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I got my son one of those beautiful Schofield revolver replicas last year. And lately I got into a shootable 50/70 trapdoor rifle. Anyhow I have been recommended to try "Trail Boss cowboy action powder for these. Looks and sounds great from what I have found. But with this crazy panic buying going on...NOBODY has any powder for sale , let alone a specific type. So my question is...anyone know where Trail Boss is to be had in 1lb or 2lb bottles ?.
 

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If you were close enough I’d give you an almost full container of the stuff. I got some to try and after playing with it in my Sharps 45-70 using several weights and styles of bullets I came to the conclusion that it was probably one of the worst powders I ever tried. I still don’t know what the appeal of it is.
 

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saw one on the shelf of the local gun shop in southern vermont this past weekend.....road trip? :)
 

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I got my son one of those beautiful Schofield revolver replicas last year. And lately I got into a shootable 50/70 trapdoor rifle. Anyhow I have been recommended to try "Trail Boss cowboy action powder for these. Looks and sounds great from what I have found. But with this crazy panic buying going on...NOBODY has any powder for sale , let alone a specific type. So my question is...anyone know where Trail Boss is to be had in 1lb or 2lb bottles ?.
I have never seen Trail Boss in anything bigger than the 'under a lb' size container. If you want to reload that Schofield with original ballistics loads then you need to get some VV N32C Tin Star. A charge of 8.0 gr under a 230 gr RNFP in Starline Schofield brass will duplicate the original black powder load quite nicely without any of the crud from BP. N32C can also be used in the .50-70. VV designed it as a black powder substitute and it works wonderfully well. Much better than anything you'll get with Trail Boss.
 

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Back a few years ago, :giggle:, after my initial loading with TB for the first time,... and after one of our infamous political panic episodes died down, I picked up three 5 pound kegs. I just started the second keg a few months ago. As I have published, over the years, Trail Boss Powder , TO ME, is the safest, low velocity powder on the world wide market! But, if you are looking for safety with high velocity performance, as some folks who failed reading comprehension 101, have done,.... you may be disappointed.

Haven't had the need for more, in the past years, so, sorry, can't help you there.

I just wanted to convey my LIKE for the powder, is all!

Good luck!
 

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Back a few years ago, :giggle:, after my initial loading with TB for the first time,... and after one of our infamous political panic episodes died down, I picked up three 5 pound kegs. I just started the second keg a few months ago. As I have published, over the years, Trail Boss Powder , TO ME, is the safest, low velocity powder on the world wide market! But, if you are looking for safety with high velocity performance, as some folks who failed reading comprehension 101, have done,.... you may be disappointed.

Haven't had the need for more, in the past years, so, sorry, can't help you there.

I just wanted to convey my LIKE for the powder, is all!

Good luck!
Trail Boss was invented to provide a suitable black powder alternative for target level loads for use in the CAS matches, unlike most of the other black powder substitutes. It does quite well at that, but it also has some weird kinks that can bite you if you aren't careful. Like don't compress it. But with the resurgence of interest in the older vintage firearms and calibers that used black powder, particularly .45 Colt, not everybody wants mouse fart level loads. I love the old vintage arms and cartridges, but I hate black powder. Its filthy, a pain in the butt to clean up after, and is not forgiving if you use it outside its 'window'. That's where Vihtavuori did us all a huge favor when they came up with N32C Tin Star.

It allows you to duplicate original black powder ballistics while keeping true to the way black powder is used, which is important if you want many of the old rounds to function correctly. It provides same case fill properties as black, it runs at the same pressures as black when used correctly, and gives original performance as black. All without the filthy residue and water attraction characteristics of black.

So, I can get the same ballistics from a .45 Colt or a .45 Schofield, or in a .50-70 Gov't - almost any black powder round in fact - that I would get using black powder without any of the downside. It is also available in 1 lb bottles, so it is less expensive on a per grain basis than Trail Boss. You're missing a bet if you don't try it.
 
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Trail Boss was invented to provide a suitable black powder alternative for target level loads for use in the CAS matches, unlike most of the other black powder substitutes. It does quite well at that, but it also has some weird kinks that can bite you if you aren't careful. Like don't compress it. But with the resurgence of interest in the older vintage firearms and calibers that used black powder, particularly .45 Colt, not everybody wants mouse fart level loads. I love the old vintage arms and cartridges, but I hate black powder. Its filthy, a pain in the butt to clean up after, and is not forgiving if you use it outside its 'window'. That's where Vihtavuori did us all a huge favor when they came up with N32C Tin Star.

Hmmm, interesting, the vastly difference of opinion on one product, from one person to another!

When I got into TB, it was published as a SAFE alternative for the current powders used by cowboy action shooters, because there is ABSOLUTELY NO WAY TO DOUBLE CHARGE A CASE,... period!!! Absolutely NO REFERENCE to it being a Black powder substitute!

Yes, anyone with half the wit of a rock knows not to compress it,... unless you are a Darwin Award level candidate,... who won't be missed in the next gene pool raffle! 😄

As for "mouse fart level loads",... I beg to differ! All my TB charges to the bottom of bullets/boolits have performed in mid range velocities, and good enough penetration for self defense carry. I use TB in every caliber I load,... 223/5.56, 38spl, 44spl, 44mag, 45Colt, 444marlin and 30-06sprg, and the ballistic results were exactly what I expected, and exactly what I wanted from this type of powder!

I couldn't be happier with trail Boss Powder!!! And neither have the mass majority of other users, not talkers, I have discussed this powder with!
 

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Whoa ; Am loving reading this thread. Did not know Vitvhouri made a BP substitute N32C . That sounds excellent !!. . I endeavor to try the trail Boss for sure. I am not looking for mag loads in these old calibers and old guns. I'm 54 and have reloaded since the tender age of 12. Had many old guns over the years and the only issue I ever had was somehow getting a double charge of Unique on 405 gn trapdoor loads and it was not pleasant and trashed the rifle. I have been out of reloading since Nov 2015 and I half to get my feet wet again , especially since my son will soon be 18 and he is getting the bug all around about shooting.
 

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gew98,... I RARELY if EVER participate in threads that involve recommending load data,... RARELY if EVER!

But, Trail Boss is a whole different story,... as stated , IT IS THE SAFEST powder in the world, to me! And all you have to know, about using it, is,... MAX loads are to the bottom of the bullet/boolit,... minimum starting load is simple,... subtract 30% of max load WEIGHT.

That's it!

You don't need to know anything else,.. and, this is the loading instructions straight from IMR data that I have read!!!


Enjoy!!!
 
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Hmmm, interesting, the vastly difference of opinion on one product, from one person to another!

When I got into TB, it was published as a SAFE alternative for the current powders used by cowboy action shooters, because there is ABSOLUTELY NO WAY TO DOUBLE CHARGE A CASE,... period!!! Absolutely NO REFERENCE to it being a Black powder substitute!

Yes, anyone with half the wit of a rock knows not to compress it,... unless you are a Darwin Award level candidate,... who won't be missed in the next gene pool raffle! 😄

As for "mouse fart level loads",... I beg to differ! All my TB charges to the bottom of bullets/boolits have performed in mid range velocities, and good enough penetration for self defense carry. I use TB in every caliber I load,... 223/5.56, 38spl, 44spl, 44mag, 45Colt, 444marlin and 30-06sprg, and the ballistic results were exactly what I expected, and exactly what I wanted from this type of powder!

I couldn't be happier with trail Boss Powder!!! And neither have the mass majority of other users, not talkers, I have discussed this powder with!
I'm glad you're happy with TB. You can have my share, I don't like it. It doesn't meter through a measure worth spit, and it can be erratic. I also have not been impressed by its accuracy. Tin Star meters well, is extremely consistent, and you can work up loads with it like any other smokeless powder.

I spent a lot of time testing various powders in .45 Colt trying to come as close to the original black powder ballistics as possible, including with Trail Boss. Only three powders even came close. 5744, Trail Boss, and Tin Star. 5744 worked, but is intended for black powder rifle cartridges, not pistol. I could never get to full power with Trail Boss without getting erratic (based on chronograph results). Tin Star was indistinguishable from black in terms of performance when taking case fill, extreme spread, standard deviation, and velocity into account. The only thing it didn't have that black did was the filthy residue of burnet black powder. I used a 34 gr charge of black powder under a 250 RNFP as the base line load. In a clean gun (.45 Colt Ruger Blackhawk, 7.5" barrel), it gave 900 fps and cut clovers at 25 ft. But that was only good for 12-18 rds before fouling made the gun hard to operate and accuracy fell off. Tin Star would reproduce that all day long, for as many rounds as I cared to fire.

There is supposed to be a formula for it, just like there is for Trail Boss, but I've never seen it or used it. My initial data was based on some information I found in an article about it in Handloader Magazine from several years ago when I first came on the market. The rest I developed myself. My work with wildcats lent itself quite nicely to that, making it quite easy. Since then, I've run across data for it that is right in line with what I worked out, and what VV recommends in other calibers.

Btw, you mentioned that with 100% case fill, you were getting mid-range velocity with TB. That was what I got as well. The best I could get it to do was 800 fps that way, which is 100 fps below normal for the the .45 Colt with a 250 gr bullet based on original black powder ballistics. I tried to go beyond that, and TB got erratic in terms of pressure and velocity. When my goal was to duplicate original ballistics, that just didn't cut it.
 

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Trail Boss was never represented as a powder that would produce high end velocities, for any caliber. If you bought it, to do that, you didn't do your home work.

By the way, I did not mention FULL CASE LOADS,... what I mentioned was, cases filled to the bottom of the bullet/boolit of choice which produced the mid range velocities I expected and wanted,... no more,... no less. A full case of TB would require compressing the charge, and, we both know that is a no go!

I will credit you with the understanding that, not all powders, do everything we want, in every weapon, we load for,... BUT, that doesn't mean if it doesn't produce what we want, it is an inferior powder, and, stating such opinion, is ignorant, imo.
 
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Trail Boss was never represented as a powder that would produce high end velocities, for any caliber. If you bought it, to do that, you didn't do your home work.

By the way, I did not mention FULL CASE LOADS,... what I mentioned was, cases filled to the bottom of the bullet/boolit of choice which produced the mid range velocities I expected and wanted,... no more,... no less. A full case of TB would require compressing the charge, and, we both know that is a no go!

I will credit you with the understanding that, not all powders, do everything we want, in every weapon, we load for,... BUT, that doesn't mean if it doesn't produce what we want, it is an inferior powder, and, stating such opinion, is ignorant, imo.
Apparently you need to do some study yourself. Black powder requires 100% case fill (that means the air space under the bullet). That's why those old cartridges are so big in relation to their caliber. When you change to a smokeless powder you are utilizing only about 30% of that space on average. All that extra space serves only to cause erratic burning and thus large swings in velocity due to powder position.

So, to use smokeless and have it perform as black did, you need the same kind of case fill. Since smokeless is so much more potent than black, you do that with most of them and you are way over the pressure limit. Hence, the development of black powder substitutes like Trail Boss, 5744, Blackthorn 209, etc. With the exception of TB and Tin Star, the others are all aimed at rifle users. TB is fluffy little doughnuts that occupy air space to keep the powder next to the primer flash hole for good ignition. But it most certainly was designed to provide 100% case fill as I said, just like black powder. When you are talking about case fill in terms of powder it means the usable powder space under the bullet, NOT the empty case filled to the case mouth. It was also NOT designed to give full power one for one to black powder. If you use it properly, mid-range is the best you can do. Tin Star, on the other hand, was designed to go one for one with black in terms of performance at full power. That's why 100% load density with TB will run around 800 fps, while the same load density with Tin Star will run around 900 fps under a 250 gr. RNFP bullet. A lot of us want the full power performance but not the hassles of black powder cleanup, and that's what Tin Star provides. A lot of people also settle for TB because they don't know Tin Star is out there, which is why I referred to TB as the wrong powder.
 

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Hopefully this crazy panic attacks will be over by summer. .. and prices and product availability will go back to normal BUT I doubt it
I certainly hope this "buying Panic" ends this Summer or sooner. However once it does, many of us will see a shorter list of what is available in terms of: Powder, Bullets, and loaded Ammunition.
 

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I'm enjoying this meeting of the minds myself. . ☺ I have black powder rifle, pistol and shotgun. . If I'd a known about these black powder subs. I never would have use black powder in my 1680-1980 Armi Beretta shotgun .. I don't even know anyone who has or has ever seen one .. so I'm very interested in a powder that won't harm this 34 year old Christmas gift from the wife ...
 

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Used to shoot the TrailBoss in a Spfld Trapdoor 45-70 and a replica BP revolver with a conversion cylinder for 45LC. Full cases loaded to the seated bullet always provided moderate velocities and less recoil than when using other propellants. Good stuff if used as directed.
 

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i used TB in my 444 marlin(tc encore) with (i think) 200 or 240gr xtp. i had about 20+ of them, which i didn't need as i had gone to cast boolits. anyway, i shot them at 50 yards(as fast as a one armed guy can 😂 😂) and it was a 2 1/4" group with 20+ some bullets. on another forum, a guy used TB and 250gr Kieth-type boolits to kill deer(at 50 yards and under). i also use TB in my 30-40 krag and 45-70 handi rifle to shoot at targets.
 

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Well, I can see there are some who like TB, and others that do not. I always have some on hand.

It's at it's best for fireforming brass, safely and economically. Doesn't use a lot, and loading to about 98% load density, which I find the best for accuracy using light for caliber bullets or cast bullets, it's pretty much idiot proof. It doesn't work any better than Red Dot, Green Dot Unique, etc. and actually costs a bit more, but it's easier to use with my simple recipes. It's also deadly on foxes and pests out to 100yds or so with SX/Blitz type bullets, or 40gr Sierra HP's in my .223's. Velocity and noise are .22 Magnum class, and bullets designed for explosive velocity in the .222/223 size rounds, are very effective at 1800-2100fps. I've whacked a few eggs at 100yds in local offhand egg shoots, using my 7-08's and .35 Whelen's. For practice loads, it's way easier on the gun and shooter, and volume of fire can be quite high without excessive, (or even any), barrel heat.

What I haven't used it for is handgun loads. I don't have a single BP replica gun.

Use it or not, like it or not, it does have some utility, and can expand the range of use for some rifles, and possibly handguns. Like most powders, it's not easy to find these days.
 

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I certainly hope this "buying Panic" ends this Summer or sooner. However once it does, many of us will see a shorter list of what is available in terms of: Powder, Bullets, and loaded Ammunition.
Once the panic dies down ? With who we have in power now, I seriously doubt anything will be available in a few short months. I hope I'm wrong, but all I see now is what you can get now, will be IT. That said I bought TB in bulk a year or more ago and finally got a chance to use it in my 45-120. It worked fine to me and the only down side I saw was the powder throw I used gummed up when I got done loading about 30 rounds.
If you can find it, try Unique for both rounds.
 
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