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  #1  
Old 09-03-2016, 08:24 PM
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Question handgun for coyote?


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I'm considering a handgun (or something) for defending my dog against coyotes.
Background story: I was out and about with my pointer-retriever mix about a month ago when we encountered a coyote. My dog chased down the coyote three times. Coyote didn't want to play with him.
I began asking myself, "what would I do if he's attacked by a pack of coyotes?" I can't hit a coyote with any regularity at that distance with the Colt .45 Vaquero on my hip; I'd greatly endanger my dog, too.
My thoughts went to my old 7mmTCU Contender but Jack Belk's book has put me off from carrying it in a holster.
Chucker season is coming up and I'd like something that would:
A. Shoot flat enough and with enough moxie to reliably take down a coyote at ~150 or 200 yards.
B. Carried safely on my person in a holster.
C. Be scope-friendly so I have some chance of hitting with my old bifocalled eyes.
D. Not be outrageously heavy or bulky: not in the way of my shotgun but easily accessed, too.
My dog and I will be hunting chucker partridge. For those of you who're unfamiliar, chucker is a medium-small game bird that favors rocky and steep mountains and sagebrush. The steeper and rockier, the better they like it. They require little water. They were imported from southwest Asia (Pakistan and Afghanistan) in the 1960s and have made the intermountain west their home. They're now our premier game bird.
"The first chucker hunt is for sport. The rest of your life, it's for revenge!"
How many times have I left a brutally steep and rocky canyon without seeing a single chucker then listened to them laugh (chuck-chuck-chuck) at me as I left!
Does anyone have any first-rate ideas?
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  #2  
Old 09-03-2016, 08:27 PM
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I used my mp45 on a yote once, course, he didn't know I was in the blind either
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  #3  
Old 09-03-2016, 08:41 PM
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Maybe a S&W scandium framed revolver in .357magnum? I think they make one with a rail on it for a scope and they are very lightweight for revolvers. Shot placement would be important with any handgun at those ranges. Unless you step up to the wild cartridges like .454 casull and such.

Or since you will be using a shotgun already. Carry some slugs and learn how to shoot them. A 12ga slug is effective out to 300 yards if you can Do your part and hit with it. A reflex sight of some sort will help with aiming quickly and accurately if your shotgun is setup to mount optics. A slug will definitely drop a coyote with authority. Buckshot will work well out to a fair range as well. The only downside is you have to use an IC choke I believe for slugs. I don't know what kind of choke you use for your hunting.
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  #4  
Old 09-03-2016, 09:36 PM
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King4, I can't hunt chucker from a blind. It takes lots of walking over very unstable ground.
My concern is to save my dog from attacking coyotes. I don't want to kill my dog in the process. Any coyote encounter probably won't be within 50 yards. I'm in Northern Nevada where any shots will be long.

Trent12, my goal is to save the life of my dog, not bag a coyote. A .357, even with an extra long barrel has too much an arching trajectory and not enough moxie to hit a coyote in a dog fight with my dog and not take a real risk of shooting my dog.
I use a 28 gauge Franchi Instinct with modified and improved cylinder for chucker. It really isn't optics friendly. About the best I could do is clamp the optics to that fragile vent rib. I doubt that would last long in the country I hunt. The problem of being able to hit a coyote instead of my dog applies to buckshot and slugs.

Thanks for trying, both!
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  #5  
Old 09-03-2016, 10:10 PM
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I want to say an FN Five-Seven would be cool. But I don't think a scope would fit it. It is an automatic. The round is accurate and fast. I don't think it would work for you either though. I understand poor vision. There just aren't a whole lot of options for a pistol that I can think of that offers a carry able, accurate, 200 yard capable package. I'm sure there is something we aren't thinking of!

A lightweight .223 rifle might be a better deal. But it would be really hard to carry around on your back with you through that terrain. Maybe a PS90 from FN? They are compact and accurate. But expensive and not a pistol. It's a Bulpup rifle if you know what that is. So it might fit into a backpack or sling over your back easily. It's technically a SMG in semi auto only. It fires the same 5.7x28mm cartridge.

I'll think on this as I'm walking around through gun stores the next few weeks. There has to be a pistol capable of this.


An AR15 "pistol" is short and lightweight. Can't really holster it, but it can fit into a backpack or tennis racket case easily. It can be outfitted with any optic of your choice and they are accurate out to 200-300 yards easy.

The .460 S&W x frame revolver is flat shooting and powerful. It is also scope ready. But it is very bulky and heavy for a pistol. Recoil is also going to be a little punishing. It's also a little overkill.
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Last edited by Trent12; 09-03-2016 at 10:29 PM.
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  #6  
Old 09-04-2016, 05:24 AM
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That is a tall order. 200 yards on a yote would be tough for any handgun.

I would look for a light weight carbine. A custom TC Contender made to be light would work.

I once had an older Contender pistol with a lightweight octagon barrel in 221 Fireball. With a scope it would work to 200 yards. But that would take a bit of practice.

A light weight AR-15 in 5.56 would probably be best.

Inside of 100 yards, a 6" 357 with scope could be used with 125 gr ammo. I had a 6" S&W M19 with a scope and it was very accurate at 100 yards using IMR4227 and a 125 gr bullet. Just learn the trajectory which is not much at 50 yards when zeroed at 100 yards.
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  #7  
Old 09-04-2016, 06:14 AM
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Buy a whistle and teach your dog to heel when you blow it. Hopefully the coyote will follow and learn it's lesson.
If your dog chases coyotes then I don't see one standing still enough to hit with a rifle consistently never mind a handgun. A Contender in a centre fire 22 or even 17 Remington would be my choice but from what you describe as conditions your asking a bit much I'm afraid.
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  #8  
Old 09-04-2016, 07:06 AM
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I would likely go with a Ruger Blackhawk in 357. I've shot coyotes with 22 mag rifles on occasion; you don't need a cannon. A 30 Carbine BH? a .32 something or other?

A bird dog doesn't need to be out 200 yards (unless you have a VERY tight choke). I agree that you don't hunt chukar from a blind. My buddies who are die hard chukar hunters wear out a pair of boots a year==I swear those things must EAT lava and basalt!

Chukar country is usually rattler country; carry a shot shell in the first chamber if you want.
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  #9  
Old 09-04-2016, 07:24 AM
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Thats a tall order you are wanting to fill. Coyotes aren't hard to kill but many times they run off to die. Shooting at a coyote in a dog fight at 200 yards is something I wouldn't do even with a rifle. How about vocally restraining your dog so he isnt out there at those distances?
A pistol for partridge?
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  #10  
Old 09-04-2016, 07:48 AM
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To far

You should never let a bird dog range that far or be unable to control them. Mine were whistle trained and kept at 50yds, when they get that selective hearing thing going the E-collar or as I referred to it my long leash came in handy.
Looking for a second carry gun for 200 yd shots to protect your dog should'nt even come into play. IMHO
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  #11  
Old 09-04-2016, 07:48 AM
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Just to clarify, it's obvious you dont hunt those birds from a blind. The op had originally asked what Pistol and I commented that I once got one from a blind, nothing more. Has common sense disappeared? End of rant. Carry on.
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Last edited by King4; 09-05-2016 at 09:40 AM. Reason: Bad grammar.
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  #12  
Old 09-04-2016, 08:22 AM
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"common sense? Re-read the op!

Quote:
Originally Posted by King4 View Post
Just to clarify, it's obvious you hunt those birds from a blind. The op had originally asked what Pistol and I commented that I once got one from a blind, nothing more. Has common sense disappeared? End of rant. Carry on.
"STEEP MTN'S & SAGEBRUSH" SO not hunting from a blind IMO. I too shot a yote from a (turkey) blind, but don't see any relevance here. A coyote @ 200yards would not be a threat to a properly trained bird dog IMO. The shotgun already in your hands would be fine for a yote that did pose a threat at a more realistic range. 6- 7 1/2 shot you're probly already using should send the yote on it's way (perhaps not killing it). A few larger shot sized rounds couldn't hurt. Carrying 2 long guns in rough terrain seems impractical/difficult-impossible. I seriously doubt Davey Crocket could hit a moving yote @ 300 yards with a shotgun slug, and a reflex sight is not exactly standard equipment on a chukar gun. In a tangled up dog fight, shooting anything at the yote, & the further away the greater the chance of hitting your own dog. If you don't have a clear shot/ don't shoot. My 2 cents. Best wishes for your dog.
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Last edited by nachogrande; 09-04-2016 at 08:28 AM.
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  #13  
Old 09-04-2016, 08:13 PM
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This is a 8.5 inch and 30 rnd mag

Man you are asking for the impossible,,, until they come up with a laser pistol weapon your up the creek !

Try a 7.5 inch AR-15 pistol with a compact 2-7 power scope, shooting 40 gr v-maxs with a ten round mag and no holster,,, but a 2 point sling will work well...
[/B]
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Last edited by 2hellandback; 09-04-2016 at 09:56 PM.
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  #14  
Old 09-04-2016, 11:17 PM
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Not a bad idea there, and I don't like black rifles.
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Old 09-05-2016, 02:53 AM
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A relaxing day of chukar hunting or storming an isis stronghold?

Quote:
Originally Posted by 2hellandback View Post



This is a 8.5 inch and 30 rnd mag

Man you are asking for the impossible,,, until they come up with a laser pistol weapon your up the creek !

Try a 7.5 inch AR-15 pistol with a compact 2-7 power scope, shooting 40 gr v-maxs with a ten round mag and no holster,,, but a 2 point sling will work well...
[/B]
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  #16  
Old 09-05-2016, 07:56 AM
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"Just to clarify, it's obvious you hunt those birds from a blind."

Hardly: Typical Chukar country (And, they NEVER run downhill!):

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  #17  
Old 09-05-2016, 09:28 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 91Carcano View Post
My thoughts went to my old 7mmTCU Contender but Jack Belk's book has put me off from carrying it in a holster.
Don't you have to "cock" a Contender to get it to go off or does the hammer not "lock" at the first notch?

Train your dog better? Keep him on a lead? I understand the need for continual training and "HEEL", "COME", "SIT" and "STAY" are the big four as there's nothing worse than a rude hunter with a rude dog. If he's off chasing coyotes he's not hunting birds close to you and within shotgun range.

Bacon bits or jerky are excellent training aids.

And I hope Phydeaux has all his shots up to date if you're letting him romp with coyotes.

Bear Bio, Looking down at the Snake River near Twin?

I bet 2hellandback can't hear anything anyway so maybe nobody else should be able to either? Nothing worse than a deaf dog that doesn't know sign language.

RJ
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Last edited by recoil junky; 09-05-2016 at 09:31 AM.
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Old 09-05-2016, 09:39 AM
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Well, I just figured out why so many are giving me negative feedback. I meant to say that you don't hunt those birds from a blind. I apologize for not catching this earlier and ask your forgiveness for my failure.
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Old 09-05-2016, 09:49 AM
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I used to hunt Huns from a blind . . . . . the seat of our Gleaner L2 combine

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  #20  
Old 09-05-2016, 09:54 AM
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King4 I really did feel that almost all of the advice was positive. Certainly my advice was. I've run dogs for woodcock and red grouse on hills in Wales and Scotland where putting a foot wrong could mean you vanishing from sight for ever. When hunting the above my dogs were always locked on to those birds. A mountain hare, fox whatever did not faze them and they would stop and answer to instructions from me or my whistle even if they were 4 or 500yrds or more away. Been there done it and my advice was given in good faith.

You don't require forgiveness for anything. Spend a bit of time with that dog of yours training and you will both enjoy your days on hills far more. I would reiterate my choice should I need to carry a handgun on such a hunting expedition. It would likely be an Encore by choice and probably be in 22-250 in an under arm holster. My shotgun would be a Berretta 20 gauge side by side, fashioned on the one loaned to me by the late John Wootters back in 1985, when he had me shoot a walked up quail clay set up which the owner said had never been cleaned. It was that day. John refused to sell it to me and I could understand why.
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