barrel leading
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Basically there are three methods, mechanical, chemical and electrochemical.
The most popular mechanical methods are with a couple of strands of pure copper (not copper plated) scouring pad wrapped around a one-size-too-small bore brush so it fits pretty tightly, then is used to scrub the lead out. This works better if a penetrant is allowed to sit in the bore overnight first. The popular scouring pad is Chore Boy brand, which is 100% copper, though you can also get special purpose pads designed for gun cleaning that cost more. They are at Midway, among other vendors. The popular penetrating oil is usually Kroil, though PB Blaster has been used, if you can stand the smell. Indeed, any of the lead removing bore cleaners like Shooter's Choice will do this, too, as will Gunzilla, which is non-toxic and cleans all the carbon out, too.
A commercial scrubber for hand gun calibers is the Lewis Lead Remover. It uses a bronze screen in place of the scouring pad strands. It has a tapered attachment for getting forcing cones scraped clean.
The chemical method most readily available today is No-Lead made under the Wipe Out brand by Sharp Shoot-R. It will dissolve the lead. Follow its instructions. A bore cleaner called Boretech Eliminator will attack tin in cast bullet alloys and thereby weaken it, but the action is slow. Be prepared to plug the bore and let it sit overnight if you do this. The No-Lead is much faster acting on lead.
The old way was to plug the bore and fill it with mercury and let it sit for 15 minutes while the mercury amalgamated with the lead. The amalgam has the texture of chalk and brushes right out. Unfortunately a lot of little beads of mercury also brush out and scatter all over the room when you do this, so it's now considered a toxic and unsafe method.
The electrochemical method is to use a device called the Outers Foul Out to electroplate the lead from the bore to a stainless rod suspended in the bore by 0-rings. This works very well. You can buy the tool at Brownells or build your own from plans at Father Frog's site. Scroll about 1/3 of way down this page.
The most popular mechanical methods are with a couple of strands of pure copper (not copper plated) scouring pad wrapped around a one-size-too-small bore brush so it fits pretty tightly, then is used to scrub the lead out. This works better if a penetrant is allowed to sit in the bore overnight first. The popular scouring pad is Chore Boy brand, which is 100% copper, though you can also get special purpose pads designed for gun cleaning that cost more. They are at Midway, among other vendors. The popular penetrating oil is usually Kroil, though PB Blaster has been used, if you can stand the smell. Indeed, any of the lead removing bore cleaners like Shooter's Choice will do this, too, as will Gunzilla, which is non-toxic and cleans all the carbon out, too.
A commercial scrubber for hand gun calibers is the Lewis Lead Remover. It uses a bronze screen in place of the scouring pad strands. It has a tapered attachment for getting forcing cones scraped clean.
The chemical method most readily available today is No-Lead made under the Wipe Out brand by Sharp Shoot-R. It will dissolve the lead. Follow its instructions. A bore cleaner called Boretech Eliminator will attack tin in cast bullet alloys and thereby weaken it, but the action is slow. Be prepared to plug the bore and let it sit overnight if you do this. The No-Lead is much faster acting on lead.
The old way was to plug the bore and fill it with mercury and let it sit for 15 minutes while the mercury amalgamated with the lead. The amalgam has the texture of chalk and brushes right out. Unfortunately a lot of little beads of mercury also brush out and scatter all over the room when you do this, so it's now considered a toxic and unsafe method.
The electrochemical method is to use a device called the Outers Foul Out to electroplate the lead from the bore to a stainless rod suspended in the bore by 0-rings. This works very well. You can buy the tool at Brownells or build your own from plans at Father Frog's site. Scroll about 1/3 of way down this page.
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I use this method
If you are trying to "get the lead out" give this a try. Thoroughly dry brush the barrel to "roughen up" the lead. Mix up 50% vinegar with 50% hydrogen peroxide, plug the barrel and pour in this solution to fill the the barrel completely. Of course have the firearm with the barrel verticle-I like muzzel down. Wait for the solution to do its "magic (10 to 30 minutes usually works fine) then pour out the solution. Wipe barrel with clean patch then brush barrel if needed. Repeat as necessary until satisfied with results. I've been using this method with my handguns that needed leading cleaned out and it works great for me. After finished shooting for the day clean and preserve firearm as usual.
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I've been through Beretta's armorers school on their Model 92 line of handguns. One of the tidbits I found interesting was that shooting jacketed behind lead could raise pressures into the 60,000 range. They taught to treat leading as a bore obstruction.
The mechanical methods that unclenick described are the only method that I've used. All worked, but require elbow grease. I've been fine with that.
Leading of a bore is best avoided by just getting after the cause of it (whatever that might be?)
To be as forthcoming and honost as I can, I don't have bore leading anymore due to reading posts and threads here on this board!
Search function has been my friend about most of that. Old threads and posts mostly. I suggest the same for you. "Read", "don't write". Learn from those that have allready done it the hard way.
Cheezywan
Leading of a bore is best avoided by just getting after the cause of it (whatever that might be?)
To be as forthcoming and honost as I can, I don't have bore leading anymore due to reading posts and threads here on this board!
Search function has been my friend about most of that. Old threads and posts mostly. I suggest the same for you. "Read", "don't write". Learn from those that have allready done it the hard way.
Cheezywan
Good methods have already been given. I'll add this, Lewis Lead Remover and alternate the oils.
Just because brand ASD is a good solvent doesn't mean that it always works...try some ASD, them some DSA and then some SDF, then try them all again. If that doesn't get it...Lewis Lead Remover.
Again, what kind of gun is it.
Just because brand ASD is a good solvent doesn't mean that it always works...try some ASD, them some DSA and then some SDF, then try them all again. If that doesn't get it...Lewis Lead Remover.
Again, what kind of gun is it.
Yup - My old Lewis lead remover (bought before Hoppes took them over) has been used sucessfully for years on leading bores and always leaves them shiny clean. The beauty is you can build the kit for just about every caliber known. Screens are cheap, but will last quite a while if used properly. Don't forget to use some solvent with them.
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Carburator cleaning spray ?
For years, I have cleaned my handguns and rifles with carburator cleaning spray, due to the very high cost in my country of specific cleaning products. (You have to buy the whole cleaning kit). The spray practically washes down lead and other residues and very little brushing is needed. After cleaning I inmediately apply metal protecting oil. A friend of mine, also a dedicated shooter, claims that my procedure causes rust and damage to bueing. I haven't noticed any damage to my firearms. What do You think?
For years, I have cleaned my handguns and rifles with carburator cleaning spray, due to the very high cost in my country of specific cleaning products. (You have to buy the whole cleaning kit). The spray practically washes down lead and other residues and very little brushing is needed. After cleaning I inmediately apply metal protecting oil. A friend of mine, also a dedicated shooter, claims that my procedure causes rust and damage to bueing. I haven't noticed any damage to my firearms. What do You think?
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127 Posts
I too use brake cleaners but with serious caution. Ya might want to read this article.
Brake Cleaner = Phosgene Article
Brake Cleaner = Phosgene Article
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The carb cleaner can leave the the steel vulnerable to rusting because it removes all the protection, but if you oil it immediately afterward you should be OK. The only caution I would add is that you probably want to avoid chlorinated solvents as the chlorine can activate steel, making it rust more readily.
I would suggest you make your own gun cleaner for a safer and better result. A mix developed by Ed Harris long ago called Ed's Red is a very good substitute for the military rifle cleaners from between WWI and WWII and will leave a protective layer of ATF on your gun. The components should be available to you in your country.
1 Quart or 1 Liter modern Automatic Transmission Fluid (ATF). This should be the common kind for current automobiles that meets the GM Dexron II or Dexron III specifications.
1 Quart or 1 Liter K1 kerosene (lamp paraffin), with deodorized kerosene sold for lamps being the easiest on your nose if you clean indoors.
1 Quart of 1 Liter aliphatic mineral spirits or Stoddard solvent. This is sold as paint thinner and brush cleaner for oil based paints.
1 Quart Acetone. In the U.S. the paint stores also sell Acetone, but I don't know about in your country. A pharmacy can also order it here. A chemical supply company will also have it.
The above are simply mixed together and can be kept in a gallon or 4 Liter metal or glass container, though a small gasoline container is best, and even the plastic kind is good because it is lined with a special plastic that resists the solvents. That quantity will last you a long, long time. You can also optionally add 1 lb or 1/2 Kilo of anhydrous lanolin from the drug store. That is to make the cleaner less harsh on your skin.
The cleaner has both polar and non-polar solvents so it will work to clean corrosive primer residue as well as modern. If you carry a small bottle with you and run a path wet with this into your chamber and barrel immediately after shooting, when you get home to clean the gun later it is much easier to clean.
The complete information is attached.
At Fr. Frog's web site there are more homemade cleaners including a version of Ed's Red that also acts as a copper solvent. It's on this page.
I would suggest you make your own gun cleaner for a safer and better result. A mix developed by Ed Harris long ago called Ed's Red is a very good substitute for the military rifle cleaners from between WWI and WWII and will leave a protective layer of ATF on your gun. The components should be available to you in your country.
1 Quart or 1 Liter modern Automatic Transmission Fluid (ATF). This should be the common kind for current automobiles that meets the GM Dexron II or Dexron III specifications.
1 Quart or 1 Liter K1 kerosene (lamp paraffin), with deodorized kerosene sold for lamps being the easiest on your nose if you clean indoors.
1 Quart of 1 Liter aliphatic mineral spirits or Stoddard solvent. This is sold as paint thinner and brush cleaner for oil based paints.
1 Quart Acetone. In the U.S. the paint stores also sell Acetone, but I don't know about in your country. A pharmacy can also order it here. A chemical supply company will also have it.
The above are simply mixed together and can be kept in a gallon or 4 Liter metal or glass container, though a small gasoline container is best, and even the plastic kind is good because it is lined with a special plastic that resists the solvents. That quantity will last you a long, long time. You can also optionally add 1 lb or 1/2 Kilo of anhydrous lanolin from the drug store. That is to make the cleaner less harsh on your skin.
The cleaner has both polar and non-polar solvents so it will work to clean corrosive primer residue as well as modern. If you carry a small bottle with you and run a path wet with this into your chamber and barrel immediately after shooting, when you get home to clean the gun later it is much easier to clean.
The complete information is attached.
At Fr. Frog's web site there are more homemade cleaners including a version of Ed's Red that also acts as a copper solvent. It's on this page.
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Generally, I limit excessive leading by avoiding maximun loads and when I do experience leading, I appreciate owning an Outer's Foul Out all the more.
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Isn't Stoddard Solvent the same as "Mineral Spirits"?
Mineral spirits was the recommended solvent from Beretta during their armorers course.
Mineral spirits was the recommended solvent from Beretta during their armorers course.
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13,430 Posts
Yup. Stoddard Solvent (after one of the guys who invented it) or White Spirit or Mineral Spirits. Same thing. Before chlorinated hydrocarbons (tetrachloroethylene aka perchloroethylene, in particular) it was the standard dry cleaning solvent (what Stoddard cooked it up for in the first place). It then also turned out to be good as paint thinner to replace the more hazardous (to the brain) and odorous turpentine. The Wikipedia explains the naming, here.
Take a look at cans of mineral spirits or an MSDS for mineral spirits and the Stoddard Solvent name may appear in it somewhere.
Take a look at cans of mineral spirits or an MSDS for mineral spirits and the Stoddard Solvent name may appear in it somewhere.
I suppose that "ironing" effect could happen, if you were silly enough to fire hot, jacketed loads down a bore that looked like a spiderweb from the lead fouling. I check my bores more often than that, especiallly with a not yet proven batch of lead, or different type or charge weight of powder.
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Listen to Mainspring in his post #6. It's not worth bulging the barrel or doing much worse.
If you think about the shape of a jacketed bullet ogive, it isn't a sharp scraping or wiping edge. It meets the bore with a very gradual slope. Like a backward wedge, it drives pressure sideways against the lead much harder than it drives it forward. Being softer and more malleable than gilding metal, the lead flows under the high pressure like a super heavy grease. Part of the lead flattens at its original location and what there isn't room for in the original location flows forward under the extreme pressure, spreading it into bore imperfections further forward like butter into toast.
The flowed lead does a beautiful job of glazing the bore, and the jacketed bullet surface leaves behind a beautifully smooth looking lead surface. You can detect it pretty easily. After getting powder fouling out on patches, look at the bore surface smoothness with a bore light, then run a dry bronze bore brush through and see how smooth it looks afterward. If all you have is bare steel, you don't see a change before and after the brush. But if you have a lead glazed bore surface ironed in, the brush scratches it, taking the shine off. This makes the lead visible. It looks like some of the powder fouling reappeared, but it's scuffed lead.
Another thing you can do, if you know somebody with an Outer's Foul Out, get them to set it up in your bore for lead removal and see what shows up on the rod. It can be surprising.
If you think about the shape of a jacketed bullet ogive, it isn't a sharp scraping or wiping edge. It meets the bore with a very gradual slope. Like a backward wedge, it drives pressure sideways against the lead much harder than it drives it forward. Being softer and more malleable than gilding metal, the lead flows under the high pressure like a super heavy grease. Part of the lead flattens at its original location and what there isn't room for in the original location flows forward under the extreme pressure, spreading it into bore imperfections further forward like butter into toast.
The flowed lead does a beautiful job of glazing the bore, and the jacketed bullet surface leaves behind a beautifully smooth looking lead surface. You can detect it pretty easily. After getting powder fouling out on patches, look at the bore surface smoothness with a bore light, then run a dry bronze bore brush through and see how smooth it looks afterward. If all you have is bare steel, you don't see a change before and after the brush. But if you have a lead glazed bore surface ironed in, the brush scratches it, taking the shine off. This makes the lead visible. It looks like some of the powder fouling reappeared, but it's scuffed lead.
Another thing you can do, if you know somebody with an Outer's Foul Out, get them to set it up in your bore for lead removal and see what shows up on the rod. It can be surprising.
I simply use 4 ought steel wool wrapped around a bore brush of appropiate size. Cleans it pretty quick without any damage. You can follow up with a little JB bore polish but the steel wool gets most of it. I should add, use this with your favorite gun solvent. I use janotor strength (10%) ammonia mixed 30% ammonia with GM top engine cleaner 70%. This is an excellant fouling and copper remover.
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