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  #241  
Old 03-18-2017, 11:41 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by broom_jm View Post
Excellent point, WM. I would add that one also should shoot from 1 or 2 other improvised positions that are less steady than bench rest, but more representative of what you would do in the field.

Most of the shots my family and I take on game are with the rifle resting across some kind of wooden or padded metal support. This is because we hunt mostly from a stand or a blind. To simulate this, we practice by resting the rifle across the rail that goes around the deck on the back of our house. We have targets set at 25, 50 and 100 yards.

It's also good to practice by simply leaning up against an object, like a post or tree trunk, as improvised rests like this are realistic for hunting situations and result in better accuracy.

And like you said, have fun with it!
I was just giving the worst and best case positions which will either shore up or destroy ones confidents in there shooting ability. When the weather improves I will hit the range and do this and post a picture as I haven't done this in a long time. It will be interesting to say the least. You are 100% right that one should practice this way from the position you are most likely to shoot from in the field. When shooting competition as a youth we had to shoot 10 shots from each position. Prone, Sitting, Kneeling and off hand with target 22 rim fire rifles with peep sights. We were blessed to have a gun club in the basement of our high school and were allowed to join the gun club right after we got our firearm safety card at age 10.
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  #242  
Old 03-18-2017, 11:49 AM
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School ranges.

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Originally Posted by 264WM View Post
I was just giving the worst and best case positions which will either shore up or destroy ones confidents in there shooting ability. When the weather improves I will hit the range and do this and post a picture as I haven't done this in a long time. It will be interesting to say the least. You are 100% right that one should practice this way from the position you are most likely to shoot from in the field. When shooting competition as a youth we had to shoot 10 shots from each position. Prone, Sitting, Kneeling and off hand with target 22 rim fire rifles with peep sights. We were blessed to have a gun club in the basement of our high school and were allowed to join the gun club right after we got our firearm safety card at age 10.
Dating yourself a bit, but we had some too. Today they are crying over the lead contaminations in those schools. Silly NIMBY's, they don't realize the asbestos & radon from back then will get them first.
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  #243  
Old 03-19-2017, 04:20 AM
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I agree everyone wants the most accuracy they can get out of their rifle, but I'd have to put getting your mechanics of shooting down and practicing right up there as important, if not more so.

Last fall my neighbor drew a tag for bighorn in Idaho. He had a custom rifle that was having some issues and they narrowed it down to the barrel so with the hunt coming up fast, he bought a Gunwerks rifle in 7 LRM. It shoots a 180 Berger at 3075 fps. This thing is set up with top notch everything from trigger to barrel. It's topped with a Nightforce scope and comes with a rangefinder/ballistic computer that works with the rifle. It takes your elevation, temp, wind, etc. You range it and it tells you how to adjust the Nightforce. I told him we could run out to my range and shoot it. Dead on at 200. At 300 we shot it and his was a tad low so I clicked it up one and hit near dead center. No problem shooting clays on the ground at that range. Amazingly accurate rifle...and it should be as much as it cost. And the recoil was nothing.

So he goes on his bighorn hunt and they spot a great ram and were able to get within 200 and something yards. Clean miss on his first shot. He was able to get another. This rifle is incredibly accurate and does near everything but pull the trigger but the shooter missed a chipshot (and a pronghorn on another hunt). The rifle and 300 yard target, mine being the top shot, his the bottom:



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  #244  
Old 03-19-2017, 06:09 AM
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And to answer the question of how accurate is enough? Well, either of those shots is accurate enough, but what the rifle can do and what the shooter can do (under the excitement of taking a shot in the field) are two different things.
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  #245  
Old 03-19-2017, 06:52 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by M1Garand View Post
I agree everyone wants the most accuracy they can get out of their rifle, but I'd have to put getting your mechanics of shooting down and practicing right up there as important, if not more so.

It's what I've been trying to tell people forever.

I see a problem with the rifle though, the bolt is on the wrong side.

RJ
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  #246  
Old 03-19-2017, 07:32 AM
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Those darn left handers

That's my point RJ. An ultra accurate rifle does nothing if you don't have those mechanics down and practice. And by practice not only bench, but once sighted, go shoot from various real world positions you'd use hunting. Many of us have blinds we can rest the rifle, but I've sighted deer out walking and shot them from sitting and prone positions. Dry fire too. A trick they had us doing in the Army was dry fire with a dime on the barrel of the M16 to get a good trigger pull.
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  #247  
Old 03-19-2017, 07:38 AM
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Originally Posted by M1Garand View Post
Dry fire too. A trick they had us doing in the Army was dry fire with a dime on the barrel of the M16 to get a good trigger pull.


Sometimes, especially after too much morning coffee, I shake so bad you couldn't HOT GLUE a dime to the barrel and have it stay!!

RJ
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  #248  
Old 03-19-2017, 07:51 AM
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Originally Posted by M1Garand View Post
Those darn left handers

That's my point RJ. An ultra accurate rifle does nothing if you don't have those mechanics down and practice. And by practice not only bench, but once sighted, go shoot from various real world positions you'd use hunting. Many of us have blinds we can rest the rifle, but I've sighted deer out walking and shot them from sitting and prone positions. Dry fire too. A trick they had us doing in the Army was dry fire with a dime on the barrel of the M16 to get a good trigger pull.
I really like the dime test and will use it. Maybe mountain hunters (like myself)should use the dime test with an elevated heart rate to more accurately replicate what we do in the field
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  #249  
Old 03-19-2017, 09:05 AM
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The first mistake is made when you 'adjust' your aiming point on a deer. Crosshairs DEAD CENTER should make the bullet land inside a clay target IF the deer is in range. If you have to 'aim high', he shouldn't be shot at.
I know, that's more ethics than marksmanship. Sorry.
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Last edited by JBelk; 03-19-2017 at 09:07 AM.
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  #250  
Old 03-19-2017, 09:46 AM
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Originally Posted by JBelk View Post
The first mistake is made when you 'adjust' your aiming point on a deer. Crosshairs DEAD CENTER should make the bullet land inside a clay target IF the deer is in range. If you have to 'aim high', he shouldn't be shot at.
I know, that's more ethics than marksmanship. Sorry.
I am sure most of the guys on here are not casual shooters and are probably more skilled at making shots on game. With that said, I know a bunch of guys that take their rifles out two weeks (or two days) before season and that is it. They try "Kentucky windage" and wound animals all the time. I can't stand to see animals wounded because a guy tried something in the field they haven't tried at the range. I just won't do it. If I don't know where the bullet is going to land then I don't take the shot. There are just too many deer around for me to try something silly. If I pass on an opportunity I just keep hunting and most of the time will get a solid shot opportunity.

What kind of accuracy is required for hunting? Good enough so that you can reliably predict where you bullet is going to strike. For some that may limit them to 100 yard shots, for others it may 300 yards or more.
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  #251  
Old 03-19-2017, 09:55 AM
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Originally Posted by broom_jm View Post
And to answer the question of how accurate is enough? Well, either of those shots is accurate enough, but what the rifle can do and what the shooter can do (under the excitement of taking a shot in the field) are two different things.
Exactly my point. No matter how accurate the rifle, it can be a moot point when the when the weak link is the shooter and this is a good example of that. I've known some great shooters who make a mediocre rifle seem much better than it actually shoots. Esp with some of those old lever guns.
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  #252  
Old 03-19-2017, 10:14 AM
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Originally Posted by Comerade View Post
I really like the dime test and will use it. Maybe mountain hunters (like myself)should use the dime test with an elevated heart rate to more accurately replicate what we do in the field
I've done shoots (tactical courses) that do that for that very reason to elevate your heart so it's up when you get to the firing line. Much different than controlling your breathing from a bench. There's that Olympic event (can't remember the official name) that's interesting where they cross country ski to targets on the course then fire 22's.
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  #253  
Old 03-20-2017, 12:08 AM
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Dating yourself a bit, but we had some too. Today they are crying over the lead contaminations in those schools. Silly NIMBY's, they don't realize the asbestos & radon from back then will get them first.
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Last edited by 264WM; 03-20-2017 at 12:12 AM.
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  #254  
Old 03-20-2017, 12:18 AM
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I guess dry fire is ok but there is nothing like live fire practice to hone your skills. 22 rim fire is the cheapest way to go and over and over until you improve your scores. with the competition targets. We would shoot at least 100 rounds a day, 2 or 3 days a week. When you consistently shoot in the high 90's you will have your trigger pull down pat.
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  #255  
Old 03-20-2017, 03:19 AM
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Originally Posted by M1Garand View Post
I've done shoots (tactical courses) that do that for that very reason to elevate your heart so it's up when you get to the firing line. Much different than controlling your breathing from a bench. There's that Olympic event (can't remember the official name) that's interesting where they cross country ski to targets on the course then fire 22's.
Simply called the biathlon, and what a cool event it is.

I walked up the hill to one of our blinds about 5 years ago and when I glanced down the shooting lane to my left, there stood a young buck. I slowly dropped to the ground, behind the blind, uncased my rifle and eased a round into the chamber. When I stood up the buck was still there, 75 yards away and munching on the winter rye we'd planted back in August. I gripped the edge of the A-frame style blind and rested my 270 on top of my hand. I was still a bit winded from the walk, plus I had the normal excitement of seeing a deer in the crosshairs.

The shot was an inch or two higher than I aimed and he went about 40 yards before piling up.
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Last edited by broom_jm; 03-20-2017 at 03:23 AM.
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  #256  
Old 03-20-2017, 11:37 AM
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Those darn left handers

. A trick they had us doing in the Army was dry fire with a dime on the barrel of the M16 to get a good trigger pull.
its you darn righties that put the bolt handle on the opposite side!!!!!

oh the memories the army brings back. we took whatever the coin was,( quarter, dime, nickel, penny) and we did trigger pull on the m16. .
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  #257  
Old 03-20-2017, 01:21 PM
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its you darn righties that put the bolt handle on the opposite side!!!!!

oh the memories the army brings back. we took whatever the coin was,( quarter, dime, nickel, penny) and we did trigger pull on the m16. .
I'm not sure which of you to agree with! I'm right-handed but left-eye dominant. You don't know what mixed-up is until you have to decide whether to shoot with the wrong eye or the wrong hand.
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  #258  
Old 03-20-2017, 01:34 PM
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I'm not sure which of you to agree with! I'm right-handed but left-eye dominant. You don't know what mixed-up is until you have to decide whether to shoot with the wrong eye or the wrong hand.

i was the same way!!! a stroke cured me of that! now everything is left handed

i've only shot rifles left handed, but everything else was right handed.
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  #259  
Old Today, 03:38 PM
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I want a one inch gun under any circumstances, I might want to shoot a turkey in the head or a grouse for the pot, or a charging Lion, buffalo in the eye.

Nothing wrong with super accurate rifles, some of you seem to think a inaccurate gun is a test of skill, its not, its a piece of junk. I have made my living hunting the last 29 years give or take, I want the best tool for the job, I like a good horse, a good saddle, and a good rifle. prefer and new truck every few years...

Just my take on the subject.
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