I have a Remington 700 SPS in a 22-250 that I have put a bell and Carlson stock on. I hand load for this rifle and it shoots very well but I think it has much more potential. I have never taken a rifle to a gun smith other than to make a repair. So if I take this one in are there any suggestions to have done to it. And any idea of what it costs? Looking to ring out some more accuracy with out building a custom. I do use this for long shots on coyotes. But like to take it to the range and shoot from the bench also. Thanks for your input!
Remington 700 accurizung?
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The three biggies in accurizing are a quality stock and bedding job, hand-loaded or careful selection of ammunition and an aftermarket trigger, or one that's been lightened up a bit. What are your groups measuring at this point? If they are already sub-MOA, any additional work you have done is only going to make a very small improvement and even for 300 yard shots on coyotes, that isn't generally indicated.
It has a 26" bbl and have read that a shorter bbl can be more accurate. The trigger is the x mark pro trigger and I have been very pleased with it. Did not know if taking it to a gunsmith having him bed the action and lug maybe blueprint it and check the crown.
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I'd call that plenty acceptable unless in the local 'turkey shoots'. Maybe OK even then.
.943 at 200 yards is great. I don't think you'd see much improvement from having the gun blueprinted. If you haven't already bedded the gun you may see some improvement from doing that. It will certainly assure that the action has no pressure points and that everything meshes up properly. You may even have to change your handload a bit afterwards because it can chage the harmonics of the rifle. As for shortening the barrel I'd suggest that this is a bad idea. Benchresters use 28 and 30 inch barrels to shoot at 1000 yards for a reason. The longer barrel will not only shoot accurately it will deliver more velocity.
My suggestion is to get a reputable gun smith to bed the action and see what happens. It can't hurt and most likely your groups will shrink slightly. However, also consider that most people don't own a gun that will shoot .9" at 200 yards. It is already accurate by hunting standards.
My suggestion is to get a reputable gun smith to bed the action and see what happens. It can't hurt and most likely your groups will shrink slightly. However, also consider that most people don't own a gun that will shoot .9" at 200 yards. It is already accurate by hunting standards.
An important suggestion:
Change one thing at a time. Then if something goes wrong you know what to change back to recover any accuracy that you may have lost. Also, you will be able to accurately measure the level of improvement in each modification to determine if you want to do these things in other rifles in the future.
It's just a suggestion from many years of experience.
Accurizing a Remington action is a long and expensive process. This is not something just any gunsmith can do (and do it right). You are looking at several months to over a year to have one of the good guys do the work.
Pillar post bedding is worth it's weight in gold if done right but again, if this is your first, the chances of doing it right are very slim.
What kind of trigger pull do you have. I luv early Remington triggers, but haven't seen many of the newer ones that I didn't have to do a lot of work on or just throw in the trash in put in a Timney. I like a two pound pull, and have my granddaughters at 2 1/2. Just shooting her rifle affects my groups a little just having to deal with that extra 1/2 pound pull. She is used to the 2 1/2 pound and can't shoot mine as good because it's more sensitive than she's used to and has shots she was not really ready for. The trigger must be smooth and crisp or it will affect you're groups.
Next I would have to ask how many rounds have you put through it and did you clean the bore good with break cleaner or a solvent to get the anti-rust out. A new barrel also needs to be cleaned frequently for the first few batches of bullets. It doesn't take much to make 22 cal bullets to give you flyer's.
The next question would have to be how much reloading experience you have. Properly worked brass, the right powder/bullet combination makes a huge difference. I'm working up loads for a 22-250 Tikka Varmint I just bought and with my preped brass, Varget powder and 50gr Nosler Ballistic Tips, I'm shooting bug holes at 100yds. I've got the powder and bullet combo that works good in this rifle and now I will start working it at 400yds to get the final load I will shoot.
I know a lot of this is basic stuff and you may beyound this but this is just some of the stuff that I work on to get the most from a rifle.
Oh yea, and I forgot to mention, you will spend all this time and money to "maybe" get another 1/4" - 3/8" tighter group at 200 yds. Deburring flash hole inside it critical, you must do that. Tightly wrap 0000 steel wool around a bore brush and carefully polish the inside of the necks helps. Chamfering the necks is a must. Uniforming primer pockets helps. Neck turning helps if your brass is more than .0015" out around the neck. Only Neck resizing helps if you have a good, tight chamber.
Another major factor in shooting little bitty groups is the quality of the optics and how good the trigger puller is. 1/2 MOA groups are already good groups, you start seperating the shooters for the rest of the pack when you start getting to that point and smaller, even with a very accurate rifle.
Pillar post bedding is worth it's weight in gold if done right but again, if this is your first, the chances of doing it right are very slim.
What kind of trigger pull do you have. I luv early Remington triggers, but haven't seen many of the newer ones that I didn't have to do a lot of work on or just throw in the trash in put in a Timney. I like a two pound pull, and have my granddaughters at 2 1/2. Just shooting her rifle affects my groups a little just having to deal with that extra 1/2 pound pull. She is used to the 2 1/2 pound and can't shoot mine as good because it's more sensitive than she's used to and has shots she was not really ready for. The trigger must be smooth and crisp or it will affect you're groups.
Next I would have to ask how many rounds have you put through it and did you clean the bore good with break cleaner or a solvent to get the anti-rust out. A new barrel also needs to be cleaned frequently for the first few batches of bullets. It doesn't take much to make 22 cal bullets to give you flyer's.
The next question would have to be how much reloading experience you have. Properly worked brass, the right powder/bullet combination makes a huge difference. I'm working up loads for a 22-250 Tikka Varmint I just bought and with my preped brass, Varget powder and 50gr Nosler Ballistic Tips, I'm shooting bug holes at 100yds. I've got the powder and bullet combo that works good in this rifle and now I will start working it at 400yds to get the final load I will shoot.
I know a lot of this is basic stuff and you may beyound this but this is just some of the stuff that I work on to get the most from a rifle.
Oh yea, and I forgot to mention, you will spend all this time and money to "maybe" get another 1/4" - 3/8" tighter group at 200 yds. Deburring flash hole inside it critical, you must do that. Tightly wrap 0000 steel wool around a bore brush and carefully polish the inside of the necks helps. Chamfering the necks is a must. Uniforming primer pockets helps. Neck turning helps if your brass is more than .0015" out around the neck. Only Neck resizing helps if you have a good, tight chamber.
Another major factor in shooting little bitty groups is the quality of the optics and how good the trigger puller is. 1/2 MOA groups are already good groups, you start seperating the shooters for the rest of the pack when you start getting to that point and smaller, even with a very accurate rifle.
Sheedy,
That is already very good accuracy and any improvement you might make will be by small degrees, and at potentially great expense. Also, consider that your bullets will be running out of energy to cleanly harvest a coyote before your groups open up too much to ensure a solid hit. In other words, your gun will shoot minute-of-song-dog out to 400+ with proper hold-over, but the velocity and energy will be dropping to a point where such a shot becomes ill-advised.
I know how fun it is to tweak a shooter and turn good groups into something that makes you
. However, there is a point of diminishing returns and you're already there, with this gun. I'm not saying don't mess with it, just be prepared to invest a fair amount for very small increments of improvement from where you already are, now.With a sub one inch 200 yard group you may wont to do some work on case prep; Get 200 new cases. Run them into a full length die. Cut to to same length but as long as you can. Deburr the flash hole. Cut the primer pocket to standard depth. Deburr the neck. Then seperate the cases into groups by weight. Reject any cases that have an off center flash hole and turn the necks on the ones where the necks thickness varries. --- With a standard chamber you my or may not see an improvment in accuracy. --- It is unlikely that your rifles accuracy would be improved but on various bolt action rifles one or more of the following has made them better shooters. Glass bed the action, piller bed the action, free float the barrel, lapp the bolt locking lugs, re crown the barrel, Remove wood from under the bolt handle so it has full contact with the action, Shorten the magazine box so there is no pressure between the floor plate and action, and adjust or replace the trigger. Blue print the barreled action.
I will be having the action bedded by a gun smith for sure. And maybe have the bolt lugs lapped. It has less than 800 rds ran threw it and I spent two days and a hundred rounds breaking it in at the range. I use all Winchester brass, was using Sierra 55gr blitzkings but I have been getting better groups from nosler 55gr varminters. I would say that what I'm looking to fix is the occasional flyer. It don't happen every grouping but happens more than I like. I am a clean freak when it comes to my guns. I clean after every use. I did read here recently that can be to much of a good thing but I always thought that a clean fresh bore would shoot better than a fouled bore?
As far as case preparation all I have been doing is depriming, tumble, clean primer pocket, trim and debur the case neck, prime and collet size. I do hold about 10 thousandths from the lands and if I try and run the bullet out more it leaves less in the neck of the case. As of right now the base of the bullet is about even where the shoulder and neck transition.
You need to get something like this, http://www.midwayusa.com/viewProduct/?productNumber=729748 and debur the flash holes.
One of these helps also, http://www.midwayusa.com/viewProduct/?productNumber=338732. I screw it out of the handle and use it in a drill for initial prep. Then I put it back in the handle and use it to clean pockets for each reload.
I also use the bore brush wraped with steel wool to polish inside the necks in the drill. I do that for every reload.
I feel the VLD chamfer tool http://www.midwayusa.com/viewProduct/?productNumber=342199 is a must also. I chamfer before I use the steel wool to polish, that way it polishes the chamfer also. Bullets slide in very smoothly with no scraping of the copper jacket.
Neck turning is an iffy. I neck turn all brass I use when developing loads, but usually don't bother with it for my actual hunting loads if I know I'm probably going to be loosing the brass. I'm not real sure you see that much of a benifit, but when looking for those bug hole size groups, it's all about those little things. All those little details add up to make a difference when you are trying to make a hunting rifle shoot like a target rifle. I have seen brass that was .003" thick on one side vesus the other that did have a noticable affect on accuracy.
There are other things I do that's probably not benificial on a hunting rifle, but I'm an accuracy freak, so I do every little detail. I've also been doing this a long, long time and do just about everything but the barreled action accurizing myself, so it's not costing me bunches like it would if you had to pay someone.
One of these helps also, http://www.midwayusa.com/viewProduct/?productNumber=338732. I screw it out of the handle and use it in a drill for initial prep. Then I put it back in the handle and use it to clean pockets for each reload.
I also use the bore brush wraped with steel wool to polish inside the necks in the drill. I do that for every reload.
I feel the VLD chamfer tool http://www.midwayusa.com/viewProduct/?productNumber=342199 is a must also. I chamfer before I use the steel wool to polish, that way it polishes the chamfer also. Bullets slide in very smoothly with no scraping of the copper jacket.
Neck turning is an iffy. I neck turn all brass I use when developing loads, but usually don't bother with it for my actual hunting loads if I know I'm probably going to be loosing the brass. I'm not real sure you see that much of a benifit, but when looking for those bug hole size groups, it's all about those little things. All those little details add up to make a difference when you are trying to make a hunting rifle shoot like a target rifle. I have seen brass that was .003" thick on one side vesus the other that did have a noticable affect on accuracy.
There are other things I do that's probably not benificial on a hunting rifle, but I'm an accuracy freak, so I do every little detail. I've also been doing this a long, long time and do just about everything but the barreled action accurizing myself, so it's not costing me bunches like it would if you had to pay someone.
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