Shooters Forum banner

Status
Not open for further replies.
41 - 60 of 78 Posts

·
Registered
Joined
·
967 Posts
The whole idea behind the masks isn't to protect you, which it won't. It is to protect others if you are unknowingly infected and cough or sneeze. The mask is to significantly reduce your released aerosols that may carry the virus. It requires a very specialized mask to block viruses from coming in. The odor thing is basically correct regarding viruses. They are far too small to be filtered out by anything other than very specialized masks, that are in essence custom fitted, none of which are readily available to the public. So, if you think the mask is protecting you, good luck, but you are misled. They may help reduce spread from infected individuals to some degree, but even that is pretty limited.
 

·
Elk Whisperer (Super Moderator)
Joined
·
10,452 Posts
Those restrictions passed by states, counties and cities also go against the 14th amendment.
The 14th Amendment deals with "Equal Protection Under the Law". As written in 1868: "nor shall the state deprive any persons of life, liberty or property, without due process of law; nor deny any person within its jurisdiction the equal protection of the laws.

If the state, city or county governments deem it necessary to do something protect YOU (as in a natural disaster or pandemic) they are allowed to set about such laws, whether you agree with them or not.

Just where were you during government class?

RJ
 
  • Like
Reactions: 60DRB and lowball

·
Registered
Joined
·
7,862 Posts
Discussion Starter #43 (Edited)
Aw it's close enough. More and more today, the government (Pol&t&c&ans, particularly legislators) do what they want with very little regard for the Constitution. The idea is to advance whatever agenda the consensus might deem worthy and wait for someone to challenge it. See, WE pay the legal costs. If there are no lawsuits contesting Constitutionality, nothing will change. So, 14th, 3rd, 10th, 2nd....... "What, at this point, does it matter?!?"

One thing's for sure: my range is still closed and it doesn't matter what Amendment I blame it on. Plus, I'm still convinced Government can shut down Government ranges.
 
  • Like
Reactions: BreezeeRidge

·
Registered
Joined
·
13 Posts
Well gentlemen we are in a time in which we like our firearms but we like our health more. Our ranges are closed for now, The closest is out door and 38 miles from me I was an rso, the other 40 miles is an indoor. If someone has to drive 13 miles I would take that any day. I no longer am able to hunt, big or small game however my re-loading and shooting my firearms give me a lot of pleasure. I want to get back to them asap. Be safe and stay healthy.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
3,768 Posts
The 14th Amendment deals with "Equal Protection Under the Law". As written in 1868: "nor shall the state deprive any persons of life, liberty or property, without due process of law; nor deny any person within its jurisdiction the equal protection of the laws.

If the state, city or county governments deem it necessary to do something protect YOU (as in a natural disaster or pandemic) they are allowed to set about such laws, whether you agree with them or not.

Just where were you during government class?

RJ
Actually. Suspension of individual rights is not allowed during a national disaster. Such as a storm, earthquake, etc... that’s been established. The most recent one I know of was during hurricane katrina. LA was confiscating firearms and forcing people from their homes. But as Stretch pointed out. The officials didn’t actually get the accountability in the end. We got footed the bill and it was only after the illegal acts were perpetrated that they said “no, you can’t do that”.

This “We’ll take it from them first and wait for someone to sue us” form of government is really sad. But it’s what we have today.

The 14th and 10th grant the states powers that aren’t restricted by the federal government or the bill of rights. They can’t lock you up in your own home or shut down your business. Those rights are protected by the bill of rights. The things they’re not allowed to do. Like re-institute slavery for the betterment of society or your “safety”. Or make religion illegal to stop fighting (which is a valid argument. Every major conflict involves religion). Or limit speech to remove conflicts. How many bar fights, shootings, or stabbings happen without speech as the instigator?

They should be encouraging people to social distance. Not demanding it. They should be pushing for community, not submissiveness and control. The extent of their powers is to inform people of the situation and give guidance and encouragement. Not force compliance. They would have gotten much further with sugar than the stick IMO. And the large majority of non compilers I see are my local democratic voters. They had a dang BBQ in the park next to the big fire station here locally! Playing basketball and volleyball! I mean. Come on! More than half the cars wore Democrat bumper stickers! My old man drove by and took pictures for proof later on if anything is said!

Anyways! This is serious. If ANY of you guys/gals here have health conditions! Please. STAY AWAY FROM OTHERS! Stay inside and keep clean! And if you’re not a high risk, please! STAY AWAY FROM THOSE WHO ARE! I don’t want to log on here in a month or so and see a huge drop in membership!

I ride motorcycles. I take the personal risk. If I didn’t want to take the much higher risk of dying in an automobile accident. I wouldn’t ride! If you think you’re going to be at risk from this disease. Take the precautions. How many folks do you see out an about with oxygen tanks? They are constantly at risk. If you have bad cholesterol, don’t eat McDonald’s! If you’re allergic to peanuts, don’t eat peanuts! This is nothing new. But don’t try and use your fear to control everyone else’s lives. Take care of yourself. Many are going to put into poverty because of the way our panic prone leadership are reacting.
 

·
Elk Whisperer (Super Moderator)
Joined
·
10,452 Posts
Actually. Suspension of individual rights is not allowed during a national disaster. Such as a storm, earthquake, etc... that’s been established.
I'm not saying suspension of individual rights and neither are the 14th or 10th amendmants, what is being advised is social distancing and staying at home. There are laws concerning the blatant disregard of these advisements if the actions of the offenders endanger the lives of others.

Read it however you want.

As a retired first responder I'm taking this seriously.

I am also lucky to live where the presence of COVID19 is virtually zero.

Anyways.

RJ
 
  • Like
Reactions: 60DRB

·
Registered
Joined
·
2,751 Posts
My range and kdub’s are operating quite similarly. His is over to the East. Mine is in the south, adjacent the police academy. The difference seems to be that mine is only open to members now (it’s normally only open to the public Saturday mornings anyway). As with his, all competitions are cancelled for the time being.

I’m glad the range is still open. I cannot find a biologically sound reason to close it, and it is simple at that range to adhere to distance guidelines.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
25 Posts
Well I am deemed essential... lol project manager for restoration company our new protocol is to wear a mask entering someone's home mainly as someone previously stated to protect them not me...our state run public ranges are shut to protect the employees of the state probably due to liability I think..i still go to our private range its an easy 45 minute drive even with the lighter traffic. Florida had multiple ramp closures due to people having parties on the sand bars. So much for going out fishing. I don't understand the stuff about gas pumps and boats sounds like BS to me. Heck I have to fill the tuck twice a week still busy as ever just wash your hands. In Walmart the other day I can vouch for the yellow caution tape wife told me they had all kinds of isles blocked off. I don't understand that bs either oh well hopefully it will all go away and we will be done with it. I heard Michigan might go republican if those that are pissed off can remember it during election time.....
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
827 Posts
I MY SELF DO NOT UNDER STAND PEOPLE MAKING THE STATEMENTS THE POLITITONS DO AS THEY WANT.

Yet they get elected every year over and over som have been holding the same office for over 30 years and still get elected.


Vote them out start letting them know they are supposed to work of us.
Dump the chumps.
 

·
The Hog Whisperer (Administrator)
Joined
·
36,083 Posts
I think we're all going to get exposed to the "cooties" sooner or later. Cat got out of the bag way too quick on this one. Society (not just ours) is WAY too mobile. "Stuff" goes halfway around the globe, overnight. That's just the way it is.

In the end - the question may become "at what rate of death do we shut down the country?" "Normal" flu death rate? "Bad" flue death rate? 2x, 3x, or more death rate of a "bad" flu season?

That's what it comes down to. People are gonna die of this.... some as-yet unknown number. Just like some people die of (fill in the blank) the flu, car crashes, lightning strikes, bee stings, drugs (prescription and non), etc. If anyone thinks that our society isn't willing to accept a certain number of avoidable deaths from one or more causes to avoid inconvenience and/or behavior changes, they just aren't paying attention.

So I think we're going to have to see where this all shakes out, and then decide accordingly. Looking at the data collected so far, it clearly is a lot more lethal to the elderly, and especially those with respiratory conditions (as is the normal flu and lots of other things for that matter). It makes for pretty sensational news feed if the "cooties" go through a nursing up and wipe out half the residents, but then no one points out the obvious: those folks were in the "home" as their last stop before the grave, generally. Yeah, uncomfortable to think of in that manner, but sometimes truths are uncomfortable. Did it cut their lifespans short by a few years, a few months, or a few minutes? VERY hard to think abstractly about that, especially when your beloved 'nana' is one of the victims under those circumstances. Very, very difficult. But "nana" wasn't in the "home," training for next Thanksgiving's 5k Turkey Trot, either. I actually had to explain that to a friend, who was born in a different country, and has a different cultural tradition of how to care for the elderly.

I kinda wonder, in the end, if we'll somewhat offset the death toll from this, by having far fewer people driving, and far fewer people going to the ER & hospitals for non-life threatening emergencies. Hospitals are, unfortunately, a good way to die from something else you didn't have before you went there (MSRA comes to mind).

Anyway, don't think we are really going to know for a while. It doesn't help with the 24 hours news cycle stirring up panic, and for that matter it doesn't help that some of our elected officials are .... let's just say .... less knowledgeable about medical information. Unfortunately, it does seem with many large organizations, both public and private, the individuals who end up at the top, often seem the least qualified to make decisions based purely on facts. Seen that many times in the tech industry, as an example. It gets worse when the doctors and scientists themselves are shrugging their shoulders and saying "well, we're really not sure to be honest." Read between the lines, that is pretty much what the most-knowledgeable people are admitting, if they are being truthful. And then we expect our elected officials to be smarter than that? I'm surprised it isn't worse, looking at things from that context. Yeah I'm as frustrated at the stupidity as anyone. Leave the lake open, leave the park open, but shut down the boat ramp? Utterly stupid, but that's what is happening around here. Monkey-see, monkey do. One brainless politician "does something" (no matter if right or wrong) and the rest follow like lemmings off a cliff.

Let's be as patient as we can.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
520 Posts
I MY SELF DO NOT UNDER STAND PEOPLE MAKING THE STATEMENTS THE POLITITONS DO AS THEY WANT.

Yet they get elected every year over and over som have been holding the same office for over 30 years and still get elected.


Vote them out start letting them know they are supposed to work of us.
Dump the chumps.

Yes. They continually get reelected. The reason for that is because, usually, the incumbents are a better choice than the challenger and we have to settle for the lesser of two evils.
 

·
The Hog Whisperer (Administrator)
Joined
·
36,083 Posts
I'd say it is more that that incumbents have a little more name recognition than the challengers, usually, and have had the advantage of collecting donations since the last election. But it isn't impossible to vote them out, and I think come fall a few elected officials who thought their jobs were relatively safe are going to find themselves unemployed. We'll see.

In the end, it is up to the voters, but whether the voters can cut through the BS on tv / social media, remains to be seen.
 

·
The Shadow (Super Mod)
Joined
·
7,160 Posts
Unfortunately, it does seem with many large organizations, both public and private, the individuals who end up at the top, often seem the least qualified to make decisions based purely on facts. .
The Peter Principal, written in 1969: Promote to incompetence.;)
 
  • Like
Reactions: gew98

·
The Troll Whisperer (Moderator)
Joined
·
23,796 Posts
How did I know this was going to turn into political rants?


Let's all calm down and try to get along. Being cooped up with others is bound to fray nerves and pounding computer keys to vent frustrations really doesn't help the rest of us.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
827 Posts
I am not cooped up nore have I since this covid 19 hit this country.

I have been shooting my 22 Mag a little bit in my back yard range. been reloading slugs for my 20 ga Remington slugger. Had to make a tool to flar the hull mouth and took for ever and about 2 dozen Sundays to get my roll crimp tool from Russia of all places.











Also been cutting down Dead Elm trees on my property and cutting them up for fire wood.










I also built a new deer blind to cover some of the new place we bought a bit back.






Is going up on this platform as soon as the wind dies down a bit.

[/url


Just saying I would vote for a Pig rather than some one not working for us.

I read some place a congress persons and sentors spend 75 % of there time trying to get contributions.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
7,862 Posts
Discussion Starter #57
I'm not 100% sure how this took a political curve - I really just wanted to tell you guys that our County range was shut down! :D

It doesn't really matter if they have authority to close it, it's a government range so they can do it if they choose to. But certainly it makes no sense to close down public ranges, or public anything for that matter if the activity only involves a few people. They are thinking in terms of what may or may not be essential, (Non-essential: boating, shooting, meeting at church, etc. Essential: abortion, open mosques, etc.). But they're forgetting that these "non-essential) activities keep mental health on an even keel. The restless in Michigan are showing evidence of that.

Luckily, in NM, restrictions are very few. For awhile, Walmart had only the doors at the grocery end of the store open. You entered and exited through there only, while the main doors were cordoned off. That changed this week. It'll probably be awhile before that store goes back to 24/7, but that's alright. Virtually everyone is wearing masks now. That's probably going to be something that'll be with us for at least the foreseeable future.

Heard on the radio today that some governments are considering requiring people to be vaccinated before returning to work, or before being allowed to participate in certain activities. Of course, there's the obvious issue with identifying who and who hasn't been vaccinated ("Your papers please"), which was the discussion on the radio show. But I was thinking: I thought it was going to be a year or a year and a half before we can even develop a vaccine? Even the most optimistic say no earlier than September, I didn't hear anyone on the show key in on that.
 

·
The Hog Whisperer (Administrator)
Joined
·
36,083 Posts
Yup, generally takes the better part of a year to update an existing vaccine - which is why the usual flu vaccine generally is nowhere near as effective as folks would assume. The virus has plenty of time to mutate before the next flu season. So it is a crapshoot as to whether the flu vaccine will be the least bit effective. As a matter of fact, in a friend's family, two of the three got the flu shot, but all of them ended up getting the flu! A small sample size, but it shows you that it can happen.

Anyway, wouldn't pay too much attention to talking heads on radio, any more than I would pay attention to them on TV.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
910 Posts
I've been following this thread fro the start. Looked like a road map to downtown Los Angeles.
So our range is still open because of 2 things. 1.) It's a private club and benches are 8' apart. 2.) So far we have not reported any cooties in our county.
But the other club I shoot at has been closed by the board of directors due to the size of the facility and they have cooties in there county.
But this gave them a chance to do some big projects for improvement while shut down. So they rented a big front end loader and we've built a 5 bay action steel range along with moving another berm around and have a dedicated 100 yd range next to it separate from the public range.
Felt good to get out and run that loader after 10 yr's of retirement. Hadn't lost my touch either.:D
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
1,682 Posts
My range/club (private as well) is still open. Just not doing any "social functions" at the club main house for now, and being "space conscious" of others.
And one of my neighbors has a mini range at the bottom of his property for up to about 75 yards.

We do have some C-19 in the area...
 
41 - 60 of 78 Posts
Status
Not open for further replies.
Top