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Stinger4me 11-25-2012 06:20 PM

.30-06 with 100 or 110 grain bullets
I have a Winchester Mod. 70 chambered for .30-06. Might consider selling it and getting a .243 Winchester as an alternative deer rifle. My Lee reloading manual shows loads for 100 and 110 grain bullets. Would I be better off selling the Winchester and going to a .243. The 100 grain bullets are really zipping along, wondering if the bullets are stable enough to take out whitetail deer at 200 yds. or more. Thanks for the input.


Shawn Crea 11-25-2012 06:36 PM

Stinger, are you having problems with the 30-06? Is it a recoil issue?

Big Bore 11-25-2012 06:48 PM

What is your twist? I am shooting 110 gr. bullets out of my .30 HRT at 2600 fps with a 1:12 twist and am getting very tiny groups. If your twist is at least 1:12 you should be OK. If 1:10 then you are golden. The mythical over stabilized bullet is pretty much a myth. Yes, you might not get the most accuracy out of over stabilized bullet but it is not going to tumble like an under stabilized bullet would do. If you are running a 1:14 to slower twist, then the only real answer is to try and few and shoot them at range and see what happens. I have more than once seen bullets that were not supposed to be stabilized at X twist shoot wonderfully, and others that should have shot great tumble like crazy. There are general rules of twist but I do not think that anything is for certain written in stone.
The biggest problem I see is the bullets being driven too fast. Most 110 gr. or less .30 caliber bullets are for varmints with the exception being the Barnes TTSX and other solid copper bullets. The light weight bullets that will hold up fine at 2600 fps and lower may well blow up at 3000 or more fps. Check your bullets performance envelope. The TTSX though is not going to blow up though and will make a dandy light weight deer bullet and is the bullet I am going to be using in the HRT.
I must ask though, why so light? I have shot the 06 for decades out to ranges of 600 yards with 150-168 gr. bullets and I know that they will drop a deer well past the 200 yards limit you imposed. Are you wanting to go lighter for recoil reduction? You are going to lose money if you trade or sell off your 06 as well as giving up one of the finest cartridges ever invented. Unless you are recoil sensitive and need a lot less recoil, I'd be using a good 150 gr. TTSX or Partition or even an Interlock for that matter and be completely confident that any deer hit in the right spot is meat in the freezer well out past 400 yards. And if it is recoil that is the problem, I'd sure be trying some of the Barnes 110 gr. TTSX bullets before I would even think about trading or selling the 06. A 110 gr. TTSX bullet will be as long as a 125 gr. lead cored bullet since copper is so much less dense than lead. You may well find the TTSX will stabilize just fine in even a 1:14 twist but you really need to determine what your twist rate is before doing anything.

Ikeepem 11-25-2012 09:14 PM

I can't imagine any benefit from going from a Mod 70 30-06 to a .243 if it will be your only rifle other then for recoil purposes which would be the minimum cal I'd go for a small to medium Whitetail at 200 and not much more yds..that 30-06 loaded with 150-165's would be my choice for over two hundred plus yards on all size deer..

attaloss 11-25-2012 09:49 PM

The 30-06 will take out deer at 200 plus yards over and over and over. I use 168 grain Barnes and have little meat damage. I have a 6mm Rem (243 Win pretty much) and it ain't my favorite deer gun. Have shot quit a few mule deer with 6mm and prefer .270 or 30-06. Use 7mm-08 now and really like it.

fred243 11-26-2012 12:04 AM

Stinger, to answer your main question here about the 243, YES !!! The 243 with a well constructed, tough, 100gr bullet will drop a deer at 300 yards easy, period. Don't let anyone tell you otherwise. As with any gun you need the right bullet for the job being done and that bullet needs to land in a really good place ( vitals ) as with all shots taken at game. I would consider a Savage 243, Ruger 243, or a Remington 243. I say this because these guns have a twist rate faster than the most common on of 1:10. The Savage has 1:9.25 , the Ruger has 1:9, and the Remington has a 1:9 1/8 and I think these will shoot the 100gr and 105grs better. The 1:10 standard might or just might not be very accurate and personally I wouldn't take the chance if I knew for sure I wanted a heavier bullet. My current 243 is 1:10 and it doesn't look like I'll be able to shoot anything above 90grs for the kind of accuracy I want. The 30-06 I would imagine has a 1:10 twist and should be no problem with 100 and 110gr bullets. It should produce with the 100gr bullets about a muzzle velocity of 3400 FPS with a 24 inch barrel. It more or less has the same case capacity of the 240 Weatherby does. The comment about the blood shot meat will really be no different with the 30-06 if your using a 100gr or 110gr bullet because of the velocity you would get as well as if it's a shorter shot that's when that stuff tends to happen. Barnes has the 110gr TTSX and the 110gr TSX both in .308 cal and either would make a great bullet for deer and hog. Best to ya

broom_jm 11-26-2012 02:25 AM


You have a couple of good options, depending on your reasoning for selling the '06 and buying a 243 Win.

You could load down the 30-'06 with lighter bullets and H4895. The idea isn't smaller bullets going really fast; those would kick dang near as much as the heavier bullet loads. Smaller bullets going the same speed, or slower, will work just fine at reducing recoil while still giving you 200-250 yards worth of deer-killing range.

Another option is to split the difference and get a 260 Remington or 7-08. Either would give you just as much range as full-house '06 loads, with a fair reduction in recoil. They're also more fun to just shoot than the powerful '06 stuff, which means you may get more comfortable with your rifle in the smaller calibers.

Fred243 points out a couple of truisms that can't be overstated: A 243 can and will kill thin-skinned medium game (deer and antelope) at 300 yards or more. It does so tens of thousands of times each fall. It is a GOOD deer hunting cartridge, period...end of statement. The other truth is that well-designed, well-placed bullets kill deer! To put it bluntly, deer just aren't that hard to kill. They may go a ways with a shot through the boiler room, but they're not going to shake it off. The simple truth is that many people will shoot a 243 more accurately than a 30-'06, because recoil DOES matter to most shooters. When you put a 100 grain bullet from a 243 into the basketball-sized kill zone on a whitetail's not going far.

I'd be interested to hear what direction you take, whether it's downloading your '06, buying a 243, or maybe buying one of the 243's bigger cousins. :)

Bird Dog II 11-26-2012 04:09 AM

I wouldn't trade or sell a Model 70 .30-06 for any .243 ever made. I guess if the .243 is a Model 70, it isn't sacrilege, but but goodness sakes, don't sell it and get some new cheaper plastic stuff.

Note: I own some of that newer cheaper stuff (Savage, Marlin, Rem, Mossberg). They shoot and function well, but I would never trade a piece of art like a Model 70 in for one.

MikeG 11-26-2012 04:41 AM

If you just want to have fun with lighter bullets, try 125gr. Ballistic Tips. Don't shoot anything you plan on eating with those loaded at full velocity, though. IMR-4064 or Varget both work with that bullet weight.

My hunting load for a .30-06 is either 165gr. Partition or 180gr. Protected Point Partition. The 180 is for a gun on a mauser action where the magazine length is a little shorter than the usual .30-06 sporter.

broom_jm 11-26-2012 10:15 AM


Originally Posted by MikeG (Post 645243)
If you just want to have fun with lighter bullets, try 125gr. Ballistic Tips. Don't shoot anything you plan on eating with those loaded at full velocity, though. IMR-4064 or Varget both work with that bullet weight.

And if you DO want to hunt deer with those 125gr BT's, just slow 'em down with reduced charge of H4895. This has worked great for my wife's rifle, a sporterized 03A3.

Stinger4me 11-27-2012 03:28 AM

Thanks very much for the input and suggestions. I read all of them and spoke with others who shoot a lot. The gun will remain at this residence. I will start acquiring the things i need to reload for this rifle and will be going to a something lighter than the 180 grain bronze point bullets I formerly used. The scope will be changed as well. There is a great deal of experience and knowledge at this forum and I appreciate all of the input.

marineman 11-27-2012 03:47 PM

110 grain bullets work pretty well in an '06 (unless you have some weird twist). I load and shoot them quite regularly. 200 yard groups (farthest I've shot them) were pretty good (2" or less) out of a remington 700 CDL. I know you already had your questions answered, but I just wanted you to know that it is a good option for deer.

If you do load them- ensure you do not exceed listed max OAL (I tried getting them closer to the lands...) that will deteriorate accuracy very quickly (seated all of them deeper, accuracy was great).

Stinger4me 11-27-2012 04:59 PM

I learn an awful lot by the posts at this forum. Thank you for the additional help. Being new to reloading I need all of the help I can get.


Bonecrusher 338 11-28-2012 06:42 PM

Generally small bullets are frowned upon out of an '06, unless you are after varmints. 150 grain is as small as is usually recommended for deer size game.

broom_jm 11-29-2012 02:41 AM

The major, modern caveat to Bonecrusher's comment would be slowing down lighter bullets or shooting one of the all-copper bullets, like the Barnes TSX/TTSX. Historically, bullets less than 150 grains were not recommended, but these days the design and velocity of the bullet you choose is the determining factor. This is largely because we have so many high-quality bullets to choose from, now.

2Bits 11-29-2012 09:05 AM

I never hand any LUCK with those 100 or 110 grn bullets out of a .270 or .30-06 rifle!!! Now as MIKE stated, those 125 grn bullets using a 30-06 rifle, are the "Cat's Meow" for shoting groundhogs, coyotes or even small deer.

If you just wish to purchase a .243 caliber, I don't recommend them for deer, only with the proper bullet and your shot placement is excellent. If you really want a longer range caliber and one that is just as accurate, the 25/06 caliber gets my Vote!

It is easy to shoot, hits harder than the .243 cal and has more energy to boot with a larger choice of bullets too. It's your call !!!;):)

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