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  #1  
Old 01-29-2017, 03:41 PM
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Back in the 1940s I worked in the high mtns with Basque sheepmen who kept the coyotes under control with some small "coyote guns" that shot .38
special "appearing" cardridges that seemed to have paper wads over some poison, perhaps cyanide. They drove a short pipe into the ground and attached the cartridge to the top directly over the firing pin then applied some coyote lure. The coyote bit the .38 case, the shell fired and pushed the poison into their mouths.

Does anyone know about these cartridges? The sheepmen said the"guns" and a box of the special shells had been given to them by some government agency in order to control coyotes. Apparently the cartridges were not available to the public but only to 'gov't trappers.

Anyone have these in their collections? Are they still made?? Still restricted to gov't?? I have not seen nor heard of them for 60 years.
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  #2  
Old 01-29-2017, 06:55 PM
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I'm not sure if it's the same thing you're talking about, but I had a friend back in the early 90's who worked for the Federal gov., US Fish & Wildlife I think. Anyway, he would place these baited mechanisms on a short pole on public lands to control the coyote population where antelope and other big game herds were falling in numbers.

But I saw a few of them, they always had lots of warning signs surrounding each bait stick so people and hunters with bird dogs wouldn't accidentally trigger them. First time I came across one I almost lost one of my short hairs, only reason he didn't get blasted with the cyanide is that particular cyanide mechanism had been depleted.

But I don't know how they work actually, all I know about them is it's some type of mechanism that's baited, coyote grabs the bait and triggers the cyanide mechanism, might be a cartridge type system as you described.

SMOA
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  #3  
Old 01-30-2017, 03:53 AM
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They are in fact called coyote getters. It is used all the time in the sheep farming areas of South Africa against jackal and caracal. Works very well UNLESS you have human signs posted around - then the jackal will not come near it. Cyanide indeed. It works on pressure which releases a trigger and the cyanide is shot into the jackal's mouth.

However, the system has to be used in conjunction with organised rifle hunting. In the Karoo area the cyanide cartridge has led to the evolving of the "super jackal". No male of female who has lost a mate to this or a trap or a trapped cage will ever come near anything with similar smell or appearance and will educate the off spring as well.

The shooters are planted along gravel areas next to fences where sheep do not wander. Jackal like to wander along these diamond mesh fences in search of birds like guinea fowl and spurfowl, and also mongoose that get themselves ensnared. But the following season the sites have to be changed again because after two jackal had been killed along a certain stretch of fence that is the end - not another jackal will set its foot near that area again for two seasons.
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Last edited by MusgraveMan; 01-30-2017 at 04:12 AM.
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  #4  
Old 01-30-2017, 04:59 AM
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the 'Coyote Getters' I've seen is not a 'gun' as much as a pop flare loaded with poison that looks like a fat little bottle rocket. They're about the size of a D size flashlight battery with a spike on the end. They're bright yellow and green striped. It has a glued on cap that is peeled off to expose about six feet of string. The directions say to tie the string to the bait, then, holding the 'getter' pointed towards the bait and AWAY from the handler and anybody else, carefully place and secure the 'gun'. A piece of red tape on the side exposes the trigger which the string is looped around as the last motion.

The gov. trapper was here three years ago to trap out the coyotes too smart to shoot. He showed me the 'getters' and the signs that go with them.
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Old 01-31-2017, 05:07 AM
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Many domestic dogs and a couple of kids have been poisoned by them. I think they are illegal now. There was big movement to get them banned in the 70's. Many ranchers placed them in places like campgrounds, rest areas, etc and didn't mark them. Govt trappers generally followed the rules but the 60's were open war on predators, including eagles, hawks, bears,==private trappers would distribute poison oats over large area by airplane, regardless of who owned the land. Eagles were shot from helicopters and planes.

They showed us a couple of models when I was certified to use narcotic tranquilizers.
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Old 01-31-2017, 05:42 AM
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"...but the 60's were open war on predators, including eagles, hawks, bears,==private trappers would distribute poison oats over large area by airplane, regardless of who owned the land. Eagles were shot from helicopters and planes."

Whatever for? No predator birds are allowed to be killed in my neck of the woods.
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Old 01-31-2017, 09:54 AM
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This thread is the first I have ever heard of such a device. Very devious. I question the application, but understand the frustration that inspired it.
Would be considered a "destructive device" today? Like a scattergun wired to a doorknob or similar. Putting a sign up that reads "DO NOT OPEN DOOR" somehow does not seem adequate.

Cheezywan
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  #8  
Old 01-31-2017, 10:03 AM
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One of my earliest memories is going with my grandaddy to one of his big bee yards WAY into the swamp near Sopchoppy, Florida and told to STAY in the truck, VERY sternly and my dad holding on to me while grandaddy went and unset the two shotguns designed to kill bears. They were fenced to keep the wild hogs out, but the bears climbed the fences and defeated electric fences to get to a full crop of Tupelo honey. This would have been about 1950. By the 1970s they were outlawed and I made an arrest for a guy having one in a tool shed. (After he was told it was illegal he crippled a kid.)

The Fish and Game shoots coyotes from STOL Mull two seater aircraft here. Seems a better way than poison.
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Old 01-31-2017, 11:10 AM
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I hate mice like everyone does. Unattended poison and traps can have unintended consequences though. Poison much more so. I prefer trapping. Can target the "set" to the critter better.

Anyhow, interesting thread.

Cheezywan
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  #10  
Old 01-31-2017, 05:08 PM
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"Can target the "set" to the critter better."

One thing the cyanide blaster does very well is specifically targeting the jackal critter and nothing else. It is still in wide and successful use on the big sheep ranches as part of the jackal control programme, together with organised rifle hunting.
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  #11  
Old 02-01-2017, 06:42 AM
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My Grandad was a lifelong trapper and I spent many days with him in the hills and valleys running his trap lines. He told me about these cyanide bombs and to watch out for them. He didn't much care for government trappers, figered they were taking money out of his pocket. He had my brother and me with him once checking "yote" traps and we came across a well marked baited dead horse. We were told to get out of the Scout and pee real good all over the horse on the way in and out. Nothin ever ate that horse ! But he did catch some yotes!
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  #12  
Old 02-01-2017, 08:20 AM
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What is the advantage of baited poison over any other killing trap (snare, conibear, etc)? Can reuse a trap. Just need bait. I must be missing something obvious.

I found a lot of material on the web about these real easy. Pictures too.

Cheezywan
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  #13  
Old 02-01-2017, 11:25 AM
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I would think one advantage would be that user could carry more of them and there need not be any effort to retrace your trail in order to retrieve them.
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  #14  
Old 02-01-2017, 12:51 PM
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Ten years ago I lived at a VERY remote hot springs in a desert canyon. I did a lot of hiking around and found a bunch of interesting stuff but one really stood out. I was looking for a cow skull for a friend and had found a high place and was glassing for bones, but stumbled over an old horse skeleton coming off the butte. There were six (that I found) Victor traps right in that vicinity, one was still set. According to state regs, every trap has to have label and these were wrapped with an aluminum strip with the guys name scratched in with a nail. No one tag was readable but between six of them I got the guy's name and address in a small town 30 miles north. But he wasn't in the phone book. He had died in 1959, the same year the trap tag regulation went into effect. It seems he made the set and died before taking it up.

'Set and forget' reminds me too much of the mine fields we had to go around and through in Korea and poison is a set and forget killer.

I'm glad they outlawed the use of 1080, at least. Cyanide is a direct acting poison that kills THAT animal. 1080 stays active in dead animals for at least three 'generations' of scavengers so the coyote that 1080 kills can kill the eagles, ravens, magpies and vultures that fed on the carcass AND the scavengers that eat those scavengers AND the scavengers that eat the third 'generation' of dead. It's devastating stuff!
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Old 02-02-2017, 03:52 AM
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Called "2-Step" here. In Tanzania and northern Mozambique the Chinese ivory poachers put it in the drinking pools an hour or so before elephant arrive. In past few years they have killed in excess of 25,000 elephant in our hunting concession area - not all by poisoning but that is becoming the easy way because the shooting gives them away and we find them now and then.
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Old 02-02-2017, 04:02 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by oldguide32 View Post
Back in the 1940s I worked in the high mtns with Basque sheepmen who kept the coyotes under control with some small "coyote guns" that shot .38
special "appearing" cardridges that seemed to have paper wads over some poison, perhaps cyanide. They drove a short pipe into the ground and attached the cartridge to the top directly over the firing pin then applied some coyote lure. The coyote bit the .38 case, the shell fired and pushed the poison into their mouths.

Does anyone know about these cartridges? The sheepmen said the"guns" and a box of the special shells had been given to them by some government agency in order to control coyotes. Apparently the cartridges were not available to the public but only to 'gov't trappers.

Anyone have these in their collections? Are they still made?? Still restricted to gov't?? I have not seen nor heard of them for 60 years.
O.G. this is what you are looking for I think

game-getter cartridges-cyanide-shooter-assembly.jpg
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  #17  
Old 02-02-2017, 04:37 AM
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A bounty is in order. There used to be so many beer cans along the road that delineaters where unneeded. Then they made the cans worth a nickle. They don't get pitched now, or they get picked up.

Good picture MM. That is what I was seeing on the web. Is certainly what Oldguide32 was asking about.

Cheezywan
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  #18  
Old 02-05-2017, 08:52 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Cheezywan View Post
A bounty is in order. There used to be so many beer cans along the road that delineaters where unneeded. Then they made the cans worth a nickle. They don't get pitched now, or they get picked up.

Good picture MM. That is what I was seeing on the web. Is certainly what Oldguide32 was asking about.

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"Beer cans along the roadway,
Look trashy, many say.
But at night, reflecting bright,
They safely guide the way."

Mad Magazine, circa 1970
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Old 02-06-2017, 04:13 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by unclepaddy View Post
"Beer cans along the roadway,
Look trashy, many say.
But at night, reflecting bright,
They safely guide the way."

Mad Magazine, circa 1970
Really! How the heck can you remember something like that?
Cheezywan
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  #20  
Old 02-06-2017, 01:44 PM
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That looks likewhat the sheep man was using. I went with him one day top check. At the set was a dead coyote, a young one but tracks of two more that had chewed on the "gun" after one died. Dead one was 5 feet away and had he set more sets he would have had them all. He said he had neverhad a bobcat or anything else bother but was sure that any of his sheep dogs would die quickley and probablyt any bear. He had picked his location about 5 miles behind where we grazed the sheep.
I think it would be easy to duplicate the cartridge for any handloader with the exception of the poison. I have no idea where you would get powdered cyanide. And it apparently full strength, not a mixture like rat poison or poisoned wheat.

Anyway, thanks folks. apparrently these are not "collectable" in our sense.
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