[ENGLANDER]

Hello from Scotland

I have found a .356 Winchester 94 AE XTR its been in the shop for a while. The shop owner says it came from a winchester collecter (deceased) and is as new condition. It has mounts dies and some factory ammo !

My question to you gents is what do you reckon to this model ? I have always fancied a.358 BLR but can't find one. I know the .356 is basically the same except rimmed for lever.

I know the AE stands for "angle eject" but what about XTR ? Possibly extra ?

As with any gun i own first and foremost it is a hunting tool range toy second.

Would like to here what yoiu have to say about this rifle ?

The rifle is again down south so i can not see it any know were i can see a good photo of this model ?

Looked on gun broker found a .375 94 xtr pre- something ? Is this the same ? 20" barrel ?

Look forward to your replys..............

regards Englander

 

[DOK]

Englander,

I don't know if it is the exact model you're asking for a photo, but the "Trading Post" on this site has several excellent pictures of a .356Win 94 AE for sale.

Dan



<!--EDIT|DOK|May 20 2002,08:15-->

 

[Muleskinner]

Excellent rifle.  Forget the mounts, buy a peeper for it.  The .356 and .307 are tow of the rare REAL cartridge improvements of this century.  Crap like Warbirds and RUMs sell better cause we're a "bigger is better" kind of folk, and most hunters wouldn't know an honest to god improvement if it bit 'em in the arse.  The .356 '94 had a beefier receiver.  That may account for the "XTR".  If I got one, I'd remove the hammer block safety and install peeps (with a blade front).  If it was a collector, why did he have dies and mounts?  Sounds like a sales pitch to me.  No real lever collector would think of putting a scope on this rifle.  If you must buy a scope, check out the Leopold 2.5x Compact.

 

[Muleskinner]

Excellent rifle.  Forget the mounts, buy a peeper for it.  The .356 and .307 are tow of the rare REAL cartridge improvements of this century.  Crap like Warbirds and RUMs sell better cause we're a "bigger is better" kind of folk, and most hunters wouldn't know an honest to god improvement if it bit 'em in the arse.  The .356 '94 had a beefier receiver.  That may account for the "XTR".  If I got one, I'd remove the hammer block safety and install peeps (with a blade front).  If it was a collector, why did he have dies and mounts?  Sounds like a sales pitch to me.  No real lever collector would think of putting a scope on this rifle, and they likely wouldn't reload cause they wouldn't shoot it.  If you must buy a scope, check out the Leopold 2.5x Compact.

 

[William Iorg]

Englander,

If it is marked XTR it is probably a pre-safety rifle. XTR stood for extra, or something to that effect. It meant that the wood was checkered. These early rifles had a little nicer wood thatn the later examples.
The pre-safties still have the rebounding hammer. Now that we know that we can swap out the lower tangs, if the rebounding hammer bothers you there is a fix.

The .356 is a serious rifle that will meet your velocity and muzzle energy laws. They are all 20" barrels. For your larger Roe deer the Speer 220 gr. jacketed FN is probably the best starting point. Strongly built and good ballistic coeficient. The RCBS 200 gr GC cast bullet is another good starting point. For smaller stuff the Hornady and Sierra 200 gr RN bullets are fine.

If this is an early rifle the rear scope mount holes are drilled at an angle and the current Williams reciever sight will not work. Winchester changed this pretty quickly but check before you purchase scope mounts or receiver sights. The monte-carlo stock of the early big bore rifles are ugly but they handle recoil well.

If you mount a scope I suggest Weaver bases and Millett Angle Loc rings, they handle recoil very well.

The Speer #13 reloading manual has a good cross section of loading information to get you started along with free stuff from winchester.

You can make your brass from .444 Marlin brass. Use a Redding form/trim die, worth whatever it costs to get one over the deep water.

If I sound like a .356 booster, I am! Not a lot of jacketed bullets available but those that are available are good ones. RCBS and NEI have you covered with molds. Nothing currently available from Lyman is worth messing with.

Pistol bullets, both cast and jacketed work very well in this caliber/rifle. The Lyman 200 gr. RN for the Super Police .38"s or the .38-200 feeds well in this rifle for reduced loads.

I could go on and on....

 

[ENGLANDER]

Thanks for the veiws guys and pointing out the photo in trading.

William it has a weaver k4 base ? is that good ?

I would like to try it with peeps and see if i can hit any thing !

William- had a peek at the speer manual very nice.

You do seem to preach the .356 do you have one ?

I will have to stick a deposit on it as im spending to much on .444 and other bits at present.

Will let you know how i get on..............

Regards Englander

 

[William Iorg]

Englander,

Sure do!
I like the Weaver bases, they are not pretty and they stand up a little higher than others but they handle recoil well.
They only thing to watch for on the early big bore angle ejects is if the rear base is angle drilled. The Williams sight wont fit.

 

[Charlie Z]

Englander,

William has it right.  It represents not the best time for American leverguns, but it's OK.  However, the cartridge is a great one, even if it's an orphan.  A good argument can be made that it's the perfect deer round.  I'd like to see that one in production again (Marlin&#33<!--emo&--><img src="http://beartoothbullets.com/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/wink.gif" border="0" valign="absmiddle" alt=''><!--endemo-->

Charlie

 

[Jack Monteith]

Hi, Englander:
 Weaver K4 base?? A Weaver K4 is a scope, not a base. Possibly the seller meant bases for a K4 scope or it comes with a K4. Anyhow, both the scope (a 1" tube 4 power) and the Weaver bases are good sturdy equipment, although not quite top line. Or he had a K4 on the rifle and the bases could be anything and the scope rings are  separate items.

Bye
Jack

 

[ENGLANDER]

Lever guns have a very small following over here, yet since the hand gun ban there has been lots of .44/.357/.38 marlin/ winchester/Rossi advertised as gallery guns plus a few clubs.

As for hunting there can not be many guys over here who hunt with lever guns.

The guy that owned the .356 also had about 20 Win .30-30's all fancy limited stuff. Bought though the shop, now hes passed on the family has asked the shop to sell them.

Never owned a Winchester and always fancied a .358 BLR so figured this might kill to birds with one stone !

I know i can order .356 brass from Midway but is it possible to make .356 from say .303 brass ? Probably not but it would be very handy as i can get tons of .303 brass dirt cheap or free.

If i get this rifle my arsenal would be .22/.308/.356/.444 so should be able to handle just about any thing !

I'll tell the wife its an investment ! Worth a try.

Regards Englander

 

[William Iorg]

ENGLANDER

You cannot make .356 from .303 Britsh. You CAN make the .307 and .356 from .444 Marlin. The easiest way to do it is with the Redding form/trim die. These dies are smooth on the inside and make the process easy. You can do it in intemediate steps but it is harder. I have found brass life of reformed .444's to be slightly shorter. Probably because I did not anneal the necks.
The reformed brass accepted any load I had tried with standard Winchester brass. Graff & Sons also has .307 and .356 brass.

Remember that with your velocity limit of 2450 fps and 1400 ftlbs of muzzle energy (is that correct?)  you will have to use maximum loads with the .444 and .356. The short barreled .444 Outfitter will probably  not "prove up" with bullets heavier than 250 grains. The .356 with 20" barrel with make the cut with a 220 Speer using a maximum load. Everyone has to live with silly rules, but you have a tough one!

 

[gab]

Good find Englander.  I have an Ashley peep mounted on my 356 Big Bore.  It fits perfectly in the holes on top of the receiver, straddling the bolt in the angle-eject.  Winchester had not put a finer finish on a production lever action for a long time till this one came out.  However, you will find the sharp checkering on the forearm to be rather unpleasant when shooting full-house 220 grain loads.  Sort of like running your hand over a wood rapse!  Great rifle.

 

[Muleskinner]

Gab,
I know what you mean about the finish work.  Winchester went through a period when they were doing a much better job on the wood-to-metal fit on these 94s.  The good fit jobs were always accompanied by that sharpe checkering.  Maybe that's the XTR (as in extra nice).  I noticed the 7-30 waters and the 307 Winchesters also had better fit/finish than the standard 30/30s.