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I just got done reading Marshall`s Technical Guide and trying to slug my cylinders (Ruger SBH .44) no luck. I tried this before with no luck so I waited untill I got the technical guide still no go.I`m trying to use Water Gremlin Egg Sinkers size 8 their hard as a rock. So today I went to five tackle shops on the Salmon River they all had the Water Gremlin brand. I can get the sinker started in the cylinder but once it gets to chamber it stops. I cann`t get it to pass though, I`ve had better luck driving fence post in rocky ground. All it does is turn my wooden dowel in to spilters. Am I missing something,I checked with the technical guide. This may sound crazy could I anneal the sinkers to make them softer? Any input will be greatfull, Thanks
         Hippie
 

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Hippie,
I tried Water Gremlin sinkers as well for my 1894P and they were pretty tough to get down the bore.  I used 1/2 oz size with lots of WD-40 and as Marshall put it in his tech guide a BIG HAMMER (5 lb sledgehammer).  Would be interested to hear from others if there is a softer brand sinker out there.
Thanks,
Jeff
 

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Well fella's, I searched hi and low for a brand other than SouthBend in my neck of the woods.  These things are hard enough to use as bullets as is. I had the same problems you had with the brand your using. Finally at K-Mart I found the Eagle Claw brand. These breeze right through.

I believe those hard oval sinkers, if you do get them through, will give you a false reading on the measurements your taking. Jeff, you may want to find a softer brand and slug your Marlin again.

Good Luck
 

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Gentlemen!

You are right about the hard oval egg sinkers giving false readings.

Walter Gremlin and South Bend brand oval egg sinkers are both VERY hard, in the neighborhood of BHN 14-16!  Other brands are available though that are nearly pure lead.

These sinkers come in small ziplock bags, and when you are at the store, simply open the bag, and give the sinkers a thumbnail test.   If you can easily dig your fingernails into the sinker, they well work slick as can be for slugging barrels and cylinder throats.

If the sinkers are too hard for the thumbnail, then leave them in the store, and find another brand.

Would it help you folks out there if we carried the soft sinkers for slugging for your convenience?

Let us know!

God Bless,

Marshall
 
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Discussion Starter #5
You Bet!! That would help me out. Going to try the Eagle brand as MT Callahan
suggested. By the Marshall how`s the hat fit?  Hippie
 
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Well I found some Eagle Claw egg sinkers at K-Mart they seam softer than the Water Gremlins. I slugged the cylinders today,the results are confussing.
Cylinder #1-.4312  #2-.4335  #3-.4334  #4-.4308  #5-.4315  #6-.4323 The confussing part is that I can push a .431dia. cast bullet through the cylinders with moderate finger pressure. Except cylinder#6 it slips though without much pressure.But some of the other cylinders I have to tap them through.Does that make any sence, no! Are the Eagle Claw sinkers springing back and giving a fase reading? By the way when I did slugged the cylinders It took some effort to drive the sinkers through. Sorry to be a bother but I`m confussed.  God Bless and keep our leaders in prayers
 

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Hippie,

Not to fear, its just mass produced logic. You would think all the throats would match but it just doesn't work that way. I don't think the Eagle Claw sinkers will spring back. They're dead soft and have a generous hole through the center. They don't just slide through when you're slugging. With a healthy dose of WD-40 and a few wacks of the hammer they go through OK. I did see a difference when you make certain the sinker is centered in the hole before its hammer time. This seemed to make the job go smoother.

I picked up my Bisley Vaquero just before Christmas and none of the throats were over .432.  All you need to worry about is honing out the throats to have all six match in size. That looks like .4335. Did you slug the bore as well? I'm curious what that came out to.
 
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M T Callahan: No I haven`t slugged the bore yet. With the difficult time I`m having with the cylinders I haven`t gotten the guts to try the bore. I`m trying to locate a brass rod for further experiments. It`s difficult living  near a one horse town to obtain certain gun paraphernalia.  Blessings & Peace  Hippie
 

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I didn't use sinkers to check the size of my cylinder throats. I went scrounging at the shooting range and talked a couple of my black powder buddies out of s handful of their dead soft round balls. They would drop down the chamber but not pass through the forcing cone. Removed the cylinder from the frame, rested the cylinder on a vice with padding and drove the ball through with a dowel. I scratched a number on it and moved to the next cylinder and repeated, until finished.
This worked for the 45s and the 44s.
The 357s I used bumped up commercially swaged 358 slugs.
Jim
 

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To Marshall Stanton;
I ended up getting my sinkers from Walmart.  They were harder than I liked but I used them anyway.  As I read this thread I noticed the comments about the hard lead springing back.  In the cases of springing back, does the size increase, and if so is there an average amount of springback?
I still have my measurements but it is all packed away now because we are moving.
 

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Like the man said..try ML roundballs..The sinker companies are using what ever scrap they can buy cheap nowdays. I think the days of good purd lead sinkers are about over. Most Walmarts and Kmarts now carry ML balls. If not go to Hornady's page and buy some off the web. The rb's used in ,50 cal are the most popular, The .45 cal balls run .440" and work good for .41's and .44's. The .50 cal balls run .490" or .495" and are great for .45's. If you can find the .457" rb for the Ruger Old Army they are even better for the .45's. I use BreakFree CLP and have no trouble. I've seen no spring back. also try those .440" in your .44 Mags with a 45 Wonder Wad and 4 grs of Unique. You have to use Kentucky windage but they are fun. Also 25 grs Pyro "P" with a Wonder Wad. In the .45's try the .454" balls, Wonder Wad and 4 grs of Unique.
Best Regards, James  
 

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Yes indeed they do spring back, but not nearly so much as you might think, in that the longitudinal hole through the sinker allows for a place for the displaced lead to migrate during the obturation necessary to slug both cylinder throats and bores.

For an average, using #8 Oval Egg sinkers with the harder alloys, you can expect a full .0005" spring-back residual memory to the sinkers!

Hope this helps, and we're looking for a wholesale source for soft oval egg sinkers for you folks!

Thanks for the updates and the continued flow of information!

Bless you folks!

Marshall
 

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Hi Guys, new at this so bear with me. Got some egg sinkers, soft, Eagle Claw. Problem is, how do I get them thru the cylinders? I start them with a hammer but as I pound, they mushroom out at the top pretty bad. Is this normal? Do you keep pounding them and drive the excess off as you push thru with a brass rod?. Slugging a 44 Mag Ruger Bisley. Also tried starting with a 38 Cal brass case, it just buried itself in the lead and made a bigger mess. HELP
Phil
 

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Phil,

You are right on track. Just keep driving the sinker through and make a lead doughnut out of the leftover sinker that doesn't pass into the cylinder. You get the same results on the bore as well.
 

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MT, thanks. will get at it first thing tommorow. Sent for Marshall's book tonight. Also Brownells catalog. I run a precision metal stamping company and have access to a complete tool room with 13 skilled tool and die makers, can get alot of the work I need done there. Assuming, I can figure what needs to be done? I will be looking for advise on a regular basis. From what I have seen so far Help is only a posting away. thanks again everyone.
Phil
 

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Phil,

You lucky dog. 13 tool and die men at your disposal, we should all be so well off. A good friend of mine is a tool and die man and could be the finest gunsmith I ever met. Of course he's 2500 miles away from me now.

You'll find Marshall's book a great tool to help you find the full potential of your gun when using cast bullets. Its a fantastic piece of work. Much like the man who wrote it.

Glad to have you with us Phil
 
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Well, I think I have some idea of whats going on now. (I hope) I slugged my cylinders again with the Eagle Claw sinkers. This time I had a co-worker make me up a brass dowel the correct size. I don`t know if it was me or the difference in the wood or brass rod but,I obtained  different readings. So I did it again the same thing. The readings came out alot smaller than the first time I posted my results.
Cylinder #1-.4317
        #2-.4315
        #3-.4321
        #4-.4317
        #5-.4315
        #6-.4317
The bore is .4291
I had to open a couple of the cylinders up. (wouldn`t you know the largest cylinder was one of the ones that I operated on)
Now I waiting for Marshall`s lapping bullets amd compound to arive. I hope I don`t get myself too confussed with the lapping process. You`ll be the frist to know!!  Thanks Again for all the Help.
God Bless  Hippie
 

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Marshall, just finished slugging my cylinders and as best as I can measure them they all seem to be between .4316 and .432. I havent got the bore done yet, I am in the process of making up a set of polypro "V" blocks for the vice so I can hold the barrel. How much should I, or Should I, open the chambers? Is .432 enough or should I go to .433? I took a few of the egg sinkers and put a drywall screw through them then chucked them in the drill and filed them down some, It made the slugging go a lot smoother.

P.S. Sent the reloading Catalogs out last week, you should get them soon. I also recieved your book. Great job.
Thanks,
Phil Uruburu
 

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Phil,

Based on your measurements, simply uniform all the cylinder throats to .432" diameter.   Don't open them up past that point, or perhaps jacketed accuracy will suffer.   You'll find an excellent performer with that revolver once all cylinder throats are uniform and the barrel constriction lapped out!

Many thanks for forwarding the loading manuals... haven't seen them yet, but will report when I do!

Have a great week!

God bless,

Marshall
 
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