parker what he thought was the best all around cartridge he played with and he felt the 7X57 AI was the best balanced and would handle a large range of bullet weights.
I have a reamer but haven't made another one up.I owned one several years ago and it shot very well,for some reason I let it get away.I have a 280 AI now and like it.I think with the 7X57 AI you could get away with a 22 inch barrel and make up a dandy mountain rifle.
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  #14  
Old 04-18-2012, 04:16 PM
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So basicaly it is pretty much a 280 that you have to fire form cases for, and order special dies for, right? Not to be rude but why?

Last edited by fritz1; 04-18-2012 at 04:49 PM.
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  #15  
Old 04-19-2012, 01:27 AM
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Why

When I did a trade a year ago I got a set of dies for the Ackley 7mm.That is one reason I did the rechamber.It has worked out well for me.Not a lot of money spent for a cool round.Plus I did not want a 280.

Randy
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  #16  
Old 04-19-2012, 04:02 AM
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Nifrand, I'm curios about how much of a performance gain you have gotten with the AI upgrade. I'm sure the accuracy is going to excellent but I would really like to see what kind of velocity gains you're getting compared to the standard round. Keep us updated on your load development and enjoy your new hotrod.
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  #17  
Old 04-19-2012, 09:42 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by nifrand View Post
When I did a trade a year ago I got a set of dies for the Ackley 7mm.That is one reason I did the rechamber.It has worked out well for me.Not a lot of money spent for a cool round.Plus I did not want a 280.

Randy
It should be a real sweetheart. But for not wanting a 280, you shure made a round that comes as close to being one as you can get. I would be interested to see what kind of velocities you get out of it. It should be real close to a 280.
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  #18  
Old 04-20-2012, 12:57 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by fritz1 View Post
So basicaly it is pretty much a 280 that you have to fire form cases for, and order special dies for, right? Not to be rude but why?
With the Ackley Improved rounds you can fire standard cartridges in the AI chamber,you lose a little velocity,the chambers have the same head space.With the AI I find I don't have to trim the necks as much because with the straight chamber and steep shoulder the brass doesn't grow as fast.Parker was able to get well over 3000 fps with 140 gr bullets,but knowing Parker the pressures would be high.But a person could make up a 6 1/2 to 7 lb mountian rifle without a lot of recoil.
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  #19  
Old 04-20-2012, 03:49 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by fritz1 View Post
So basicaly it is pretty much a 280 that you have to fire form cases for, and order special dies for, right? Not to be rude but why?

You coulc ask the same question about almost every wildcat that has ever been designed.

With a wildcat, especially the AI rounds, the better question is almost always... "Why not?"
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  #20  
Old 05-27-2012, 06:38 AM
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Update

I have an update on the 7x57 imp.Put a new Boyds laminated thumbhole on her and a Leupold
VX III 3.5x10.Headed for the range.Shot some 120grNosler Ballistic tips over 46gr RL15.Then shot some 150grn Noslers under 43grs RL15.The 150's shoot 1" higher at 100yds.I'm going to get me a camera so I can post them.
Bottem line it really shoots.I"ll have to borrow a chrony from one of the members of my Gun club.I have to check out this bad boy.
Next comes the 160 grainers.
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