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If I decide not to give up the ability to reload I will probably choose the .222 Rem. for it’s shot a minute capability. I have read many articles over my lifetime touting the accuracy potential of the .222 Rem. And if only 2 rifles sounds like a .222 would make more sense along with my 6mm Rem. than a 17HMR. For long shots in a breeze with my 6mm Rem. would you guys recommend a bullet heavier than the 70 gr. Sierras I kill chucks and crows with here in Michigan?
 

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Still a lot of shooting....and cost.

(Numbers from a previous post)If you do get 50,000 .22LR barrel life,and $5 a box (50 rounds) ammo....isn't that $5,000 worth of ammo?

If you get 1500 rounds out of a Swift, at $35 box of ammo and a box of 20 rounds (factory ammo),isn't that $2,635?

Pick a caliber....there is at least one "barrel burner" hot-rod.....but you'dput more the the cost of the rifle though the barrel before it was dead.
 

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If I decide not to give up the ability to reload I will probably choose the .222 Rem. for it’s shot a minute capability. I have read many articles over my lifetime touting the accuracy potential of the .222 Rem. And if only 2 rifles sounds like a .222 would make more sense along with my 6mm Rem. than a 17HMR. For long shots in a breeze with my 6mm Rem. would you guys recommend a bullet heavier than the 70 gr. Sierras I kill chucks and crows with here in Michigan?

Since I shoot prairie dogs, there is a rimfire included. When working a dog town a rimfire allows picking the low hanging fruit. If the town has been worked before, a single shot from a center fire will send everything down out to two or three hundred yards, while the rimfire don't seem to have the same effect.
 

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Thanks for the expert knowledge and experience you all shared. I learned a lot very quickly about the world of serious varmint shooting. And your invitation, Assasin, sounds like a terrific opportunity and I will consider it seriously. I would want to use my own rifle(s?) and the advice here sounds like a new rifle may be a great idea and well justified. Been looking at a 17 HMR and if only one more I would likely go with this chambering.

Are both “long” and “close” shots common from the same PD shooting set up?
I made up a .22 single shot that uses cast bullets and nail gun blanks for shots out to 150 yards or so, a 6mm Armadillo for shots out to 600 yards from a Ruger #1, and a 6mm-284 for shooting out to 1,000+ yards. Then my new 375 H&H turns is some spectacular long range accuracy, so I have all my bases covered.

Shots range from less than 100 yards out to well over half a mile, so you can pick whatever shots you want. It would be best if you have a set of drop tables made for each rifle in 50 yard increments, out to whatever you think your maximum accurate shooting distance is. If you do not have a set of drop tables, we can make make a set for you on site, so there will never be any need for guessing how much to hold over a long range "target" and just hope for the best. This is the kind of shooting and shooters we do not allow to hunt or shoot with us. You just have to have a scope that has a better than good "tracking" ability. We use Leica, Leupold and Barr and Stroud rangefinders, so there is no guessing on distance.

A
 

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Okay then. I will take what Center fire rifles I have acquired by then and my most accurate .22 and enjoy regular ole non- exceptional shootin. Maybe my son will go along.
 

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Okay then. I will take what Center fire rifles I have acquired by then and my most accurate .22 and enjoy regular ole non- exceptional shootin. Maybe my son will go along.
I'm liable to catch some flak for this but I'm not a proponent of 22lr on pd's you just end up wounding to many of them, there hit and they drag themselves back down the hole to who knows how long it takes them to die but if it's more than seconds it's to long in my moral code of ethics book.
A 22 mag or better yet a 17hmr is a much better close range gun, even shot slightly off center in the body will put them down.
You asked earlier about pd's behavior, after you've shot in one spot for a while the ones that initially go down the burrows close to become accustomed to the shooting and start popping up very close like 50-100yds that's when it's nice to have a rimfire sighted in at that distance to make those shots.
 

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MisterEd asked about bullets in a 6mm. In my experience, Sierra bullets are too hard for PDs and ricochets are common. The same holds true for the Sierra Hornet bullets.
I don't think you need a 6mm bullet bigger than 75 gr.. I've used several thousand 75 gr. Speer HP and many thousand 70 gr. Ballistic Tips and love them both.

My close rifles are 22K-Hornets and I don't even take a rimfire into the field. Unless I'm shooting cottontails for the table, rimfires shoot tin cans and dinger targets and that's all.

I have shot at charging sage rats with a 25 auto, but thats different. :rolleyes:
 

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Back when I was a kid in high school I developed a hankering for two rifle calibers. the 257 Roberts was one and the 220 Swift was the other.

Today I own a 220 swift a Rugar 77V I have been hunting coyotes for over 20 some years with it here in Michigan and yes is a lot more rifle that needed for the ranges here.

I hand load a 55gr serria HPBT game kings over IMR 4064 powder for a adverage 3808 FPS.
Makes one hole most times in a coyote to sew up.

Our sets are 30 minutes in most cases and you may do a couple sets before you get a shot.
Rare are doubles since we hunt as partners.
So we are not shooting enough to over heat a barrel.

My back up windy days rifle is a standard Remington 700 BDL in 243. Hand load 85gr HPBT Serria game kings over IMR 4350 to about 3000 FPS.

Is a rare day I get 10 shots at coyotes.


Al
 

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Back when I was a kid in high school I developed a hankering for two rifle calibers. the 257 Roberts was one and the 220 Swift was the other.

Today I own a 220 swift a Rugar 77V I have been hunting coyotes for over 20 some years with it here in Michigan and yes is a lot more rifle that needed for the ranges here.

I hand load a 55gr serria HPBT game kings over IMR 4064 powder for a adverage 3808 FPS.
Makes one hole most times in a coyote to sew up.

Our sets are 30 minutes in most cases and you may do a couple sets before you get a shot.
Rare are doubles since we hunt as partners.
So we are not shooting enough to over heat a barrel.

My back up windy days rifle is a standard Remington 700 BDL in 243. Hand load 85gr HPBT Serria game kings over IMR 4350 to about 3000 FPS.

Is a rare day I get 10 shots at coyotes.


Al
And what cartridge does the man who probably hunts coyotes more than any of us...the 220 Swift of course!
Because of the Swift trajectory you probably never have to worry about hold over where you hunt in Michigan, makes for confident shooting, at close ranges the bullets probably don't exit because the velocities are still high as well. Other than the loud report of the swift I don't see any down side to it's use where you live.
 

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Yes it is a flat shooter. a long range here is 250 yards in the Saginaw valley for the most part.
I got to say I have never skined a coyote I shot with the 55gr HPBT and found a pill in it lots of fragmented copper and chunks of led.
I believe they explode in the vitals.

I have devloped a like to have 222 Mag. in a nice Remington 700 BDL, not a fan of bull barrels way we shoot.
 

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I shot a coyote once that had crossed the road in front of me, he was running straight away, he was slightly down hill and I hit him dead center under the tail....right smack in the middle of his wazoo.
I was using a 25-06 with 100gr bt's, the bullet never exited. I've never heard a coyote slosh back and forth like that one when picked up and layed down, it was like everything inside of him had went through a blender. Even his eyes were bulged out, wild.
 

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I shot a coyote once that had crossed the road in front of me, he was running straight away, he was slightly down hill and I hit him dead center under the tail....right smack in the middle of his wazoo.
I was using a 25-06 with 100gr bt's, the bullet never exited. I've never heard a coyote slosh back and forth like that one when picked up and layed down, it was like everything inside of him had went through a blender. Even his eyes were bulged out, wild.
Kevin, your coyote story reminds me of a guy I raced against who called me a liar when I mentioned my 25/06 would shoot full length on a coyote and exit. He said his .257 Weatherby wouldn't do that. As it turned out we were out together calling and a big male was coming straight in across a plowed field. At about 75 yards I let him have it in the chest. He stopped in midair, all four legs stuck out and bullet blew out the seat of his pants. What a stinky mess he was.

My guess the difference was he had ballistic tips and I was shooting prohunters .
 

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On my shot the bullet probably hit the pelvis and started bullet expansion immediately, coming from the front a bullet might miss bone altogether. And no doubt ballistic tips can be very explosive, the load I had was in 257 weatherby territory on speed.
 

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Saving hides and varmint bullet performance is a contradiction in goals, but I try it anyhow.

My Fireball with 40 gr. Ballistic Tips usually makes coyotes 'slosh' when picked up and there is no exit. The day before Christmas eve many years ago, my buddy and I got seven in one day just driving around the desert. Six were 'intact'. But one was spotted nearly a mile away. We drove around to get closer but out of sight and I blew on the call. He was coming to the call like Wiley E to the Roadrunner and then changed his mind and started trotting away at about a hundred yards upwind. Just as he started up a rise, the bullet caught him between the hip bones and seemed to unzip him all the way to the neck. There was such a bundle of hair in the air that it fell on the windshield and frosted the sage brush for a long ways around.
There wasn't enough hide left to sell to a fly tyer.

I have had some very notable 'failures' of 22-250 AI Ballistic Tips on coyotes and 75 gr. Speer 'coffee cup' hollow points can make a big mess from a hot 6mm but 85gr HPBT punch right through without drama.
 

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I've had a few bullet failures with 17 Remington as well, shots where I seen the bullet hit exactly where it should have and they run or amble off like nothing happened, I chased one on foot for mile, no blood and he just kept ahead of me 500 yards the whole time. Those were rare occurrence's, normally they dropped dead like they were an electrical appliance being unplugged.
 

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I like it when they go out like a light. The one with the venison still in his jaws was first (55 gr BT, 6mm Cheapshot, 285 yds) and not even a minute later one of the runners came back and was flop-WHOPPED with the same load.

The 'failure' was a 55 gr. BT in a .222Rem at 265 yards (!!). Entry was right chest and we can guess the exit. I was surprised the 55 gr. at slower speeds still shows Swift and 22-250 results.
 

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Had bought and been deer hunting my UPPER michigan deer camp in 1991. Never heard or seen a coyote till 2002. At that time they would wake you at night being close to the cabin in the woods and start their howling and such.

We made a note to bring shot guns the next season loaded up with # 4 buck.
In 2003 my hunting partner is hunting a Cranberry bog they very from 50 to near 400 yards across. He had his 300 Win mag loaded up with a 165gr Serria HPBT over a charge of IMR 4350.

He saw a coyote slinking across the bog going to a island. Shot it right square in the poop chute, the hide looked good so he skinned it out. I do not believe that coyote had even one rib bone that wasn't broken, in fact about every bone in the body except the skull and legs was broken.

Magpies had it all gone in 2 days.
 

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To many times the 6.5 is overlooked as a Varmint rifle. Download to a light fast bullet and both the 6.5x55 and the 6.5 CM are very efffctive and cool running.
My favorite Varmint machine though, hands down, is the 204 Ruger. I shoot the Hornady 24 gr lead free bullet with CFE powder. Good out to and beyond 500 yds. Very reasonable $ to shoot and runs cool.
I am sure that other Varmint loads for the 204 will get good results too.
 

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I love sage rat shooting and I have shot many calibers doing so over the course of my life. But I have finally settled on three rifles and calibers that I use. Out to 100 yds I shoot a Savage 17HMR. At ranges to about 350 yds I shoot my heavy barrel 6mmBR. Out past that I use my bull barrel 6MM Imp, mostly on long range chucks or coyotes. They all have Leupold scope on them and they are perfect for my varmint shooting requirements. Three rifles, one purpose.
 

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Discussion Starter #60
I reckon that since I started this thing, I'll throw in a comment. I love coyotes that look like Mr. JBelk's third photo! I hate coyotes and I don't gather hides. If they look like that, I'm tickled! If my new (to me) No. 1 .220 Swift with 55 gr V-Max bullets does that, I'll grin!
 
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