[BKeith]

First let me say I've been shooting long guns for over 50 years, and I'm an above average shot with any kind of long gun. I've never been a handgun man, even though I always qualifed expert with them in the military, I basically know very little about them. I've got a small fortune tied up in rifles and shot guns, but only own two pistols, a Ruger Super Blackhawk 44 mag I bought when they first came out back in the 60's and a Ruger Mark III 22 target pistol I bought my granddaughter last year to learn on. I've got someone else teaching her, not me.

I've never carried a pistol for the simple fact, I'm just mean enough that if I were to pull it on someone, I would not bat an eye about blowing their brains out and I'm big enough ( and bad enough) that I've never felt there was a situation or person I could not get myself out of. Well, now I'm 64 years old and old age has taken a lot of that "bad ***" out of me and I had a situation a couple of weeks ago that put me, my wife and grandaughter in jeopardy and I left wishing I'd had a gun. That ain't gonna happen again.

Right now I'm thinking of something like a Glock Model 20, 10mm. I'm fairly large, 6'1", weight 215 pounds, still somewhat muscular built and have very large hands (I wear a size 15 ring) so it's going to take a full size grip. I also want something with punch. Not as much as my old 44 mag, but thinking I want a little more ump than a 45.

I'm not set on Glock, I just know they are suppose to be a good shooting, quality pistol. I would like to keep it less than $1,000 and I've found the Model 20, 10mm for as little as $500.

I think I prefer a semi over a revolver because of the compactness and not having to cock it every time for the next "accurate" shot. I know people can shoot a revolver by just pulling the trigger and shoot little groups, I'm to old to want to put in that much practice. I've been working with granddaughters Mark III and getting where a can get shots off pretty quick with it and still be somewhat accurate. Her's is the one with the 1911 style frame so not sure if the transition to a different angle will affect me much.

 

[jmortimer]

I think the Glock 10mm would be a fantastic choice. BTW we just had a thread here on the 10mm for CCW and some felt it was too powerful and could expose one to legal jepordy. I disagree. There is the .45 GAP or .357 Sig but your first choice would be my choice based on what you describe.

 

[MikeG]

With big hands the double-stack magazine autos shouldn't be a problem. I'd suggest finding a range that will rent a couple of different types and see what suits you best.

Good luck with your search.

 

[Tactical Alex]

Mike pretty much nailed it, the best thing to do is try to find a place where you can practice with a few different models. Don't worry too much about the caliber at this point. Most handgun models out there will come in different calibers all their own. If you're just looking for a effective pistol I'd again agree with Mike. You're large enough a double stack would probably work really well, but if you're trying to conceal the gun double stacks have a thicker frame making concealing a little more difficult. Not impossible by any means you just have to think more. If you're old military I'd start with a 1911 which might feel familiar to you but I tend to lean more towards a striker fire for carry. Glock, S&W M&P, Springfield XD are all some good examples in there. Bottom line there's always ways to customize the grip so focus on the gun style that feels the most natural for you to hold. Then decide your caliber, and adjust the grips to your hand.

Be forewarned. Your long gun experience might trick your eyes when your shooting a pistol into thinking "the sights are off." Remember that with a pistol you usually have a trigger pull that weighs as much, if not more, as the pistol itself. So you really have to make sure you don't pull the shot.

Wish you the best.

 

[BKeith]

Oh, how well I know about pulling shots with a pistol. Several times I've been tempted to work on easing off the trigger pull because I constantly throw shots because of the harder squeeze. Don't worry, I know better than do that, I will learn and get it down. I'm only on my fifth box of those 525 round boxes so I've got a ways to go yet.

Using sights has been a big learning curve also. With rifles and shotguns, I rarely use sights, (this does not include scopes) I've shot on instinct all my life. The guy that taught me how when I was a kid, handed me a Daisy BB gun with no sights and told me to hit a ping pong ball hanging from a swing. When I finally hit it, I didn't get to stop it, I had to keep shooting it while it was swinging all over the place. After a few years of that, on my 12th birthday, I got a 22 and the first thing he did was take the sights off it.

Now, I'm so used to concentrating on the target and not as much on the gun, I find myself keep wanting to point shot the pistol and that ain't working.

There is an indoor pistol range about 30 miles from the house but they don't have rentals or loaners. They do have a few models you can try before you buy but that's only for a few shots. They only had a limited selection of those and the only full size fram they had was a 9mm Glock. I would probably have to drive the 90 miles or so to Atlanta to get to a range that had something like that.

 

[Bucolic Buffalo]

BKieth, My advise is get a .357 mag double action revolver since you have so little experiance with a handgun. It is a lot easier to learn to shoot handgins with a revolver. With a semiauto you have to remember if the magazine loaded in the pistol, is the safety off, is my wrist locked (yes you have to lock your wrist or you will get a jam), etc., etc., etc. that amounts to a lot to remember when you have to use a gun in a combat situation especially at night when you've been woken up in the middle of the night by a scumbag vreaking into your house. With a revolver all you have to do is aim, pull the trigger and BANG!!! When you get more experince you can go get that semiauto.

Oh and you will have to practice a good bit whether you get a semiauto or a revolver. so save some money for range time and ammo.

 

[jbee]

One thing I did not consider when buying my CCW was how easy was it to add a night option such as a laser or glowing sight to it. Ones built into the slide, guide, rail, or grips that automatically come on with the safety off are probably the best.

> I also want something with punch.

.50 Desert Eagle?

My hands are too small and they don't rent them at the range, so, I can't give hands on experience. BUT, a lot of the big guys (including ex-military such as yourself) seem to really like this gun and the 6" would probably be concealable on you.

They come in .44 mag too in case you wanted to keep the ammo choices simple since you already own a .44 mag revolver.

 

[swampdoc]

Choosing an autopistol

Although I like the 10mm a lot better than anything else myself, still; its a very powerful handgun cartridge that can be a bit bit "much" for some shooters. I'm considering obtaining one of the new Keltech PMR 30's which holds 30 shots of 22 Winchester Magnum as my new trail gun. It should be fine for anything smaller than a bear

 

[Roadking Rider]

Ex Military I'd say 45 caliber 1911. If a 45 can't get it done it's probably not worth getting involved in the first place.

 

[ironhead7544]

The G20 is a good choice if you can handle the recoil. You might want to go with the compact version for carry. With the right ammo the G20 makes a good hunting/trail gun also.

 

[BKeith]

Not interested in hunting or anything other than personal defense with it. If it doesn't bother me to shoot my Super Blackhawk with heavy loads, I don't think a gas operated 40 cal is going to be a challange. This will be for me, not my wife. The only pistols I shot in the military was a 9mm Semi, don't remember the make. I was in a special training unit and we had to transport a number of M60's, MK19's and bunch of M16's to and from the field. Because of the M60's and MK19's, two people had to have live side arms, I was always one of those two, so other than maintaining qualification, that was the extent of my military pistol shooting. I've probably put a hundred rounds through the Blackhawk (which I put a pistol scope on so I could hit with it) and a couple of thousand through the MKIII.

A revolver is not in the picture. I know they are great for beginners, especially in a hostile invorinment because all you have to do is pull the trigger, and don't have to think about the safefy and chambering a round. Just from the few months practicing with the MKIII, that's all second nature already. Me and my granddaughter play this drill of setting it on the table, clip out, empty chamber, safety on and see who can pick it up and bust a clay target at 25 yards the quickest. She's beating my right now but I'm catching up pretty quick.

I a firm believer in it takes three things to make a good shot. Practice, Practice, and more Practice. I have no plans on being as good with a pistol as I am with the long guns, for one, I don't have another 50+ years to practice, but I will be fairly competent.

 

[mikld]

You seem to already made up your mind for a semi-auto in 10mm, and from your replies everything else is out of the question. You're getting an awful lot of practice with the .22, why don't you put as much effort into a .45 ACP or even as mentioned earlier a good revolver (double action accurate shooting isn't all that hard to master)? My favorite gun for this catagory is my Ruger P90, 45 ACP. Double Action first shot, 8 round mag (I have extras handy), super reliable (no malfunctions in about 1500 rounds factory and handloads) and accurate (I can get 3" groups at 50 ft. two handed, butmost of the time they're 4"). So try rental guns at a range, rent and shoot every 10mm available and find the one suited to your wants...

 

[BKeith]

I'm set on it being a semi and not a revolver, that's all. I just stopped by this local range to be sure and they don't have loaners, unless you take their shooting course, then they will furnish you a 9mm.
I will ask around at the gun range I shot at, maybe someone there will let me try a couple.

You have just brought out another bit of may ignorance of handguns. What is a double action semi. I thought you were talking about a revolver of some sort when you mentioned a double action P90, until I did a web search on it and saw it was a semi?

 

[Sunwheel29]

Hey BK,
I am in a similar boat....

I am a little under 6 feet and over 270. Most of my life I have been very athletic and healthy but now crippling arthritis has me on a cane and I am having to deal with the fact that I may get my butt whooped thinking I am still the man I used to be when I am not. If I could get my hands on about anybody, I can still take 'em down, but I wouldn't be able to get back up, LOL...

I usually carry a five shot .357 snubby for self defense as it is easy to tote. Just put it in your pocket and forget about it till needed. Sometimes I carry a .45 derringer though.

Years ago, when I was more able bodied I carried a5 inch 1911. For the longest time, I actually packed a Ruger Super Blackhawk in .44 magnum with the short 4/58 inch barrell as my self defense gun.
For one thing, it had plenty of power. For the other, it was phenomenally accurate. I wore it in an IWB rig I bought for a HK USP that I did not like near as much. Another advantage to the Ruger .44 was that it was heavy enough to bludgeon somebody with it.
I never did take to the tactical tupperware.

If I was gonna tote a 10mm, I would be looking at the EAA Witness Pistol, which is basically a CX-75 on a bit bigger frame. In fact, its as close to the old Bren Ten as you can currently get factory wise.
The Witness is a VERY popular gun outside the USA with serious pistoleros who shoot in combat matches. You might say its the 1911 of the rest of the world.

I am not keen on Glocks for several reasons. They generally feel awful in the hand. They have horrid, mushy triggers that make them difficult to hit anything further than a poker table distance. I am not keen on the Half Cocked and Unlocked Firing mechanism of the Glock either. They are not the safest of guns for that very reason. Untold Accidental Discharges go hand in hand with Glocks half cocked and unlocked "safe action."

The Witness or CZ on the other hand has about a 12 pound double action pull similar to a DA revolver. The first shot cocks the hammer and the rest of the shots are single action, around 4 or so pounds. Or, you can carry the gun cocked and locked by using the thumb safety that locks the sear in place.
Jeff Cooper was big on the CZ and he based the Bren 10 on it. I think he would have liked it. Another option is the CZB97, I think it is called, which is a .45 caliber CZ made by the CZ people.
The only downside to these two guns is that they have steel frames and are a lot heavier than the Glock.
I would love to see the FNX or USP pistols available in 10mm...They are too big and chunky through the slide to make good .45s, but would be the bee's knees in 10mm...
Alternately S&W also makes a 10 mm revolver the 610, and you might find a used 10006 auto pistol.
I like 1911s, hi powers, CZs and Berettas, but at heart I am a Revolver man. Probaby the best plain ole real world self defense gun would be a .44 bulldog or the snub five shot Taurus revolvers in .41 or .44 magnum.
In real world self defense if you pack enough gun caliber wise and aim at what you shoot at, you are not gonna need to fire 8 rounds and reload. That is mostly hollywood nonsense.

 

[magnumitis]

Hey, fellers!!

Grab a Glock 10mm with confidence!!

My constant companion for the last 10 years has been a G29, compact 10mm. It is incredibly accurate and powerful. It is not at all hard to control.....even with stout loads. I am 6'2' 215 lbs. and have an XL hand. I have no complaints as to how the G29 fits in my hand.

IMHO, the 10mm is what the .45 ACP wishes it was. And there's no better CCW package to put it in than the G29.

 

[Sunwheel29]

I think I prefer a semi over a revolver because of the compactness and not having to cock it every time for the next "accurate" shot. I know people can shoot a revolver by just pulling the trigger and shoot little groups, I'm to old to want to put in that much practice. h.

Don't be fooled by the tyros of the gunny fraternity into thinking it's hard to shoot accurately with a DA wheelgun. It's not.

If you understand the concept, it takes all ofa half an hour with an empty gun to master "Indexing" style shooting.
Take an empty S&W, Ruger or Taurus that is in time and put it in your hand so that the joint of the trigger finger is on the trigger face. Pull the action slowly and you will notice that as the hammer comes back you can see and hear the bolt locking the cylinder in place. As you continue to pull the trigger to the rear the last quarter inch or so is the hammer face sliding past the sear to drop the hammer.

DO it a couple of times to get used to it. In no time at all, you can detect it by sound and feel alike. Now, point the gun at a proper back stop and do it several times.
Basicall you pull the trigger long enough and the cylinder locks in place. Then its just a small adjustment to pull it the rest of the way through with less spring pressure, almost like firing a cocked gun.
Now, start the exercise over but pull the trigger faster at the first part of the arc so that the cylinder rolls to the locking point. At that point the gun is cocked and all you have to do is pull through the sear to fire it.
Once again, pount the (empty) gun at the wall and practice the two stage trigger pull. In about ten strokes you will have it down pat.

Do this exercise again next time you go to the range, then try shooting live rounds through the gun at a target using this two stage pull, which old time Bullseye shooters called the index method (the trigger finger indexed the cylinder to the locking bolt, I reckon).
This is why so many hardcore revolver shooters often had the hammer ground off their revolvers. Once you master indexing, you don't need to cock the gun because your finger does it.
Ironically, I have yet to see a single description of this method in any old book I have read about shooting, albeit Massad Ayoob described it well in a recent article. He used to shoot bullseye too and I bet an old timer taught him just like one taught me.
Most books on bullseye recommend pulling the trigger with your finger tip or pad on the trigger which is too hard. I think the old timers used that misinoformation to keep young guys from beating them at big money matches.
Once you have mastered indexing (like I said, it takes about a half an hour) you can shoot a proper wheelgun DA more accurately than you can a cocked automatic as the revolver's hammer, sear interface is smoother generally than an autoloader.
This method does not work with modern Colt DAs however. The Colts are designed so that when the cylinder bolt locks the hammer falls at the same time.

 

[gunchamp]

If you are interested in a glock model 20, I ahve one that has only one clip through it. It is in excellent condition and would be willing to part ways with it. If you are interested, shoot me a pm. Thanks.

 

[swampdoc]

Heritage 22 Revolver

After my 30 year old Ruger Single Six was stollen, I tried out a Heritage which only cost $200, and I can pick the tops off of bottles at fifty yards just like I could with my Ruger. I recently parted with a Ruger Mark I which had had 300,000 rounds put through it, so I highly reccommend them. My old Colt Woodsman is still very accurate too! Pawn Shops can be a good place to find Older but Good used guns

 

[Sinbad12-2007]

Sunwheel29 ........... I'm right there with you. I'm 64 now, crippled up with Rheumatoid Arthritis. My hands don't look nor work like a normal's hands. I can no longer cock a single action revolver. So, I carry an old J-frame Smith in .38 Special. And a cane. I've learned the defensive capabilities of the cane. I'm only 5'9" and 200#. A "fireplug", if you will. My hands no longer can take the recoil of the large caliber autos. The 1911 is my first love. So, I dance with the girl I brung.

 

[BKeith]

Gunchamp. I have one problem with buying over the internet, unless you have a way of protecting both ends of the deal, I don't. I'm not comfortable with sending someone I don't know hundreds of dollars and hope they send me a pistol, and I'm sure you're not sending me a several hundred dollar pistol and hope I send you the money.

OK, I just left the indoor pistol range, I shot 50 rounds through a Glock 21 45ACP. Their max distance was 50'. Shooting at the center of a man size silhoutte, my first five shots were a little high and right of the center chest oval. I compensated for that a put the next 35 all in the center of the smallest chest oval. The last 10 shots I put in the center of the head. The guys gun I was using says his Glock 20 probably has about 10 - 15% more recoil than the 21 so I don't think the recoil is a problem. The 45 actually had less recoil than I was expectiong.

My biggest complaint about the Glock was after shooting 50 rounds, I almost had a blister on my finger where that safety trigger or trigger was pinching against the trigger guard. He said the Glock has the larget trigger guard of the lot so I will have to figure out something to do about that.