[Englander]

Hello from Scotland

A while back their was decussion of carcase damage by the mighty .270, this lead me to thinking about the .25-06 a calibre which seem's to be gaining new ground in Scotland where the .270 has long been popular on hill estate's for Red stag's and hind's.Now i have only ever seen the .25-06 used on the range and personally i found it just as unpleasent on the ear's as the .270 infact until i talked to it's owner i thought it was a .270.
I was allowed to try the rifle and found recoil very light compared to my recollection's of the .270 ! My question/thought's are is it really worth the extra powder and noise ? It surly can not have much advantage over the quieter sweet shooting .257 ??
The choice seem's to me similar to .30-06 vs .308 although i know the .30-06 has the advantage when it come's to 180gn 200gn etc bullet's. When it come's to the .25-06 & .257 you are only dealing with 100gn/120gn bullet's so is it really worth the extra powder and noise ?? As for carcase damage i can not comment as i have no hunting experience with this calibre. Would like your veiw's and opinion's.............

Best wishes from across the pond

Englander.

 

[Bill Lester]

Great to hear from The Isles and a hearty welcome to our merry band.

I believe you are on the right track when comparing these two cartridges. For their intended game, which in my opinion should be limited to animals under 500 lbs. live weight, either will do essentially the same in terms of terminal ballistics. The .25-06 can somewhat extend the effective range for best killing power, for example giving the same performance at 300 yards that the .257 does at 200 with identical bullets loaded to full velocity in both cartridges. The added velocity of the '06 flattens trajectory somewhat, but that usually means less than 2" at any range compared to the Roberts at +P levels with 117-120 grain bullets. For me that's no difference, especially when the larger cartridge burns substantially more powder to do it. I would personally opt for the .257 Roberts.

 

[MikeG]

My .257 Roberts is pleasant to shoot, and has performed well on game for me.  It's not too terribly loud, even with a 22" barrel.

I'd expect meat destruction with the .25-06 to be just as bad as the 270.

 

[IDShooter]

Hello Englander,
        I essentially agree with Bill on the performance issue- there's not too much difference. Plus meat destruction can be controlled with the type of bullet you shoot. But I have a definite preferrence and I'll tell you my reasons.
        The .257 is an in-between cartridge in length, i.e. it is a little too long for a short action and a little too short in a long action. Mine is a Ruger w/long action and it constantly has feeding troubles. The cartridges want to porpoise into that extra magazine space. Plus, the throat is too short to take advantage of the long action anyway.
         With 120 gr. bullets, the best performing load in my 25-06's used 50 grs of powder, in the .257 I use 48grs (not the same powder) and I get almost 150 fps less velocity than the 25-06.
        When it comes to reloading, the .257 is the most difficult cartridge to resize without  causing oil dents that I have ever used. It has more body taper than many cartridges which is probably a factor. But I have handloaded 7X57 with no trouble whatever and it's the same basic case. Plus I've loaded some cartridges with MORE taper, but the .257 still gives me trouble.
         And last, there are few factory loads available in .257 and with two exceptions I think they stink. The Hornady light magnum and Fed. with the 120 gr Partition are okay, but they are expensive premium loads.
       There are a lot of people who are big on the .257 right now. I wanted to like it, but in the end I don't. <!--emo&--><img src="http://beartoothbullets.com/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/sad.gif" border="0" valign="absmiddle" alt=''><!--endemo-->  I wish I had not traded off my 25-06.
      Just my long-winded two cents worth!     ID

 

[MikeG]

IDShooter, have you checked the vent hole in your resizing die?  That's generally the source for bullet lube dents.

For what it's worth... my Ruger 77 hasn't failed to feed yet, although as you note, the magazine is way too long for the cartridge.

I too appreciate the performance advantage of the .25-06 (my dad has shot several deer with his) but since my wife gave me the .257 I cannot trade it!!!

 

[IDShooter]

MikeG,
     Interestingly, my .257 dies don't have a vent hole! They are Redding, the only set of those I have. Everyone talks about what a great die Redding is, I assumed they were designed that way. Perhaps someone can enlighten me as to whether Redding dies are supposed to have vent holes? All my RCBS ones do.
      As to feeding, a trip back to Ruger may cure that, but I have glass bedded the action & floated the barrel as well as replaced the 8 lb factory trigger with a Timney, and I am reluctant to send it back to them. They may want to charge me to return it to "factory specs".
Additionally accuracy is mediocre with anything I've tried other than 75 gr V-max's, which group 3/8's of an inch. But I wanted it for deer/antelope.
      If I just had one little problem with it, I wouldn't mind. But everything about the rifle & cartridge have given me a headache and I just wish I had never gotten it. Truth is I'd happily sell it but I'd feel guilty (plus I would have to put the factory trigger back in. I'm not risking that liability! That's &#3675 dollars wasted in itself, because the trigger has to be fit to the individual rifle and is no good without that gun.)
      All in all a sour experience, and my last Ruger rifle. I had to think about it hard before I bought the Super Blackhawk!           ID

 

[IDShooter]

Hi again,  
      Sorry to get this thread off topic, but the oil vent in the die got me to thinking. I have a set of 30-30 dies made by Hornady, so I went out to the garage and checked them and they don't have an oil vent either. They only dent cases if I put on too much lube, not nearly as finicky as the .257 dies. Just an interesting note. It seems every cartridge is an individual.     ID

 

[arkypete]

Sorry for posting long after the discussion was started.
I've been shooting a 25-06 for 20 years. The first 25 was on a Mark X action and 24 inch medium target barrel. It was very accurate with the 100 grain Speer hollow point and mostly accurate with the 100 grain Sierra 120s. This rifle got rebarreled and became a 375 Whelen, which is very accurate with any of the cast bullets I put through it.
I purchased a Remington Sendero in 26-06 with a 26 inch barrel, target weight. This rifle loves the Speer 100 grain hollow point and detests everything else.
I have thought about getting the rifle rebarreled with a faster twist to see if that would stabilize the longer bullets better. For now I'm doing a fire lapping on the barrel to see what that does.
The common thread to both rifles is, they both like their reloads redlined, pegged, flat out. I use big doses of 4831 or 4350 and mag primers and they both were/are happy and put the bullets just where they cluster up nice close.
I only use my 25 for popping ground hogs way out yonder. For deer I use my 45-70s.

Jim