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I was at the state gameland public shooting range today scrounging for brass. Keep in mind that on Sundays, the rifle range opens at 12:00 noon. It was about 10:30 A.M. and three fellows set up their gear on shooting benches. I was picking brass out of the trash barrels when the guys started shooting. I immediately walked down to them and advised them of the starting time. In addition, I pointed out that a Deputy Warden lived nearby and might respond and would likely write them up for a fine and/or possible loss of firearm. My advice was to pack up and make tracks. They acted like I was intruding so I backed away.

About ten minutes later a fellow approached me at the trash barrel and asked if I had done any shooting. I told him I did not have a firearm with me and was simply dumpster diving. I asked if he was the Deputy Warden and he said he was. He then dealt with the three early shooters. I saw him with a fistful of drivers licenses and saw him writing field receipts.

I usually warn folks about the dangers of early shooting and get mixed responses. I believe I will keep quiet from now on. All the best...
Gil
 

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Gil, you did your friendly best. THEY made the bad decisions and then chose to ignore civil advice.

As they used to say when I was a snot-nosed twerp, "Tough cheese."
 

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What Law Broken ??

Would be interested in knowing what law the early shooters broke. This,of course added to the law of stupidity and/or common sense.

Can't see/understand anything criminal about shooting at a designated shooting range unless some kind of law against noise abatement during certain hours. ----pruhdlr
 

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State ranges have their own regulations that are enforced by the PA Game Commission code. They have all kinds of rules, in addition to shooting hours, they limit how many rounds can be put in your firearm, usually it's three, except on certain pistol ranges you can load 6, and use of paper targets only, to name a few. A few knuckleheads made many of the rules necessiary by shooting up the place with their Tec 9's, AR's and AK's. Plus leaving trash all over, and stupidist of all, by setting tin cans as targets on top of the backstops. There are many rural churches out there, so I believe that's the main reason for the delayed opening time on Sunday. My closest state range is at Elverson, PA, and I will not shoot there, as you take your own life in your hands. People load and handle their guns while others are down range and think nothing of it. While others pay no attention of where the muzzles of their guns are pointed. If you would say anything, they will tell you where to go! Mr. Martin, you did your good deed. Too bad these men weren't receptive to it.
 

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State ranges have their own regulations that are enforced by the PA Game Commission code. They have all kinds of rules, in addition to shooting hours, they limit how many rounds can be put in your firearm, usually it's three, except on certain pistol ranges you can load 6, and use of paper targets only, to name a few. A few knuckleheads made many of the rules necessiary by shooting up the place with their Tec 9's, AR's and AK's. Plus leaving trash all over, and stupidist of all, by setting tin cans as targets on top of the backstops. There are many rural churches out there, so I believe that's the main reason for the delayed opening time on Sunday. My closest state range is at Elverson, PA, and I will not shoot there, as you take your own life in your hands. People load and handle their guns while others are down range and think nothing of it. While others pay no attention of where the muzzles of their guns are pointed. If you would say anything, they will tell you where to go! Mr. Martin, you did your good deed. Too bad these men weren't receptive to it.


GOODNESS!! While I may not like the ammo limitation on the range, or some of the other rules, I can see why these rules are in place. I have been to several dozen different ranges here in Ohio, and I have witnessed none of the stupidity that you have seen. I would definately have some choice words for someone loading/handling their weapons while I or someone else was down-range. We do have a handfull of morons every now-and-again who start firing without checking if everyone has their "ears" on, but other than that, I have never witnessed the amount of ignorance that you have. Makes me glad to be in Ohio..........I am sure that we do experience this, but I have yet to see it, and I am at the range usualy once a week at least. Sounds to me like their are some people in PA., that need a serious lesson in common sense. Not trying to bash PA., or anyone from there, but wow, you are right when you say that to go to that particular range is taking your life in into your own hands. Good luck GBertolet, I hope you can find a range close to you that is safe to go to.............
 

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Would be interested in knowing what law the early shooters broke. This,of course added to the law of stupidity and/or common sense.

Can't see/understand anything criminal about shooting at a designated shooting range unless some kind of law against noise abatement during certain hours. ----pruhdlr

Might be like here, even the police range that I use cannot open until 12:30 P.M. on Sunday.
 

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Interesting restrictions... out here the public (still a $15 yearly fee) range is open dawn to dusk year round. The other federal public (free) range is open 24 hours a day, and the private ranges have a few various hours, but there is no state law regarding opening times. The private ranges have agreements with the neighbors who moved in after the range was built.
 

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at my sportsman club in ri we can shoot from 8am to sun down on our outdoor range. and you can shot .22's on the indoor all day but all the higher calibers have to go at 9pm because its near a small neighborhood. We've also had some morons, they shot up our wood that was at the bottom of our rubber backstop and discharged a round in our ready room.
 

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Round here we don't have any public ranges. All of the locations that have been used in recent memory for shooting have been closed due to the Lefty County councils in power. All of the forest service roads that had any open space on them to use for shooting have been gated or tank-trapped. There are only 3 or 4 private ranges left in the area and the prices have goten rediculous. 3-400 per year in membership dues. This last winter before the county closed the last legal public shooitng area in the county I was out there on a nice saturday and along with about 20 people sharred the gravel pit and never saw any agregious safety violations. everyone was very civil as far as cease fires and settng up in a way that didn't endanger anyone else. It usd to be that shooting areas got trashed and for that I can see why those areas were closed but our last place was squeekiy clean. I think people were finally getting the hint that they needed to clean up after themselves.
 

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At my club we can shoot 27/7 indoors with almost any pistol ammo (no magnum loads, but everything else is fair game) but the outdoor range is from 9:00am until sundown only. I usually head up to the range on a Sunday morning, grab breakfast at the club and get a few rounds in at 9:00, and I haven't ran into anyone shooting early yet.

And I completely understand the rules with time restrictions and ammo limits at a club. Plus, if you don't have the self control to follow those rules, are you sure you should even be shooting?
 

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Some people believe they are better than the law, so they have to face the judgement of the Law.

Jerry
 

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You're right, people often do not listen, but sometimes you have to follow your conscience and warn them anyway.

Unfortunately, this reminds me of a tragedy we had here several years ago. I lived near a cave in a county park that was open to the public. A group outing organized by the Catholic Charities came to explore the cave. Several young children and a couple of adult leaders. Some of the locals stopped them on their way in to tell them that rain was coming and that water levels would rise in the cave and be very dangerous. Sadly, the adult leaders chose to go in anyway. Out of the entire group, one child and none of the adults survived. The cave is now closed to the public.
 

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Well Gil, the shooters either already knew of the rules and didn't care, or they were unaware, but still didn't care when you informed them. They triggered the ticketing when they pulled their triggers. Did they continue shooting after your warning, before the warden showed up? Are the shooting times posted at the range?
 

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A number of ranges have been sued over noise, etc. and have had to enter into consent decrees regarding hours of operation and number of days a year the range can hold competitions. Disregarding those could get the range closed down, or perhaps pay a hefty fine.
 

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Not range related but two things I have noticed-

recently was visiting Henderson, NV-10 mi from LV, NV. It was about 1130 am and I wanted a bottle of spirits. I asked the lady if I had to wait till noon. I think she thought I already had too much--se laughed and said "this is Las Vegas." I bought the Bristol Cream

As far as trash left by shooters--some shooters are just slobs.
Just cane from a DNR range. Wooden posts are used to hold up the backstop. On the 50 yd 2 of 4 are hust about shot off/thru. Dum dah dum dum. I have pointed that out to some shooters and they kinda wonder what Im talking about "target on the post??"
 

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to many people theses days have no regards for any one but them selves. parents dont teach manors kids dont have any. as adults still dont have any.
 

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Incident reminds me of the time three young men arrived at my local range to shoot handgun. You can tell right away about their attitude towards shooting. Laughing and joking around, unconcerned about where their shots were going, just out to shoot and have a good time. It got to the point where their guns were no longer pointed downrange when I approached and reminded them that the range has safety rules about muzzles needing to be always pointed downrange. Their response was to flat out ignore me. Needless to say, I packed up my gear and moved as far away from them as possible. Someday, this attitude is going to get one of them in trouble and I would prefer not to be the injured party. You're right about some people just will not listen.
 

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Glad I don't live in PA.. When I was hauling produce to the east coast I refused to go to Philly. Boss told me I had to and I told him I was looking for a job when he hired me so I wasn't a stranger at looking for a job.

Yup I been to public ranges here in Michigan where you had to pay some thing like a $2.00 day use fee or buy a permit for $25.00 for a year. Some pukes still tried to get out of paying the fee. Some were real nice set up ranges but the slobs ruined many. The cost is higher and there is always a range master on duty or the range is closed. The private ranges cost a bunch more to shoot at and if you so much as drop a shell caseing on the ground with out picking it up the range master will escort you out and you are never going to that range again.

Me I shoot at my own range. Got tired of going to the range and it was closed per no range master. I don't have to worry about hours or any thing else now.
 

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Alley,

I am like you, I shoot on my own range, there is a range flag denoting live fire flying. My big headache is mowing the range area.

Jerry
 
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