What is old is new again? (M16a1 furniture on an AR15?) - Shooters Forum
» Advanced

Go Back   Shooters Forum > Rifle and Rifle Cartridges > Black Rifles
Register FAQ Members List Donate Calendar Search Today's Posts Mark Forums Read



Like Tree2Likes
  • 1 Post By Wrench Man
  • 1 Post By nvshooter
Reply
 
LinkBack Thread Tools Rate Thread Display Modes
  #1  
Old 05-13-2017, 07:01 PM
Registered User
 
Join Date: May 2017
Posts: 5
Question What is old is new again? (M16a1 furniture on an AR15?)


Registered Users do not see the above ad.


I am building My first AR and I was digging around on gunbroker and found a guy selling some M16A1 non demilled furniture sets. So what I am wondering I if there is a way to use the old furniture with new off the shelf components? Like can I just buy a buffer tube and install it no problem or will I have to modify it is what I am asking. Any help would be greatly appreciated thank you.
Reply With Quote
  #2  
Old 05-13-2017, 07:15 PM
Beartooth Regular
 
Join Date: Oct 2012
Location: SE New Mexico
Posts: 2,396
Should be doable. Most "A2" tubes are actually just A1's. You just use a little extension on them to mount the A2 stock

BROWNELLS AR-15/M16 A1 RIFLE BUFFER TUBE ASSEMBLY | Brownells

This should work for you.
Reply With Quote
  #3  
Old 05-13-2017, 10:20 PM
Wrench Man's Avatar
Beartooth Regular
 
Join Date: Nov 2005
Location: Eugene Orygun
Posts: 1,248
Your rifle will also have to have the triangular handguard cap, assuming the furniture set has the triangular handguards.
Trent12 likes this.
__________________
ASE master certified engine machinist, gas & diesel
I drive
International's
Rambler's
Jeep's
& the Yamaha
Reply With Quote
 
  #4  
Old 05-14-2017, 07:57 AM
Registered User
 
Join Date: May 2017
Posts: 5
Quote:
Originally Posted by Wrench Man View Post
Your rifle will also have to have the triangular handguard cap, assuming the furniture set has the triangular handguards.
So the hand guard needs a special cap, ok now is that something that can be bought or do I have to make it?
Reply With Quote
  #5  
Old 05-14-2017, 08:38 AM
nvshooter's Avatar
Beartooth Regular
 
Join Date: Oct 2010
Location: Nevada
Posts: 4,595
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tula13 View Post
So the hand guard needs a special cap. OK. Now, is that something that can be bought or do I have to make it?
You can buy it. About four bucks from Brownells. The problem is in getting the A-frame sight base off (and back on) if you want your rifle to keep the 1960s look. The base is pinned on with two taper pins. Drive them out first, then use a hydraulic press to press off the base. Trying to hammer it off will just bugger-up the end of the barrel. Your best bet is to have a gunsmith do the work. He'll do it right the first time, which will save you some time & money over the long term...
Trent12 likes this.
__________________
"Socialism is atheism disguised as a political philosophy." Christopher Hitchens
Reply With Quote
  #6  
Old 05-14-2017, 09:49 AM
Beartooth Regular
 
Join Date: Oct 2012
Location: SE New Mexico
Posts: 2,396
Quote:
Originally Posted by nvshooter View Post
You can buy it. About four bucks from Brownells. The problem is in getting the A-frame sight base off (and back on) if you want your rifle to keep the 1960s look. The base is pinned on with two taper pins. Drive them out first, then use a hydraulic press to press off the base. Trying to hammer it off will just bugger-up the end of the barrel. Your best bet is to have a gunsmith do the work. He'll do it right the first time, which will save you some time & money over the long term...
I've never had to hammer off an A frame front sight after removing the pins. But even then, it shouldn't do much to tap it off with a rubber mallet and a little penetrating oil. What brand rifle did your A frame front sight not come off on? I've done a few colts, a PSA, and a BCM and they all came right off after knocking out the taper pins. The gas block shouldn't be tight enough to need to be pressed off.

I'm not doubting you, just wondering as I've never seen one that didn't just slide off with hand pressure. Different manufacturers do different things though, yours may have had some locktite or rockset or something on it?
Reply With Quote
  #7  
Old 05-14-2017, 11:13 AM
Wrench Man's Avatar
Beartooth Regular
 
Join Date: Nov 2005
Location: Eugene Orygun
Posts: 1,248
An "A3" rifle will most likely already have a triangular forend cap, the "A3 Government Profile" kits I got from DELTON do, I purchased a new cap and pleasantly found out that I didn't need to change it out.
__________________
ASE master certified engine machinist, gas & diesel
I drive
International's
Rambler's
Jeep's
& the Yamaha
Reply With Quote
  #8  
Old 05-14-2017, 12:37 PM
Registered User
 
Join Date: May 2017
Posts: 5
Ok I am just going to see if i understand what I have been told so far. The stock will fit fine with a standard A2 buffer tube, the pistol grip will need the standard hardware for a pistol grip, The handgun will need a triangular cap?
Ok now the new question I have come across with my own research I have heard about issues with the A2 handgaurd and modern gas blocks, has anyone heard or even better seen what this means?
Reply With Quote
  #9  
Old 05-14-2017, 04:47 PM
nvshooter's Avatar
Beartooth Regular
 
Join Date: Oct 2010
Location: Nevada
Posts: 4,595
Quote:
Originally Posted by Trent12 View Post
I'm not doubting you, just wondering as I've never seen one that didn't just slide off with hand pressure. Different manufacturers do different things though, yours may have had some loctite or rockset or something on it?
It was a 16" carbine barrel. I have no idea who made the barrel or what. I hammered the A-frame off way, way back in August of 1983. I succeeded in buggering-over the end of the barrel. The thread was destroyed and the edges of the half-inch portion were rounded-over. It was a total waste of time and money because I just put the original 20" barrel back onto the upper, put the triangular furniture back on, put the A1 fixed stock back on and sold the rifle-- a Colt SP-1-- at a pawn shop for a lot less than I'd paid for it in April of 1983. This was back in the days of very little in the way of "radical" accessories being available. I think the A3 flat-top had just become available. I looked at it, and wondered why anyone would ever buy such a dopey-looking thing. Now, the flat-top is the only kind I'll buy. Thirty-four years has brought us so many add-ons and accessories for our favorite rifle. Thank God that America is capitalist. We've never had gotten any of this stuff were we not.
__________________
"Socialism is atheism disguised as a political philosophy." Christopher Hitchens
Reply With Quote
  #10  
Old 05-16-2017, 06:01 PM
Registered User
 
Join Date: May 2017
Posts: 5
Ok so I wasn't able to get them at the pawn shop like I hoped but I found these on gunbroker.


So I can see that the back of the handguard looks like it would take a standard round cap so I am assuming that the triangle one is meant to go on the other side.
Reply With Quote
  #11  
Old 05-18-2017, 09:01 AM
nvshooter's Avatar
Beartooth Regular
 
Join Date: Oct 2010
Location: Nevada
Posts: 4,595
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tula13 View Post
I can see that the back of the handguard looks like it would take a standard round cap, so I am assuming that the triangle one is meant to go on the other side.
The standard, toothed barrel nut aligns the rear of the handguard, while the weld spring and delta ring assembly secure it. The triangular cap secures the front; the weld spring forces the handguards into the cap.

The Vietnam-era handguards have been superseded by the round guards or even by the aluminum tube. This is because the original guards do not allow for the attachment of Picatinny rails and/or any other type of add-on. My guess is you'll soon replace the ancient guards with something newer. If you do put a triangular cap on your rifle and later decide to upgrade your handguards, the Mag-pul MOE guards will accept the triangular cap.
__________________
"Socialism is atheism disguised as a political philosophy." Christopher Hitchens
Reply With Quote
  #12  
Old 05-18-2017, 11:19 AM
Registered User
 
Join Date: May 2017
Posts: 6
taper pins, you need to figure out which is the small end and drive them out from that side.

pretty sure the round hand guards will work with either triangle or round end cap?

easiest way is to make sure you're getting a barrel assy with the triangle end cap already on it

grip screws are all the same but the A2/E2 uses a spacer and longer screw for a longer length of pull. some screws have a water drain hole in them some don't. the longer A2/E2 screw will work in the A1 butt as the extra length will just continue to the center area of the buffer spring, no foul

personally i love the vintage furniture, i wish i'd've grabbed some of the old beat up Green painted Bakelite when i had the chance. if you want to get really retro check out nodakspud retro parts and they have some links to resources like http://www.retroblackrifle.com/
Reply With Quote
  #13  
Old 05-18-2017, 12:37 PM
Registered User
 
Join Date: May 2017
Posts: 5
Quote:
Originally Posted by BottleNeckJimmy View Post
taper pins, you need to figure out which is the small end and drive them out from that side.
Are we talking about the ones on the gas block or are there ones on the handguards?
Reply With Quote
  #14  
Old 05-18-2017, 03:09 PM
Registered User
 
Join Date: May 2017
Posts: 6
in the sight base/gas block

you can usually tell w/o magnification which end is which. standard assy procedure is that they should always be put in from one direction but i forget which way ATM. youtube is your friend, FF to 3:00 https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mIDb7CZkfQ4

the guy is stuck on roll pin punches which are nice but not for taper pins, you want a regular drift punch that will fit through the hole or smaller than the taper pin. if you're careful you can leave the gas tube roll pin alone and remove the gas tube still installed in the sight base. if you're worried about bending or damaging it go ahead and remove it. this is where the proper size roll pin punch would be handy. there are also special punches for starting/installing roll pins

you might like a handguard / delta ring tool if you've never had the pleasure of trying to squeeze the delta ring down & removing / installing the handguard halves
Reply With Quote
  #15  
Old 05-18-2017, 09:36 PM
nvshooter's Avatar
Beartooth Regular
 
Join Date: Oct 2010
Location: Nevada
Posts: 4,595
Quote:
Originally Posted by BottleNeckJimmy View Post
You might like a handguard/delta ring tool if you've never had the pleasure of trying to squeeze the delta ring down & removing/installing the handguard halves.
Yeah; get one of those. They're just twenty or so bucks, but worth a ton if you ever have to take the handguards off. They make it very easy to get the guards off and back on without using a screwdriver, which can lead to gouges and scratches on your rifle. The delta ring must be the angled type. I doubt the old, cylindrical ring can be pulled down with the removal tool.
__________________
"Socialism is atheism disguised as a political philosophy." Christopher Hitchens
Reply With Quote
  #16  
Old 06-15-2017, 02:37 AM
TMan's Avatar
Beartooth Regular
 
Join Date: Jan 2006
Location: Upper Black Eddy, PA
Posts: 4,230
Quote:
Originally Posted by nvshooter View Post
You can buy it. About four bucks from Brownells. The problem is in getting the A-frame sight base off (and back on) if you want your rifle to keep the 1960s look. The base is pinned on with two taper pins. Drive them out first, then use a hydraulic press to press off the base. Trying to hammer it off will just bugger-up the end of the barrel. Your best bet is to have a gunsmith do the work. He'll do it right the first time, which will save you some time & money over the long term...
Quote:
Originally Posted by Trent12 View Post
I've never had to hammer off an A frame front sight after removing the pins. But even then, it shouldn't do much to tap it off with a rubber mallet and a little penetrating oil. What brand rifle did your A frame front sight not come off on? I've done a few colts, a PSA, and a BCM and they all came right off after knocking out the taper pins. The gas block shouldn't be tight enough to need to be pressed off.
Somehow I missed this thread, and recently pm'd a member to address removing the pins and sight so I could install a Magpul forend. Looking at several You Tube vidio's it looked simple enough. It took about five minutes to see I needed some more new AR tools to avoid dinging up my new upper. The Brownells pin jig is on the way, along with their action block. I'll need 'em sooner or later, as the stock will work with both types of cap. But the pins in my PSA sights are IN THERE GOOD. I'll see how easy the sight comes off, when the barrel is shot out
__________________
No free man shall ever be debarred the use of arms.
>>> Thomas Jefferson

Reply With Quote
Reply

Tags
ar build.m16a1, help requested

Thread Tools
Display Modes Rate This Thread
Rate This Thread:

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are On
Pingbacks are On
Refbacks are On


Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Justification for Packable AR15 Pistols in Vehicles AllOutdoor.com All Outdoor 0 05-08-2017 01:00 PM
Review: San Tan Tactical STT-15 AR15 PILLAR Upper and Lower Receiver Set AllOutdoor.com All Outdoor 0 11-14-2016 08:00 AM
Purple Passion AR15 Build for my Wife AllOutdoor.com All Outdoor 0 08-22-2016 02:30 PM
Win a CDR-15 556 Takedown AR15 from DRD Tactical AllOutdoor.com All Outdoor 0 08-31-2015 11:30 AM
The Irish Furniture Dealer DOK Humor 7 10-02-2014 04:31 AM


All times are GMT -8. The time now is 09:10 PM.

< Contact Us - Shooters Forum - Archive - Privacy Statement >

 
 

All Content & Design Copyright © 1999-2002 Beartooth Bullets, All Rights Reserved
Privacy Statement | Contact Webmaster
Website Design & Development By Exbabylon Internet Solutions
Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.8
Copyright ©2000 - 2017, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.
SEO by vBSEO 3.6.1