[Darin115]

I have a old Remington 700 BDL chambered in 6mm Remington. I have had it for a long time. This gun used to shoot thumbnail sized groups at 100 yards. I decided to not carry the gun anymore due to small dings that I put in the stock. It was a really old gun and was in perfect shape when I bought it off a old man that had shot it only a few times. He never even mounted a scope on it.

Anyway I got it out a year ago and shot it. The best I can do now is about 2 inches at 100 yards. I am shooting the same bullets but can't get the accuracy that I once had. I tried a different scope to no avail. I can't figure out what has changed since putting ths gun in the gun cabinet a few years ago. I also cleaned the bore well but nothing seams to help it.

I would guess that this gun has been shot less than 500 times. I can't imagine that the throat has eroded. I called Remington and gave them the serial number and they said the gun was made back in the late 60's. The also said something about the safety. The bolt will not open unless the safety is in the fire position. I am fine with it and decided not to have it changed. I know that has nothing to do with the poor shooting performance.

Any ideas??

Darin

 

[Rubberduck]

Try shooting a few different types and brands of ammo and see if that helps. Or you could try to check your stock screws. If they arent tight it can effect accuracy.

 

[broom_jm]

Darin,

My dad has a late '60s Model 700 in .243, so practically the same gun. One day, when returning from a hunt, I had climbed into the back of the van we used for weekend trips. Dad was trying to get his gun unloaded. Finally realizing that the bolt wouldn't open because the safety was on, he thumbed it forward. By this time, the muzzle was in the side doors of the truck, pointed at the floor. The gun fired when the safety came off, scaring both of us to death and costing me a percent or two of permanent hearing loss?

Send the gun to Remington and they'll fix it, for free...no point in having a gun that isn't safe if you can get it taken care of.

 

[lumberjak]

Given reasonable care, about the only change that affects old guns is the wood geometry. As the stock ages, the barrel pressure point can change. Might try the old card trick and see what happens. Hope you get it sorted out.

If the triggers has never been tampered with, it's probably ok. On old rifles, good idea to knock the pins out and soak the trigger unit in solvent. Give them all the bump test, any brand, and never fully trust any of them.

 

[broom_jm]

There is a known issue with older Model 700s...a design flaw that causes them to fire when the gun is taken off safe. This should be repaired before doing much more with the gun.

 

[zb338]

I would go with Jak. The bedding is the most likely thing to
change over the years on any gun. I have seen more than
one gun that had its stock really warp over time. If this is the
case with yours, have a good gunsmith free float the barrel
and glass bed the action. Or, a lot of the old 700s had their
barrels free floated except for just behind the tip of the stock.
There they left wood with some upward pressure.
Zeke

 

[lumberjak]

There is a known issue with older Model 700s...a design flaw that causes them to fire when the gun is taken off safe. This should be repaired before doing much more with the gun.

The design flaw started when a human said, "let's put explosives in a tube and aim it at stuff". Agree, there is a known issue with Rem. There is a known issue with other brands. There is a known issue with varnish buildup, lack of maintenance, wear and many show signs of a screwdriver or missing tamper goo. Remmy got the most press, might be fair to say that Remmy has the most "known about" issue. Don't trust any of them...ever.

 

[Shawn Crea]

Make sure your scope is still reliable. Only way to do that is to change out the one you have on the 6mm with another that you KNOW is still holding zero.

I have an older Rem 700 17 Rem. A friend pulled the trigger while on 'safe' many years ago, then realized his mistake. While still with muzzle pointed in a safe direction, he moved the safety to 'fire', and the gun fired. Since then, it has been rebarreled and the safety reworked by a gunsmith, with no more AD's. Yup, don't trust the older Rems - ANY gun, really - for being really 'safe'.

 

[TMan]

Make sure your scope is still reliable. .

If that's not the first thing to check, it's probably number two on the list.

The other thing to try is a good cleaning. Even if few shots were fired, the carryover jacket material would have corroded and made the bore rougher that needed.

I picked up a used 788 in .223 a few years ago. It would shoot about 1"-1.5" with anything I put in the chamber. I cleaned it thouroughly, and it turned into a consistant 0.5" shooter from that day.

 

[kdub]

And, after checking the scope mount/ring screws and giving it a good cleaning, how 'bout checking the action screws? After that long in storage, they could have loosened, or the stock swelled with moisture and they became too tight.

 

[Bird Dog II]

Ditto what kdub said. The bases or the rings could be loose. The scope itself could be shot. You should snug the action screws every few years anyway. 10 or 15 passes down the bore with JB paste and then clean patches too is worth a try.

 

[MMichaelAK]

One last thing.
Are you shooting factory ammo or hand loads? Are the lot numbers different?
Different lots of ammo produced with different components can acuse shifts in POI.

BTDT. Just wanted to ask cause no one else had.

 

[mywaynow]

I would look at the storage cabinet (safe) as a source of the problem. Just based on the statement that the gun was put away for a few years without firing it leads me to believe you have an environmental issue with the safe that affects the gun. For example;

A fire safe that has no humidity control will be moist all the time. Fire rating material is similar to concrete and is inherently damp. That moisture will swell real wood stocks and forearms, as well as create rust. My first check would be the barrel, for rust. Then the effects of swollen wood.

Conversely, a fire/non-fire safe with humidity control can be too dry. This can shrink and crack wood. Good for metal though.

Worst case scenario is a fire rated safe in a basement with no humidity control. This will cause problems quickly as the fire rating and concrete humidity will combine for a serious moisture problem.

I am a certified locksmith and safe technician and have experience in this field.

 

[Bird Dog II]

I would look at the storage cabinet (safe) as a source of the problem. Just based on the statement that the gun was put away for a few years without firing it leads me to believe you have an environmental issue with the safe that affects the gun. For example;

A fire safe that has no humidity control will be moist all the time. Fire rating material is similar to concrete and is inherently damp. That moisture will swell real wood stocks and forearms, as well as create rust. My first check would be the barrel, for rust. Then the effects of swollen wood.

Conversely, a fire/non-fire safe with humidity control can be too dry. This can shrink and crack wood. Good for metal though.

Worst case scenario is a fire rated safe in a basement with no humidity control. This will cause problems quickly as the fire rating and concrete humidity will combine for a serious moisture problem.

I am a certified locksmith and safe technician and have experience in this field.

Nice post mywaynow. Question. How well do the box/bag products like Browning's Dry-Zone work? I have one in my safe. Have used these for 5 years with no pitting. I was surprised upon returning from a 13 month deployment last year how much the POI had shifted on couple of my bolt guns. It was actually closer to 18 months between firings. I wonder if this isnt the reason? My safe is in the lower level of a split foyer, so kind of like a basement. The rifles in question are full length glass/pillar bedded. But I guess if the wood moves, it could still be an issue.

How well do those products work if used as directed. Perhaps I should have two or three rather than one?

 

[doctor duck]

You also might want to check the crown.

 

[mywaynow]

The silca blocks will help for sure. The problem with them is that they have limited capacity and don't call you to tell you they are falling-off. Having that safe closed for long periods of time makes matters worse as the humidity can build up quickly on the small cubic space within the safe. Just opening the door makes huge differences. When you open the safe does it ever have an odor other than gun oil?

I use a heating element in mine. I use and sell "Dry-Rod", but it is most likely the same as the Golden Rod or any other plug in element. My safe is non-fire rated just to avoid the humidity issue. It is in a basement though. The first rod went bad after a few years. The element had alot of mineral deposit on one end of it. This is a result of the air being burned off and leaving residue that builds up like scale in your pipes.

If you are going to use Silca blocks, I would triple the cubic capacity rating of the safe when choosing the size of the block. My recollection is that they make one about the size of a box of 12 gauge trap loads, but a little longer. If you were leaving the safe closed for long periods, put 2 of them inside. You would be better off using the rod though.

Even if the guns are bedded, expansion and contraction of the wood will pose possible accuracy issues.

 

[nimrod375]

Darin,

My dad has a late '60s Model 700 in .243, so practically the same gun. One day, when returning from a hunt, I had climbed into the back of the van we used for weekend trips. Dad was trying to get his gun unloaded. Finally realizing that the bolt wouldn't open because the safety was on, he thumbed it forward. By this time, the muzzle was in the side doors of the truck, pointed at the floor. The gun fired when the safety came off, scaring both of us to death and costing me a percent or two of permanent hearing loss?

Send the gun to Remington and they'll fix it, for free...no point in having a gun that isn't safe if you can get it taken care of.

Nothing wrong with a safety that locks the bolt though. Just keep your finger away from the trigger when you release it and don't point a rifle with a round chambered inside a car or anywhere else for that matter. Maybe your Dad's rifle had a defective safety Jim? With all due respect, why do you carry around a rifle that is ready to rock and roll anyway? When I've sighted game and I'm stalking in close, I'll often have a round chambered and the bolt handle up/hammer down or saftey on, but until that time, what's wrong with having an empty chamber? If the second it takes to work the bolt is going to cost you the shot then you didn't have time to take it anyway.

 

[Shawn Crea]

Let's not get too caught up in judgements of a situation that is described in 5 or 6 lines in a post. Text is a poor substitute to - and takes so much more time - conversation that has a lot more detail. broom related a story that - thank the stars! - was relevant to the thread, and was meant to reinforce the importance of getting the safety checked. Let's not get sidetracked; that's how threads get locked in many cases.

 

[pintopete]

Darin, In addition to all the other great suggestions that have been made, I have a couple additional things for you to consider. First, I also vote for having the trigger updated by Remington at the Ilion, NY repair center. Although this will not help your accuracy issue at all, to me it is a more logical way for it to function. I personally do not like to release a safety to remove a round from the chamber. But that's the way a few manufacturers made them in the past. I think a safety problem could arise when there is inadequate sear engagement and if this is the case, when the safety is released the rifle may fire. If the sear engagement is adjusted correctly it is not a problem at all. These are good adjustable triggers. Remington will perform this adjustment or check it when you send it in for the safety change. Secondly, and as far as your accuracy is concerned, when you shoot the rifle, make sure you are supporting the forend the same as you used to or as consistently as possible, preferrably about 1/2 way or more back. Maybe you can use a point on the forend checkering pattern as a reference point. It is possible that if your rest or bag is in different locations throughout your testing or all the way at the front, it could apply pressure on the barrel thereby changing the point of impact. Remington's are usually pretty good but this was a contributing factor on my Ruger M77's. If you are a handloader, try some 60gr Sierra hollow points with H4895. My other choice would be 58 or 65gr V-Max's with the same powder. I have a .244 that loves these loads. One accuracy load that I was told about is a 71gr Berger bullet, Rem 9 1/2 primer, with 38.5gr IMR3031 loaded to 2.908 OAL. Other good 68 or 70gr bullets should perform similarly. My rifle runs hot so I would work up to any load and check the Hodgdon data online. Let us know how things work out. Peter.

 

[broom_jm]

Nothing wrong with a safety that locks the bolt though. Just keep your finger away from the trigger when you release it and don't point a rifle with a round chambered inside a car or anywhere else for that matter. Maybe your Dad's rifle had a defective safety Jim? With all due respect, why do you carry around a rifle that is ready to rock and roll anyway? When I've sighted game and I'm stalking in close, I'll often have a round chambered and the bolt handle up/hammer down or saftey on, but until that time, what's wrong with having an empty chamber? If the second it takes to work the bolt is going to cost you the shot then you didn't have time to take it anyway.

No, that particular safety design is acceptable, but the Remington 700's of that era had a design flaw. My dad's finger was not on the trigger when he took the safety off...but the gun discharged nonetheless. Remington issued a voluntary recall on all Model 700's produced before a certain date. It is a known issue.

As for why he had a round in the gun on the walk back to camp, some people hunt with a round chambered and the safety on. In fact, the preponderance of hunters I know chamber a round as soon as they are "hunting" and keep the gun on safe until a shot presents itself. If this is not how you hunt, I don't have a problem with that. Where I come from, the safety on a gun is not relied upon for anything and a gun is ALWAYS loaded, so it all boils down to muzzle control...which is why I'm here to tell the tale.

The OP mentioned getting an older M700 and I would advise that he have it checked for the factory fix for this safety design flaw.