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  #1  
Old 04-18-2017, 08:25 AM
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Pocket Pistol Comparisons---


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I happen to have more pocket pistols than pockets right now and most were within arms reach of me and a camera so I shot some to show size, not weights.

Compare one of the worlds finest .25 autos to a modern, polymer .380 with the CZ-46 and the Ruger LCP with Crimson Trace sight.

Weight is very nearly the same but the Ruger is thicker.

Compare a SS Walther PPK .380 with a new Sig Sauer 938 in 9mm. As expected the 9mm is thicker but otherwise is smaller and lighter than the older .380.

The stacked pistols show relative size to a S&W 317

I wear Wrangler jeans. The CZ and the LCP 'fit' in a front pocket but the PPK needs padding to keep it straight and still is too big.

The SIG comes with a belt clip holster because it's got too many sharp corners and moveable safeties to be carried in a pocket.
(If I wanted something hanging on a belt I'd wear a bigger gun.)

I've just bought but not yet received a Beretta PICO that could have utility. I'll report after I've seen it.

BTW-- The Sig-Sauer 938 is the SAME GUN (but for very minor differences) as the Colt Mustang .380. Same size, thickness and weight. I've had them together to measure just last week.
Attached Thumbnails
Pocket Pistol Comparisons----lcp-cz46.jpg   Pocket Pistol Comparisons----pocket-pistol-thicknesses.jpg   Pocket Pistol Comparisons----stacked-pocket-pistols.jpg   Pocket Pistol Comparisons----pocket-pistols-003a.jpg   Pocket Pistol Comparisons----pocket-pistols-001a.jpg  

Pocket Pistol Comparisons----pocket-pistols-005a.jpg   Pocket Pistol Comparisons----sig-sauer-938.jpg  
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  #2  
Old 04-18-2017, 09:08 AM
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How about...

Thoughts/opinions on the Seecamp? The s/s frame seems robust, the small internal springs/bars/etc. not so much. No hold open after the last shot, easily damaged if an RO tries to pull back the slide with the mag removed. (not too many are familiar enough with it, to handle it w/o damaging it) Pocket carry collects plenty of dust/lint, which handle dust/lint better?

Last edited by nachogrande; 04-18-2017 at 01:38 PM.
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  #3  
Old 04-18-2017, 09:26 AM
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NG--
My first experience with Seecamp was when he was doing Colt Commander DA conversions. My (recently lost) best buddy in the sheriff's office got permission to carry one in '72. I had a Hi-Power done about the same time but took the profit from selling my place in line and never even SAW the gun after a two year wait!

I've not seen a new pocket pistol close enough to say for sure. I'm VERY spooked about endorsing anything but the gun I have in my hand at the time. Companies are re-cycling model names and numbers to the extent they can NOT be trusted!!

RANT mode ON!

Not long ago a lawyer I've worked for many times over many years called with a case of a "blown up" Browning A-5. He told me the whole receiver was blown out of it and mangled the shooter's left arm. I spent an hour explaining to him how it was IMPOSSIBLE for a Browning A-5 to blow up in such a manner and patiently explained in detail why. During that hour his paralegal was taking pictures of a DESTROYED Browning "A-5" unlike which I'd never seen the likes of before. Browning RE-NAMED a brand new model auto shotgun "A-5"!!! (and Hevi-Shot blew it up. The ammo was re-called)

It's like some power tools--what was the best is now the cheapest made but still carries a big price.
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Last edited by JBelk; 04-18-2017 at 10:05 AM.
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  #4  
Old 04-18-2017, 10:07 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JBelk View Post
I happen to have more pocket pistols than pockets right now
Made me think of that old Bianchi holster advertisement. John wearing a tuxedo and the caption reports that he has dozens of firearms concealed on his person.

Those little auto-loaders sure look attractive as Iowa summer approaches. I have resisted for a lot of years now. I don't know if I could feel "right" without my heavy, fat revolver?
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  #5  
Old 04-18-2017, 01:33 PM
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Thanks anyway.

It took me a long time to find an original Milford Ct model (if that matters) & was kinda looking for a non paid for opinion. Initial inspection showed wear on a few minor parts & were cheap/easy to replace, function has been 100% with speer gold dots (32acp) & am able to keep shots in a 6" x 10" area @ 7', held at chest level & no aiming. (as there are no sights on it) I guess it will do what it is intended to. I'm NOT as confidant with it as my S&W 640 no dash, but it sure is smaller lighter, and ON MY PERSON 24/7, until something better comes along. If I could only have 1 gun, this would not be it, but it's the most concealable in my stable.

Last edited by nachogrande; 04-18-2017 at 01:37 PM.
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  #6  
Old 04-18-2017, 02:32 PM
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I looked at some youtube info on the Seecamp. I'm not impressed with the rough castings and fitting of parts, but I still haven't seen one to actually say. I understand there are several 'strains' if not 'generations' of guns depending on where they were made. That's really scary!!
We should always remember-- Quality Control is 100% voluntary in the gun industry.
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  #7  
Old 04-18-2017, 06:11 PM
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Ruger lcp is selling gangbusters for pocket carry. I am very happy with mine and a +1 magazine.
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  #8  
Old 04-18-2017, 06:30 PM
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I love my Seecamp 32 acp as a deep concealment 2nd or third pistol. Mine was purchased in the mid 90s and is always with me. I have noticed the chamber is extremely rough, as if done on purpose, maybe to reduce bolt thrust? It is a pain to take to the range and carefully explain to the R.O. how it needs to be operated.

I remember when there was a waiting list to get one and the MSRP was around $400 and they were getting $1100 for them. Fortunately I got mine for MSRP. The local range/ gun shop still wants $700 for them.
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  #9  
Old 04-19-2017, 02:15 AM
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The Ruger LCP is slightly lighter, a little narrower, and a little longer than my Raven P-25

Also recently got a cheapo Cobra Denali 380 which is also about the same other than the plastic finger extension on the magazine.

Posted an eval on it here: http://www.shootersforum.com/handgun...ali-380-a.html
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  #10  
Old 04-19-2017, 06:45 AM
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I never got away from....

my Jennings 3/4 full of stingers.
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  #11  
Old 04-19-2017, 09:06 AM
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I used to carry my Sig P238 in .380 because it's small, but my confidence in small calibers has changed over the years. The reason I carry is to protect my Life and Stop the Threat. nothing but .45 acp or bigger for me now.JMO top down , Glock 27, .40 s&w.. Kahr PM45. 45 acp. Sig P238, .380 acp. The Kahr is a nice sice for CC..

Pocket Pistol Comparisons----small-carry.jpg
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  #12  
Old 04-19-2017, 12:48 PM
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"or bigger"

Quote:
Originally Posted by glockman55 View Post
I used to carry my Sig P238 in .380 because it's small, but my confidence in small calibers has changed over the years. The reason I carry is to protect my Life and Stop the Threat. nothing but .45 acp or bigger for me now.JMO top down , Glock 27, .40 s&w.. Kahr PM45. 45 acp. Sig P238, .380 acp. The Kahr is a nice sice for CC..

Attachment 60922
Just curious, what is bigger than a 45acp, yet small enough for POCKET carry? (as the thread title says)
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  #13  
Old 04-19-2017, 01:57 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by nachogrande View Post
Just curious, what is bigger than a 45acp, yet small enough for POCKET carry? (as the thread title says)
Hummmm good point,, 44 mag snub nose..[ATTACH]
[/ATTACH]
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  #14  
Old 04-19-2017, 04:29 PM
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You must have a huge...

POCKET. And suspenders to keep your pants up. Don't forget the earplugs with that flame thrower.
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Old 04-19-2017, 05:15 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by glockman55 View Post
Hummmm good point,, 44 mag snub nose.
Yep.

You won that one.

I have a M69 for anyplace I plan to go that I need to actually feel safe.

With full on 180gr HP's, it makes the .45ACP look marginal.
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Old 04-19-2017, 05:58 PM
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Oh yeah,

Quote:
Originally Posted by TMan View Post
Yep.

You won that one.

I have a M69 for anyplace I plan to go that I need to actually feel safe.

With full on 180gr HP's, it makes the .45ACP look marginal.
You will blend right in with that in your pocket.
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  #17  
Old 04-20-2017, 03:17 AM
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Originally Posted by nachogrande View Post
You will blend right in with that in your pocket.
LOL, probably not while wearing my speedo on the beach but up north we wear different clothes in the Winter..
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  #18  
Old 04-20-2017, 07:21 AM
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My boss the sheriff had a few un-breakable rules for his deputies that would get his closest friend fired on the spot. Number one was "Be armed all the time".
We had two jailors shot and one killed when they walked in on an armed robbery at a country store on the way to work. Five robbers, all armed with handguns already had the store owner and wife constrained and on the floor. The deputies had no chance. From that day forward the sheriff actively looked for an un-armed deputy to fire.
He caught me and the chief of detectives fly fishing in float tubes on a small pond one afternoon. The sheriff could see the detective's Chief Special in a fly box pocket of his vest but I was wearing cut-off jeans and a tee shirt and was soaking wet. We chatted a few minutes and plotted against the crooks and then he said, "Belk, if you don't show me a gun you'll have a lot more time to fish." I had a Budachowski .25 in my 'wallet'. WHEW!! The sheriff carried a 3 1/2" M-27 everywhere, all the time.
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Old 04-20-2017, 08:00 AM
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Good Morning, JBelk,

I know that you like pocket pistols. I'm good with that. As for me, I love walnut and blued steel big game rifles.

I don't own a pocket pistol. I'll never own a pocket pistol. Here's why: 90+% of all shootings occur at 10' and less. That is dead man's distance. Probability of a good guy taking rounds is high. With tactical training, a good guy could mitigate bad outcome probability.

Now let's assume just one bad guy. We know that bad guys rarely caper alone. Bangers maraud in packs of feral, rabid dogs. You've got a .25 Auto. Pocket pistols ain't known for accuracy. They do have propensity to jam. Your adversary has a couple notches on his gun. He's murdered before. He's a tweaker armed with a .45 ACP working on brain cell depletion. How do you think you're gonna survive? Were I in your shoes, I'd keep my .25 Auto in my pocket and go with a better strategy.

Bad guys are tough. They musta got extra bad guy genes instead of Golden Rule genes. They can take a lot of rounds and keep shooting.

I used to carry a Model 60 loaded with the FBI load. It was marginal at best, and it was a one bad guy gun at best. I could do better. Now I have a Sig P229 .40, which might just be the best law enforcement gun ever created this side of the 1911A1. I can conceal it with little effort. And 13 rounds of 180 grain LE ammo would raise my survival probability with 2 or 3 bad guys as long as my muscle memory is still memory.

I don't much carry a handgun even though I legally can. A while back I got to thinkin', an activity I should have tried more often in high school; well, thinkin' about things other than girls. Admittedly my gun carrying friends used to ride me about not carrying. They still do.

I found a great deal on a brand spanking new Sig P239 40. I was all over it like marinara on spaghetti. 8 rounds of 180 grain LE ammo with 7 more ready to go within seconds and 7 more after that should equal bad guy odds. If he's tweakin' and ain't thinkin', he has tremendous advantage. I'd have to overcome his advantage, and a pocket pistol won't do it. In fact, a pocket pistol might just get me killed. Were I armed with a pocket pistol, my best strategy would be to take his gun. But that's fodder for a different post.

Check this out: I love my new Sig P239. It's gorgeous, easy to conceal, powerful, and 100% reliable. And you've guessed it: I ain't yet carried it a single time.

I'm good with your loving pocket pistols. However, they are not survivor self-defense guns. I know that were I in a gunfight, I'd want that'll slide some odds from the bad guy to me. The way I have it angled, survival self-defense guns begin with 4.

I live by the two primary rules of gunfighting:

1. The only known way of surviving a gunfight is to not get in one

2. If Rule 1 is not an option, don't get shot
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Old 04-20-2017, 11:32 AM
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10-4 Colonel Cooper.
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