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It may be impossible to stay six feet away from a person in a store....that is why a mask is recommended. The six foot distance is based on how far a a sneeze or cough can carry the virus. If you are in a store with narrow aisles, a mask will
provide protection that distancing cannot.
Pete
6 foot study is actually based on a study done in the 30s. Frankly the distance should be more like 20-24 feet. There are animations now including one done by MIT showing how a cough can disperse over multiple isles in a supermarket. More over simple surgical masks are not up to keeping anyone completely safe.

If you're going to use a sown cotton mask, you want to get some HEPA vacuum cleaner bags and cut them up to put inside the cotton masks.
 

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Restrictions that are in place at present, probably won't seem so restrictive, as laying in a hospital on a ventilator.
 

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I've been following this thread. Just makes me sad, and angry at the same time to see that our civil rights are being violated in such a manner.

Actually, I do not believe that the governor of any state has the authority to to close down a shooting range, or to limit in any manner how many people can assemble in a group. The fire marshall can limit the number of occupants in any building, and the board of health might have some authority concerning public gatherings, but NOT the governor.
 

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Actually, I do not believe that the governor of any state has the authority to to close down a shooting range, or to limit in any manner how many people can assemble.
Tenth Amendment to the Constitution says they can. I'd rather be safe than sorry.

RJ
 
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Our range is shut down for everyone except the few working on upgrades. The state forest is gated at all public access points, so the national forest is jammed--no cut banks or gravel pits where you could dream of "social" distance, there are so many guys (and gals) going stir-crazy. To complicate matters, 90% of the possible shooting places are above the snowline. I still get out, some, and I carry garbage bags so I can clean up the used targets, bottles, cans and plastic that get left behind in the best places; no need to get the forest service up in arms and make them shut the few remaining places down; my brass is too precious to leave behind, and I police up my own targets so I'm low impact but spend as much time in the woods as ever. Fishing season is postponed; ordinarily opening day has the launches and fishing docks elbow to elbow, but the finny critters are getting a respite--hope they all get bigger, and hungrier by the time the opener finally opens. Good luck to those of you who are most impacted--and take time to pray for the first responders (like my grandson) who are really going in harm's way!
windy
 

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Each of the first nine amendments completely limit any government actions that can be taken, The 14th amendment says the states can't restrict rights. Our rights are not granted by the constitution they are listed to remind the government that their first priority is to protect those rights listed or not. Since the rights are not granted by the government they have no authority to restrict them.
The only way rights can be restricted is if they are abused to interfere with the rights of another.
You have the right to yell "FIRE" in a dark theater as long as you are not trying to start a stampede that will likely injure people. If you abuse the right then you are penalized. With each of our rights comes a responsibility. Every anti-gun law passed is an attack on our rights that are supposed to be protected by the federal government according to the second amendment. Those restrictions passed by states, counties and cities also go against the 14th amendment.
 

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Discussion Starter #28 (Edited by Moderator)
Well in my case, as I mentioned earlier, the range is owned by the County. So I think they can legally shut that one down, though they should give us a break on our next annual membership dues because of this. I'd like to get the portion of my taxes that are applied to the range too, but I don't see that happening any time soon. :rolleyes:

There are many studies about this virus. I read one today from a scientist in Israel, who noted that those countries who are not mandating quarantines suffer results exactly the same as countries that do. Also, as we know, the danger of this virus is less than any of our typical flu seasons. I wouldn't scoff at it, surely it's dangerous, but we're shutting down our country and our affliction rates and death rates are no different than Sweden (et al) who are not shutting down and quarantining.

So maybe there's some light at the end of this overly-long tunnel. I would think ranges, especially in small towns like mine, would not be affected to the point of closing.
 
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I live in Michigan would love to go to one of our bi monthly Sunday meets at the resturant we have been useing now for close to 5 years after the former resturant told us our talking of coyote shooting was upsetting the other guest who had just discovered the resturant as a cool place to eat.

We found a new resturant with a meeting room where we have been holding our meeting. The former resturant closed about a year and a half later because they had ran off the other locals that ate there.

I would love to go back to shooting clays every Siunday morning with a couple friends too.
I would love to be able to go with friends to fish the Saginaw River and Bay.
I would love to be able to go to the grocery store and not have to wear a face mask and gloves and even by TP.

I see Michigan as the Number 2 or 3 state in deaths due to this virus.
I am sorry so many here in Michigan feel our rights are being voliated by limiting how many are allowed in a store at one time.
But I myself am going to abide by the rules as they stand.

I am sorry part of the stay in place says yes by all means go fishing but keep a 6 foot or more distance and do not use a power boat that will require you to handle a gasoline pump handle that can hold the germ for up to 72 hours.

I am sorry you can not get your hog out and call all your buddies to go on a long ride and stop at road side rest areas to drink beer together and just whip it out and P where ever you wish becase the rest areas are closed due to vandles looking for TP. Also touch gasoline pumps and leave the germ.

This shut down is ment to protect us from this virus that little is knowen about yet. But it is knowen persons showing no signs can have the virus and spread it.

It is not fair to compair the USA to countrys like Sweden and a few others because the population here is so much greater. Gatherings for sporting events there is also way different than here in this country.
Doesn't help the first out breaks happened in a comunist country that controll the press and what information is shared with the rest of the world.
 

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I belong to 2 ranges and both of them are closed. The one in Los Lunas is big enough and seldom has more than 5 people there. The range in Belen has a Monday morning pistol shoot and those of us ( normally 10 people ) that go there act like we have not seen each other in 10 years. Social distancing is a bit more difficult but it could be done. Our democrat governor is hard core anti-gun so anything gun related ain't gonna happen.
 

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I have a couple of places on BLM land that I do go to shoot on, Trent. Problem is, with all the BLM gates to have to go through, 7 BLM one way and the other way has 1 BLM and 2 STATE gates to open and close, it's really a hassle to get out there. There is a cozy little "bowl" on the side of a mountain that is perfect for shooting, but as there are no benches or awnings, I have to improvise in addition to having to fuss with the gates. It's beautiful, but it's a pain to get to.

Now, in case anyone wonders why there are State gates out there on BLM land, here's why: This is a large chunk of BLM land, south and west of Alamogordo. A rancher or two lease the vast majority of it for cattle ranching. In the middle of this tract, there is a little 3 or 4 acre plot of NM State land. For many years you could drive in there on BLM land and drive from Highway 70 all the way to Oro Grande (thinking maybe you know there area a little, Trent), and never know you drove over some State land. But all of the sudden, in about 2017, NM decided they needed to fence both side of their property with nice, steel swing gates. A simple chain secures them. So now, after opening a BLM gate and driving a few miles, you have to d*!k with two more gates! They couldn't put cattle guards there, because that wouldn't harass the public enough. Unfortunately, they are still standing and besides, however irksome, are at least not locked.
We shoot on BLM land in central CA and they have heavy gates a truck couldn't bring down. Probably been done before and why they are reinforced.

Everything gets locked up for fire hazard on April 15 through until around mid-October or after the first big rain.

We were trying to get out there before the closure, but changed our minds when hearing someone was given a citation for surfing. Stupid
 

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I guess I'm lucky as my next door neighbor has a place in the country where I built a range with a covered shooting bench for us both to use. Made it out there a week ago to test some handloads in my 94 Win. 30-30. No signs on the gate there other than a no trespassing sign.
 

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I must admit that I pity you poor guys that have to pay to shoot. In Nevada we have some ranges, but I've never been to any. Too easy to just go out and shoot on public ground (mostly BLM). I have a "range" I set up with target markers at 100, 200, 300, 400, & 500 yards and if I want a bench, I have a portable that I take. Downside is that the distances aren't exact--I surveyed them in and they could be off by as much as 9-12 inches! Terrible! And such a long drive--nearly a mile and a half from the house! I realize that I'm lucky, but the types of ranges you folks refer to are just alien to me. I do also shoot on a buddies private range where he has built a real nice bench and has target stands at 25, 50, 100, 200, & 300 yards. I'm so spoiled that I don't go there too often because it is 6 miles! I don't know if they closed the county range here or not. I don't quite understand these range closures, as the Home Security Dept. stated that gun stores and shooting ranges were classed essential. The BATF even issued a special ruling that allows gun stores to sell through drive up windows.
Our government is supposed to be controlled by the people, but now the government is controlling the people. Is this an indicator of times to come?
 

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Discussion Starter #36
I'm not in the market for a firearm right now, But!... if we had a gun store with a drive-up window, I would choose and buy one just to say I did!!

In New Mexico, BLM land has an assortment of gates - some are flimsy cedar and wire, others are sturdy steel. In my little happenstance I mentioned earlier, BLM did not lock that gate up. I think the rancher did. I checked with BLM and the County some time after that, and both said they had no recent closures of land. The gas company wouldn't lock it up, I think it was a rancher, tired of people coming in to hunt rabbits or whatever. He can't do that.
 

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The public range near Boise ID is closed. It is owned by the Idaho Department of Fish and Game and operated by a non-profit club. The Club and the local IDFG folks worked out a way to meet social distancing requirements, but the Department Director said close the range along with all of the parks, boat ramps, etc.

The State allowed the gun stores to stay open as essential businesses, and those with their own indoor ranges keep using them.

I am actually OK with closing the public range to recreational shooters, even though I am a regular competitor. That is recreation, not an essential service. The closure applies to the concealed carry classes too, though, and that is probably a greater effect on second amendment rights.

This will pass, and in the meantime I will put my faith in the scientists and follow their recommendations.
 

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In regard to BLM gates and fences, there aren't many in Nevada. Virtually all the BLM ground is leased for livestock grazing and the ranchers do the fencing, and they tend to not do more than is truly needed. A grazing lease does not give the lease owner private property rights, thus he cannot lock gates or restrict access to the public. It is still public property. Before I retired, my profession required that I travel and work on BLM ground. Occasionally we would come onto locked gates (most prevalent in Colorado for some reason, but other states too) and we would cut off the lock(s). We knew the law because it was involved in our business. A few times we had the law called on us but they always informed the disgruntled rancher that we were correct. Actually, a couple of times we had to get the sheriff to protect us from angry but wrong ranchers.
Also, I have on several occasions found BLM land posted during hunting season and locked gates seem to become more prevalent during hunting season. This is illegal on BLM (or Forest Service) land. In some instances I've resorted to carrying BLM land status maps with me to verify to ranchers that the land they are posting or locking is BLM, not private and that like it or not, the land is open to the public--I just can't graze my cows there.
 

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Unless the mask if an N95 or equivalent or respirator, most masks only afford you a 10% improved chance of not getting Covd-19. Most do not stop the smallest particulates and most allow air flow in from the top around the nose.
 

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Envy you guys with all that public land to shoot on!

I've been told by medical people, that if you can detect an odor through a mask, it isn't stopping an airborne virus. To put it in more blunt terms.... if you can smell a 'body odor' (AHEM) .... then that mask isn't protecting you.

People wandering around wearing coffee filters, handkerchiefs, dust masks from the hardware store, and the like are deluding themselves.
I'm wearing custom mask that were made by my sister in law, she has also made many for our local hospital and nursing homes!
If they're good enough for them they're good enough for me!
I've worn many M95 mask over the years and believe me you can still smell odors, just walk into a hot fart and you'll know what I mean!
 
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