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Discussion Starter #1

What kind of management cannot keep a company that sells AR15s, combat shotguns and sniper rifles in business during the biggest gun sales boom in history?

o_O :love:
 

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Quite a turn-about in history when the Indians are selling guns to the settlers and the Army!
 

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The Shadow (Super Mod)
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"Remington" isn't Remington.
Cerberus has owned them for some time.
Cerberus buys companies on a downward spiral, who has unreasonably loyal fans. They continue to cheapen and profit off the demise of companies, then sell off the remainder of the value in the dead smoldering carcass when they are through.

Even if Remington's personal track record didn't shy you away from them, the purchase by Cerberus should have sent a very clear signal of what was to come.

Cheers
 

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The question I still haven't seen answered is 'what is Remington' in this context. Is it Remington Arms or Freedom Group or some combination. Could it be the Indians only want Bushmaster and DPMS which have both recently been shut down? That seems more likely to me but reporters don't seem that interested enough to report but is very important for the gun industry to know.
I would imagine there's some liability dodges involved...
Bushmaster still has litigation from SandyHook. DPMS from 'Vegas and Remington from a wide variety of plaintiffs, some very serious. I don't know anything about BIA law except it's different. There could be shields involved.
 

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Cerberus hasn't owned them in years. I assume that the indians will buy the assets only. But JBelk raises a very good question that I've been trying to figure out. Why???

The Navajo Nation is 18 million acres of land that is immune from all state laws. some Federal restrictions???political.
 

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It's been reported by CNBC that Remington Arms is upside down by about $150 million. I assume that's why the bankruptcy. I suspect we're just seeing a publicity ploy to sway something to somebody's benefit. Freedom group still has some viable companies most never heard of like Barnes Bullets and Dakota Arms.
The bankruptcy papers have not been filed yet so nobody knows but the ones that need to know, right now.
That was a 'poke' or a 'balloon'.
 

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Remington filed for Chapter 11 bankruptcy protection, in March 2018, having accumulated over $950 million in debt. Remington exited bankruptcy in May 2018, less than two months after filing for protection under Ch. 11 laws. They are back again.
 

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That is a very good article with details of financing way beyond my pawn shop understanding....but it sounds right.
If I wanted to invest in Remington, I'd find a Grade IV Model 722 in .222 Remington. I know it'll go up in value no matter where the stock goes or what the company does. I like guns much better than paper.
 

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The Shadow (Super Mod)
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Cerberus hasn't owned them in years.
Correct, the smoldering carcass was spun off 2 years ago. The article you linked explains for anyone who doesn't understand Cerberus, how it came to be.

Remington didn't mess up a golden opportunity, in the recent markets. And, frankly neither did Cerberus; they profited handsomely. That was the greater point needing conveyed to the OP.

As to why someone would buy a company in bankruptcy, there are always a pile of reasons behind it.
Start with money, move to fear; they're the main drivers in life.

Cheers
 

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Why is nobody mentioning the liability cases brought against Remington because a shooter at a school used their product in his attack? These nuisance legal actions are very expensive and they have been going on for several years. No company makes enough money to pay for these challenges over years. It's extremely expensive to stay in court that long.
 

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I did in #4 above.
The current lawyers for liability were hired about 1996. They've 'been in court' on multiple fronts every day since. SandyHook and Vegas cases are on an entirely different 'level' of the law of responsibilities that's already been shot down by the distillers that confirmed they're not responsible for DUI death and injuries. Product liability is something different and they are exposed in a big way there.
Remington documents are the best source of accurate information but its taken 30 years to make them available to the public.
Hindsight is 20/20 and maybe they wish now they'd spent a nickle a gun in 1947 and saved themselves many millions of dollars, but they still deny responsibility today.

The documents referenced above have been converted from a power point presentation to the Courts to pdf. That's why the format.

Settlement cost for the M700, M7 and M710 from '93 to '06.
 

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The latest round of court actions is on the company's advertising.
The suit alleges that the company marketed the potential for rapid fire and accuracy to young shooters. This is the latest type of court action against gun makers. Even though the shooters involved were not old enough to buy the guns legally and there is no way to prove that they were aware of any ads.
Getting a jury to recognize that marketing to people too young to be a target audience is difficult at best.
 

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That's all pretty much settled law and not too scary to the gun companies. Jack Daniels advertises smooth whisky on bill boards seen by kids, but they're not liable for the actions of a kid or a drunk.
 

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The Shadow (Super Mod)
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Jack Daniels advertises smooth whisky on bill boards
Jack's tag line is "Mellow" or some form of the word(Mellowed, etc). ;)

For your spirits geek knowledge:
Whisky is Scotland, Japan, and Canuckistan.
Whiskey is Ireland and the USA

Cheers
 

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Liquor trivia and spelling are not my strong suits. :(
...and I must have missed summer this year. It's finally up to 52 but still raining.
 

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Elk Whisperer (Super Moderator)
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It's just north of IdahoMontanaNorthDakotaMinnesotastan if memory serves.

I only drink single malt whiskey.

Not sure how we got here, but here we are.

RJ
 
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The Shadow (Super Mod)
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Don't forget the communist republic of Washington too! Aunt Mary's house is about straight North of me:)
 
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