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Were it me, knowing now what I wish I had known when I knew everything about anything, I'd buy a .308 Win. It'll kill elk just as dead as a .325 WSM.

A .280 Rem would probably be a better choice. There's magic in .284 caliber bullets in the form of sectional density.
 

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Were it me, knowing now what I wish I had known when I knew everything about anything, I'd buy a .308 Win. It'll kill elk just as dead as a .325 WSM.

A .280 Rem would probably be a better choice. There's magic in .284 caliber bullets in the form of sectional density.
There's no magic in any caliber. I 've used lots to kill big game, from 25 to 458. However, anyone who thinks a .308 is as efficient at killing game as a .325WSM has not used both. I'm tired of the old sayings promoting lesser cartridges over more powerful one, usually saying that a better placed bullet from a smaller cartridge kills better than a poorly placed one from a more powerful cartridge. DUUUUUUUHHHHH!!

But, they are still not equals in any way, shape or form given same placement. If one cannot shoot larger cartridges well, dont, and don't try and make up cr*p to excuse your inability. Some day while hunting every real, experienced hunter will make a poor shot for some reason. I can promise you that when that does happen, a cartridge with a bit more is not a bad thing to be shooting.
 

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Amen, TN! Big bullets are more forgiving when you make a mistake, and we all do or will. I, too hunt with a pretty wide range of calibers, but I really likes the 338 RCM, 35 Whelen, and 45-70 Guvamint.
 

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Jimbo62, I have tried several bullets and have reloaded all. My best combination for accuracy was using Nosler 180 BT and 200 gr. accubonds, H4350 powder works good.. My shooting resulted in slightly larger than 1" groups. Some three shot groups were under 1 inch. I imagine that factory ammo would feed without problems. I initially had some feed problems until I properly adjusted the die. It now feeds flawlessly. For those who experience any feed problems when reloading try a small base die. This will size a little smaller and feeds well. I purchased this gun in Dec. 2007 and it carries very well in still hunts. The best information on this particular gun and loads is found on RealGuns.com.
 

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Discussion Starter #25
SA911... 450 is quite a shot for anyone. Just noted that the 325 wsm is very capable from what I’ve read too 450. Still like the set up on the BLR for short range too 200 with open sights.
 

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Agree with Saskshooter.

I have never understood why people would move up to the 8mm diameter and yet continue to use bullet weights that have worse Ballistic Coefficients and sectional densities than the same weights in the .308 diameter. It seems to me that below 200 grains, you are better off with a .30 cal. cartridge. Any of the .300 magnums do things with a 200 grain bullet that cannot be matched by any 8mm of the same weight.

If I was to use a .325WSM, I would want to use heavier bullets than I could shoot in a .300 Win.
The .300 long neck is a caliber that's hard to beat anywhere in the Rockies. I have used it for Lopes, Mulies, and Wapiti. Great results on everything. With the Limb Saver recoil pads available today it's very friendly at the range as well as in the field. With 165 grain Nozlers for the deer and pronghorns one doesn't need anything else. As for elk the 165's are ok but I go to 180 grain projectiles for these big boys. Point of aim is insignificant and usually no adjustments are needed to switch back and forth. At least not for my Ruger 77. Top off the rifle with a good quality 3x9 and your in business for what ever the lower 46 have in mind. (I no longer count the two states on the least or worst coasts)....
 

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.325 is relatively new cartridge. I'd pass on a new caliber that is already had to find at Walmart. Try 308 or 30-06 with heavy bullets for heavier game.
 

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Only one

You only need one rifle and that is your 7MM. I have killed elk, moose, black bear and white tails with mine with a Nosler Partition and a Sierra GameKing BTHP. Both get the job done and I have shot these animals anywhere from 40 yards to 450 yards. Front shoulder shots drops them in their tracks. The 7MM Remington Mag is one of the most incredible calibers ever developed in my humble opinion.
 

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And the fun in using just one rifle is exactly.....what?
 

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I have a Kimber in 325 WSM. It is my favorite rifle for fit and light weight. Accuracy varies from half inch with 160 gr. Barnes TTSX to 5/8" with 180 gr. TSX bullets. It is also very accurate with 165 gr. Norma bullets. I don't know if they are still made. Used the 160 gr. Barnes to take a big 7x7 elk and a big racked fallow deer.
 

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I have a Kimber Montana in 325 WSM. This is one of my favorite rifles. It shoots 200 grain TSX's very well. I have yet to kill with it, but think it would be ideal for deer, elk, and moose. I really like the cartridge and rifle.
 

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For anyone who is interested, I have worked a lot with my 325 WSM looking for a load that works really well. I have a pre 2005 Winchester M70 with a 26" bench rest barrel and Boyd's stock. The load workup is a 200gr Nosler Custom Competition loaded with 70grs of 4000MR, using CCI MRP, and COAL is 2.915, loaded .050 off lands.

Here is velocity and group at 100 yards:
 

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The Shadow
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Welcome to the board.

Unless you have pressure testing equipment, you are working with a potential pipe bomb.
200 fps above a pressure barrel's velocities in the same length, with a large jump, and in the world of selling sexy velocities, no one recommends that powder in that cartridge...

Be careful.
 
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I understand your concerns, and I plan on doing some pressure testing with equipment. As far as pressure signs, I have measured shells before and after shots and have standard variation the same as standard pressure cartridges. Primers are not showing signs of over pressure.

Just because there is no posted load data with a powder that I am using does not mean it isn't a recommended powder. There is little load data to go on with this caliber because everyone stays with the same powders. All I did was look at powder burn rates and pressure rates and started doing a little branching off. 4000MR is used quite a bit in the 300WSM Cartridge. Shooting a low pressure loaded with 4000MR achieves better velocities than a lot of "recommended" powders loaded high pressure.
 

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Welcome to the board.

Unless you have pressure testing equipment, you are working with a potential pipe bomb.
200 fps above a pressure barrel's velocities in the same length, with a large jump, and in the world of selling sexy velocities, no one recommends that powder in that cartridge...

Be careful.
I have done quite extensive research before loading any load with a powder not listed for reloading in this caliber.
 

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The Shadow
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1) As far as pressure signs, I have measured shells before and after shots and have standard variation the same as standard pressure cartridges.
2) Primers are not showing signs of over pressure.
3) Just because there is no posted load data with a powder that I am using does not mean it isn't a recommended powder.
4) All I did was look at powder burn rates and pressure rates and started doing a little branching off. 4000MR is used quite a bit in the 300WSM Cartridge.
5) Shooting a low pressure loaded with 4000MR achieves better velocities than a lot of "recommended" powders loaded high pressure.
Again, this isn't to play safety police, but to inform of what is actually happening.

1) "Signs" don't accurately report anything repeatable.
2) Read my pressure sticky, or the recent pressure testing of the large and small primer Creedmoor, or any of my other pressure threads. Assuming, which can get you into trouble, that there is no soft case issues such as Federal has; "Signs" can begin to reliably show when you are well above 70,000 psi.
3) That is actually what that means. When no one doing pressure testing recommends it, it isn't recommended. :)
4) The trouble with burning rate charts, is that they mean very little. Burning rate charts are done from a standard, typically bomb testing. So, when you actually put it in an application, things can change substantially. RL-17 in the Creedmoor is rather progressive burning, meaning it has a changing burning rate as the pressure changes. Use it in the 308, and there is nothing progressive about it, just a standard burn. I have also shared the traces for this in a few threads.
5) Unless you have used pressure equipment and measured/recorded the curve and pressures so you know it acts progressive, that is simply impossible. Pressure = Velocity. Faith and desire doesn't propel bullets, pressure behind them does. If you are getting higher velocity than a book, or expected calculation, it's because you have more pressure. Whether that is because your specific lot of powder has a different burning rate, or the application makes it such; you in fact DO have more pressure.
 

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1) As far as pressure signs, I have measured shells before and after shots and have standard variation the same as standard pressure cartridges.
2) Primers are not showing signs of over pressure.
3) Just because there is no posted load data with a powder that I am using does not mean it isn't a recommended powder.
4) All I did was look at powder burn rates and pressure rates and started doing a little branching off. 4000MR is used quite a bit in the 300WSM Cartridge.
5) Shooting a low pressure loaded with 4000MR achieves better velocities than a lot of "recommended" powders loaded high pressure.
Again, this isn't to play safety police, but to inform of what is actually happening.

1) "Signs" don't accurately report anything repeatable.
2) Read my pressure sticky, or the recent pressure testing of the large and small primer Creedmoor, or any of my other pressure threads. Assuming, which can get you into trouble, that there is no soft case issues such as Federal has; "Signs" can begin to reliably show when you are well above 70,000 psi.
3) That is actually what that means. When no one doing pressure testing recommends it, it isn't recommended.

4) The trouble with burning rate charts, is that they mean very little. Burning rate charts are done from a standard, typically bomb testing. So, when you actually put it in an application, things can change substantially. RL-17 in the Creedmoor is rather progressive burning, meaning it has a changing burning rate as the pressure changes. Use it in the 308, and there is nothing progressive about it, just a standard burn. I have also shared the traces for this in a few threads.
5) Unless you have used pressure equipment and measured/recorded the curve and pressures so you know it acts progressive, that is simply impossible. Pressure = Velocity. Faith and desire doesn't propel bullets, pressure behind them does. If you are getting higher velocity than a book, or expected calculation, it's because you have more pressure. Whether that is because your specific lot of powder has a different burning rate, or the application makes it such; you in fact DO have more pressure.
I would advise doing research before stating facts. Many companies that dont have certain powders listed for reloading more often than not just didnt test that powder. It does not, by any means, mean it is not recommended. (2) I did a side by side comparison work up from a 300wsm load data, using the same powder as the 325. Same exact case, but smaller opening. So, knowing that the same shell with a smaller opening can shoot this powder with the same size bullet leads a person to believe that I'm not going to generate more pressure with a larger opening, unless my physics are wrong.
 

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1) As far as pressure signs, I have measured shells before and after shots and have standard variation the same as standard pressure cartridges.
2) Primers are not showing signs of over pressure.
3) Just because there is no posted load data with a powder that I am using does not mean it isn't a recommended powder.
4) All I did was look at powder burn rates and pressure rates and started doing a little branching off. 4000MR is used quite a bit in the 300WSM Cartridge.
5) Shooting a low pressure loaded with 4000MR achieves better velocities than a lot of "recommended" powders loaded high pressure.
Again, this isn't to play safety police, but to inform of what is actually happening.

1) "Signs" don't accurately report anything repeatable.
2) Read my pressure sticky, or the recent pressure testing of the large and small primer Creedmoor, or any of my other pressure threads. Assuming, which can get you into trouble, that there is no soft case issues such as Federal has; "Signs" can begin to reliably show when you are well above 70,000 psi.
3) That is actually what that means. When no one doing pressure testing recommends it, it isn't recommended.

4) The trouble with burning rate charts, is that they mean very little. Burning rate charts are done from a standard, typically bomb testing. So, when you actually put it in an application, things can change substantially. RL-17 in the Creedmoor is rather progressive burning, meaning it has a changing burning rate as the pressure changes. Use it in the 308, and there is nothing progressive about it, just a standard burn. I have also shared the traces for this in a few threads.
5) Unless you have used pressure equipment and measured/recorded the curve and pressures so you know it acts progressive, that is simply impossible. Pressure = Velocity. Faith and desire doesn't propel bullets, pressure behind them does. If you are getting higher velocity than a book, or expected calculation, it's because you have more pressure. Whether that is because your specific lot of powder has a different burning rate, or the application makes it such; you in fact DO have more pressure.
Thank you for your opinion. I am not on here trying to make enemies or cause turmoil, I just wanted to post some things that I have learned about my rifle.
I believe you are incorrect for thinking pressure=velocity because if that were true, then why dont all powders at the same pressure get the same velocity? It is because of burn rates and how the powder burns to build that pressure.
 

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It isn't an opinion that pressures generally don't "show" on brass and primers till 70,000+ psi; it is a fact and has been documented by a lot of people with pressure test equipment. Some seasoned gunwriters; some just folks like Darkker and other forum members who have an interest in the topic.


At a minimum, I urge you to tall the powder manufacturer. 200 fps increase over powders of a similar burn rate is voodoo, magic, or .... most likely, substantially over pressure.


You can 'measure' many 'signs' re: brass and primers, but mostly you are 'measuring' the fit of the firing pin to the firing pin hole, the strength of the firing pin, whether the headspace on the gun is tight or sloppy, how well the bolt lugs fit the receiver, chamber being concentric or not, chamber being smooth or not, chamber being on the large end of SAAMI spec (or not), hardness of the particular lot of brass you have, fit of the ejector to it's hole, surface finish of the bolt face, whether the bolt face is square, and the list goes on and on.


But you for sure aren't 'measuring' actual chamber pressure staring at the case, absent it being WAY past the point you should have quit. Be safe. There is no free lunch. Call the powder manufacturer and see what they say.
 

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It isn't an opinion that pressures generally don't "show" on brass and primers till 70,000+ psi; it is a fact and has been documented by a lot of people with pressure test equipment. Some seasoned gunwriters; some just folks like Darkker and other forum members who have an interest in the topic.


At a minimum, I urge you to tall the powder manufacturer. 200 fps increase over powders of a similar burn rate is voodoo, magic, or .... most likely, substantially over pressure.


You can 'measure' many 'signs' re: brass and primers, but mostly you are 'measuring' the fit of the firing pin to the firing pin hole, the strength of the firing pin, whether the headspace on the gun is tight or sloppy, how well the bolt lugs fit the receiver, chamber being concentric or not, chamber being smooth or not, chamber being on the large end of SAAMI spec (or not), hardness of the particular lot of brass you have, fit of the ejector to it's hole, surface finish of the bolt face, whether the bolt face is square, and the list goes on and on.


But you for sure aren't 'measuring' actual chamber pressure staring at the case, absent it being WAY past the point you should have quit. Be safe. There is no free lunch. Call the powder manufacturer and see what they say.
Again, I have moved pass the pressure "signs" and was not saying that was an opinion. Please read all before posting. I was saying that is was his opinion that if a powder isn't listed in a reloading book then its unsafe or not recommended. Also, that his logic of velocity=pressure is his opinion. If I had $900 to drop on a pressure reading devise, I would be more than happy to, but right now I just dont.

I have something for you all to chew on and to tell me I'm wrong or its "not recommended":
Explain this one, if you can. Same rifle, loading a 225gr Cutting Edge MTH with 66.5grs of reloader 22, COAL of 3.625" loading .020 off lands, shooting a 1/2 MOA at 100 at 2980 with a standard deviation of 3fps. Please, fire away. Caution, this is straight load data for a 220gr bullet. So please tell me I'm over pressuring and I will contact the manufacturer of the reloading book.
 
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