[Walt45]

We have all heard what I'm going to call "ballistic myths". Their the old gun store folk wisdom passed down from generation to generation. One that I heard just recently was somewhat of a stretch; "Being shot by a 12ga with buckshot is like being shot by a 9mm nine times!".

Now lets look at that statement. A 9mm fires a single projectile (115gr) at 1300 fps. A 12ga fires nine 53 gr pellets at 1325 fps. What people forget is that the 12ga divvy's up that energy into the nine pellets while the 9mm applies it all one powerful hit. Its not a stupid concept, just not entirely correct.

So whats the craziest ballistic myth you've heard?

 

[Coffinhauler]

That 30-30 is entirely inadequate for whitetail.... what you need is this right here (holding a very nice Savage in 338 Lap)!

 

[TMan]

That 30-30 is entirely inadequate for whitetail....

That's a good one.

Along with the .243, and apparently the .30-06 is inadequate for elk, etc.

I suspect most "myths" are the product of inexperience, or no experience, perpetuated to cover poor shooting or inappropriate application.

Nah, couldn't be.

 

[Davers]

My Brother refuses to use a .410 shotgun to hunt Squirrels. He says the .410 is under powered and the Squirrel hides are too tough for it. I probably have taken more Squirrels with my .410 S/S loaded with #5 shot, then I have with any other gauge.

 

[broom_jm]

"Heavy, slow bullets will shoot right through brush."

"This cartridge shoots laser-flat to 400 yards."

"Any critter hit with a bullet from this cartridge will drop in its tracks every time."

 

[HarryS]

Some bullets "go to sleep"; they shoot large inch groups at 100 yards, then the bullet "wakes up" at about 150 yards and the 200 yard group is smaller in inches than the 100 yard group. See this a lot on the net and even in some gun mags. Stupidity just keeps repeating this impossible myth!

 

[broom_jm]

Some bullets "go to sleep"; they shoot large inch groups at 100 yards, then the bullet "wakes up" at about 150 yards and the 200 yard group is smaller in inches than the 100 yard group. See this a lot on the net and even in some gun mags. Stupidity just keeps repeating this impossible myth!

Hmm, uh, well...

 

[chevwilliam]

Then there is the "Full Metal Jacketed Bullets of Small Diameter and High Velocity are more "Humane" in War than Those of larger diameter, slower speed and of Soft unclad nose".

Regards,
Chev. william

 

[Irv S]

We have all heard what I'm going to call "ballistic myths". Their the old gun store folk wisdom passed down from generation to generation. One that I heard just recently was somewhat of a stretch; "Being shot by a 12ga with buckshot is like being shot by a 9mm nine times!".

Now lets look at that statement. A 9mm fires a single projectile (115gr) at 1300 fps. A 12ga fires nine 53 gr pellets at 1325 fps. What people forget is that the 12ga divvy's up that energy into the nine pellets while the 9mm applies it all one powerful hit. Its not a stupid concept, just not entirely correct.

So whats the craziest ballistic myth you've heard?

Just the math is wrong 9 pellets at 53 grains each is 477 grains of lead total hitting at about the same velocity, so about 4 times as much as a 9mm. So although not entirely correct, the superiority of the 12 gauge up close is correct.

 

[Irv S]

My Brother refuses to use a .410 shotgun to hunt Squirrels. He says the .410 is under powered and the Squirrel hides are too tough for it. I probably have taken more Squirrels with my .410 S/S loaded with #5 shot, then I have with any other gauge.

Probably used too small shot. Back when I shot squirrel with a shotgun, I'd often find shot just beneath the tough hide if I used 7 1/2s. With larger shot size (6+) the .410 is fine with a choke tight enough to give a dense enough pattern at the distance of the shots. The individual pellets have the same penetration for the same shot size and velocity. The only advantage of a larger gauge was to get more pellets into the pattern as a squirrel is fairly small and can be missed by the pellets even when within the pattern if the pattern is not sufficiently dense.

 

[Irv S]

"Heavy, slow bullets will shoot right through brush."

This is one my late hunting buddy, a university professor in engineering, would argue is correct - if the bullet is big enough. He'd argue that a 9" naval gun would indeed shoot through brush. It would also probably drop any critter in it's tracks.

 

[Walt45]

Just the math is wrong 9 pellets at 53 grains each is 477 grains of lead total hitting at about the same velocity, so about 4 times as much as a 9mm. So although not entirely correct, the superiority of the 12 gauge up close is correct.

Anybody know the flbs of a single 00 pellet of 12ga buckshot?

 

[okie44]

Anybody know the flbs of a single 00 pellet of 12ga buckshot?

206 ft.lbs.

 

[F2G1D]

The 'wasted energy myth'. Tissue destruction is not directly related to kinetic energy.

 

[wakwalk]

Almost all terminal Ballistics theories developed over the years

 

[Dollar Bill]

The 'wasted energy myth'. Tissue destruction is not directly related to kinetic energy.

That's an interesting one, but not necessarily completely ridiculous.

The "wasted energy" is that not directly transferred to the target. Without getting in to the whole temp/permanent wound channel and tissue destruction, IME, wild game is best dropped fastest with a good exit wound for rapid bleed-out. But then I have never seen a wild animal go into shock like a human being will.

I have witnessed people being shot with 5.56 rounds that a 150 # deer would run off from and possibly die 500 yds away. The people generally collapsed on the spot.

I do know that in 2011 (I believe) a study was conducted on the effects of high velocity gunshot wounds resulting in deaths. Damage to lungs, abdomen, central nervous system, nowhere near the bullet wounds, were clearly documented.

The problem I have with it is that the effects of a hydrostatic shock wave are unpredictable, or I should say, very dependent on shot placement. While I would take a well placed small caliber shot over poor placement of a large caliber, I prefer to stack the odds in my favor and shoot loads I know will deliver 100% penetration.

Sorry for the long-winded post.

The only completely ridiculous ballistics story is already mentioned, the "flat" shooting round. Especially with the advent of the new "magnum" rounds, I have heard multiple people (who all recently bought one of these new wonder rounds) tell me the bullet has zero drop out to (fill in the blank) yards.

 

[unclenick]

The deer example is one of the reasons the myths are easily created. What applies to one target does not necessarily apply to the next.

Also, what are you starting with? Take a 155 mm Howitzer for example: If you are pierced by one, it will carry the vast majority of its energy out the back side of you, but you will be stopped faster than by a tumbling 5.56 that never breaks through, depositing all its energy.

I feel a write-up coming on.

 

[Mainspring]

The size (huge) of a shotgun pattern at close range.

 

[Dollar Bill]

What applies to one target does not necessarily apply to the next..

I thought I was clear on that point when I said "I have witnessed people being shot with 5.56 rounds that a 150 # deer would run off from and possibly die 500 yds away.

While deer was the example I chose, it is also applicable, IME, to most wild game to include moose, elk, caribou, coyote, hogs.....

But then the rules of war and those of fair chase and the humane harvesting of game are, by their very nature, an "apples and oranges" argument. I have not read any studies concerning this issue with respect to terminal ballistics on game although I would venture a guess that the subject has been broached.

...you will be stopped faster than by a tumbling 5.56 that never breaks through, depositing all its energy.

That's a thing of the past when M16 barrels had 1:14 a twist. Stabilization was minimal, at best, and lead to in-flight tumbling under certain atmospheric conditions. Modern 1:7 twist barrels provide much better stabilization. You still have the terminal ballistic effects that cause a change in the center of pressure forward, causing the base to yaw but this rarely causes a full-blown tumbling as the depth of penetration-to-exit through a typical body is insufficient to lead to complete tumbling. Current, typical M855/SS109 ammo will completely penetrate and still produce a significant exit wound. This is confirmed by forensic examinations during current operations.

The point of my post was a response to F2G1D's post. I do not believe this area of discussion is by any means a "Ridiculous Ballistic Myth".

I feel a write-up coming on.

That would be most welcome, sir. Your thoughts and experience have always been very insightful.

Best Regards,

 

[unclepaddy]

The size (huge) of a shotgun pattern at close range.

Yeah, even people who have done enough shot gunning to know better frequently expound on how a shotgun loaded with _______________(fill in the blank), "will take out a whole wall if fired across your living room" etc. It's not only ridiculous it serves to put off many would-be shotgun owners who are no doubt terrified of unleashing such a charge inside the home.