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Discussion Starter #1
Hi all!

I am thinking about pull the trigger on a Ruger Gunsite Scout .308 18" stainless (Model 6822).

The reason why I am posting this is just to see if I am missing anything out there that is better than the GSR for what I need, before I drop almost a grand on it.

My use case for this rifle is multi-purpose, primarily hunting and shooting at the range.
The hunting I would be doing would be deer and elk mostly. I would do shooting out to 400yds max at the range, but mostly would shoot closer (25-100yds).

My reasons why I like this gun are the Mauser style action, threaded barrel, durable materials (laminated stock, stainless steel, etc.), and flexibility with how it's used.

I am open to suggestions for what I should get, based on why I like the GSR.

What I am looking for in a new gun:

- Mauser-style, controlled feed action (I am open to others, but I am a sucker for this action)
- threaded barrel
- barrel that is heavy enough for consistent shooting
- 308 caliber (potentially 30-06) , basically something that is relatively inexpensive, hard-hitting, and accessible
- decent accuracy (1 MOA preferred, but anything under 2MOA would probably suffice)
- light enough to pack in the woods
- under $1000


I looked at Winchester Model 70's and I love that gun but the production ones all seem to have thin barrels for hunting, which worries me about overheating when shooting a lot. Also the barrels aren't threaded.

I am not necessarily set on a "scout" configuration as far as optics go, but I am curious about it.

Guns I have briefly considered:

Kimber Hunter
CZ 550
Winchester 70
Ruger Guide Gun


Are there any sweet guns that I am missing that kinda fit what I'm looking for? I know about Mossberg and Savage but they don't catch my fancy. However, I am open to all suggestions you guys have!

Thank you!
 

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I liked the SAKO 85 bear series better. They used to offer a couple models in .308 or .30-06. You might be able to find some on an auction site still new. The Black Bear was a good all purpose rifle but was ugly. The Brown Bear and Kodiak were much nicer looking.

They shoot much better IMO and the actions are incredibly smooth and reliable. You don’t really need that huge detachable box mag ruger uses. But if you want it more power to ya!

I’ve got a SAKO 85 black bear in .308 so I’m probably biased. Got an A7 in .308 as well.

They’re a little above your budget but they’re worth every penny IMO.

The tikka tactical is a good choice as well. It doesn’t have CRF but honestly CRF isn’t needed. It’s very nice to have but a push feed rifle works just fine 99.9% of the time.
 

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Discussion Starter #3
Thanks for the suggestion!

I have herd great things about SAKO but dismissed them due to price. But I will look around for an option that is hovering in my price and consider it. Tikka's are also nice and I did look at the Tikka tactical.

I wish the price was a little lower but I totally understand the "buy once cry once" philosophy.
 

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Here's one I put together...

.308 Rem model 600, Nikon fixed 3X, bedded Ramline stock, Timney trigger--- have about $750 in the whole setup.

1) about 2MOA

2) sure wouldn't want it in 30-06 with an 18" barrel

3) 400 yards---:D:D:D:D:D

the model 600/660 were made about 50yrs ago, the best possibilities for long range caliber would be one in 6mm rem or 6.5 rem mag (both expensive and LOUD)
 

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Discussion Starter #5
Thats a neat setup! Love the price!

Not sure I would go for a brand new Remington given their quality problems that I keep hearing about but your setup looks great!
 

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It is so much more satisfying in the end to save money even for six months longer and buy that quality which is accurate off the shelf, does not need repeated calls to the manufacturer or visits to a gunsmith, bedding jobs and trigger jobs and safety jobs - and own something which is not an "easy come, easy go" rifle but something that stays in the family and which the kids' kids' kids will shoot 100 years down the line and enjoy its quality and accuracy as if it was bought yesterday.

SAKO in my experience is the best monetary investment that can be made in hunting rifles.

OP, because you mentioned CRF - and not to start the debate all over again. Controlled "feeding" is a total misnomer; a "push feed" feeds the cartridge into the chamber just as nicely as a so-called "controlled feed" bolt does. Each time and every time for the life of the rifle and wherever it is shot.

It is about "controlled extraction" because the design is in the extractor to ensure perfect grip and perfect extraction of the case or unfired cartridge every time the bolt is closed and opened. That is the reason why I shall never own a rifle with an uncontrolled extraction bolt.
 
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Discussion Starter #7
I agree I want something that my kids' kids' kids will shoot.

Based on my research, the Ruger is very high quality for that, with accuracy being adequate, but not precision level.

Not as nice as a SAKO though.
 

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Carrot, I am curious about the reason for the short barrel.
 

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Discussion Starter #9
The short barrel is not incredibly important to me. Mostly it has to do with weight. I am sure I would be just as happy with a 20" barrel. I am also looking at the Ruger Guide Gun in 30-06 with a 20" barrel.

I care more about the thickness of the barrel. I don't want a gun to easily overheat and reduce accuracy when I go to the range for a while. This rules out many hunting rifles, which is my primary hesitation for looking more into Kimber Hunter rifles. The Ruger seems to have a heavy enough barrel to do some shooting but light enough to pack around.

I also want a threaded barrel so I can put a suppressor on it sometime in the future, which is not common with thin-barreled rifles.
 

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Based on my research, the Ruger is very high quality for that, with accuracy being adequate, but not precision level.
In my frame of reference "very high quality" implicitly means "very good accuracy". High quality implies care in design, manufacture, assembly, for everything to be linear and concentric. It aso means careful attention in mating the interfacing of the action with the stock. If that quality is assured then the rifle WILL have sub MOA accuracy.

I have a brand new (10 shots) Ruger M77 Hawkeye where the quality of workmanship is visibly very poor in the movable parts of the action and accuracy is only 3 MOA. I am disappointed in Ruger. The other much older three M77s I shoot are accurate rifles and that depicts the quality I mentioned above.

Being a cast iron action machined to specs the metallurgy of course does not make the M77 action the same quality as an original Mauser or the European derivatives but it is good enough for the job. It also was my preferred brand in the USA but after the Hawkeye it is not anymore.
 
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Sorry to hear about your experience. 3 MOA is definitely unacceptable.

Hopefully that is just a lemon but that still speaks to Ruger's quality control.

Based on my research, the Ruger GSR gets anywhere from .75" - 2" groups depending on who you ask, and what loads were used. I have read many reviews that claim they can be sub-MOA with hand loads and 1.5-2 MOA with factory ammo.

Of course, if Ruger's QA is no good, and I end up paying $1000 for a 3-MOA gun, I would be quite an unhappy camper.

Are there any other quality (preferably controlled-feed) rifles that are around or under $1000? You already mentioned Sako and I will look into those more but I'd like to get controlled-feed if possible.

Thanks as always!
 

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Carrot, I am uncertain whether that time of lapse in quality assurance was temporary or whether it had become a new style due to the forever diminishing levels of attending to detail in USA firearms and ammunition manufacturers' factories.

Certainly the principles that used to drive Sturm & Ruger were laudable and they have maintained these the longest and therefor have lasted the longest.

The sub-contracted Weatherby Vanguards (Howa) at least have some contractual quality specifications to meet and the few of these I have seen used by clients in Colorado impressed me from looks to fit to accuracy. Good, working rifles and the composite stocked Vanguard must be the only of the kind which I liked so far.

As many posts as you will receive in this thread they will duplicate the number of designs / manufacturers you will be advised on. :)

All in all, considering your budget and what my heart-felt advice about SAKO was I would still look at the Ruger.
 

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Carrot, I have a GSR.
I bought one when it first came out, and the first ones had some galling issues. The bolt would bind something terrible.
I traded it off, and about 4 years ago I bought another ( left hand model).
Apparently Ruger took care of the galling problem, as this one cycles nice.

With typical factory ammo like W-W Power Points or Hornady Super Performance SST accuracy was around 2 MOA.
I got some brass and with handloads, those same SST's got down to 1 1/4 MOA.
I tried some 168 grain A-Max with IMR 4064 and got things down to 3/4 MOA.
Not bad out of a 18" barrel with flash hider.
I rounded off the charge to 40 grains even, so the top left target is representative. I loaded up 500 rounds, and have had a blast the last few summers ringing steel at my range.

I mounted the same Nikon 2.5-8x pistol scope I had used in the Scout position on my Mini-30's, with Warne Q.D. rings. That scope is super clear and bright, and has two circles below the cross hair intersection for holdovers.
I also went with a Safariland Ching Sling. It mounts in a 2 point fashion rather than 3 point like the original Ching sling. it is quick to slip your arm through the split and really steadies things for unsupported shooting.

The laminated stock is a bit heavy, I'd much prefer the synthetic Ruger came out with as couple years ago for the weight savings, but they haven't seen fit to make them available in left hand.

I abandoned the metal "boat rudder" mags as soon as I discovered the polymer version, but still use the metall ones for range use as pictured on the carbine here.
The polymer ones are much cheaper, lighter, quieter, don't have the sharp edges the metal ones do, don't stick down as far, and can be top loaded while still in the gun, which you can't do with the metal mags.

The rounds have to be slid in from front to back with the POS metal ones, while the poly ones can be topped off by snapping the round in from above. The Poly ones are better in every way, and more rugged too. If you drop a steel one, you could bend the feed lips, polymer will flex and be fine.

The forward mounted scope is the only way to go, out of the way of the action, and gives vastly improved peripheral vision. I takes some getting used to if you, like most of us, have shot "tunnel vision" all our lives, with one eye up close to the scope, and the other eye closed.
Once you adapt to it, you'll never go back to a conventional mounted scope, unless maybe it's on a varmint rig.

I can't figure out guys that buy a GSR, then mount a big scope over the action. They could have just bought a Hawkeye and saved $400.
Those guys will be the first to tell you that a Scout set up sucks, but then they admit they either haven't tried one, or have only fired a few shots with that set up. Colonel Cooper knew what he was talking about.

Again I apologize for the use of the goofy boat rudder magazine, but they are O.K. for range use, where weight and extreme bulk aren't an issue. I save the poly ones for serious field work and hunting.

One thing I've noticed with the Ruger action, is you really need to run that bolt all the way back hard to get good ejection. Baby it, and the round extracted will not eject but just sit on top of the loaded rounds in the mag, and you'll have to reach up and flick it away before pushing home another round.
Probably typical of Mauser type ejectors.
Both pics of the carbine on the bench have the 10 round polymer mag, you can see how much more compact it is than the steel boat rudder mag.
 

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Carrot, your assessment of sub MOA with handloads, and 1.5 to 20 MOA with factory ammo is exactly what my experience with the GSR has shown.
Ruger makes good barrels, and the GSR has a stubby, but medium weight barrel.

I have much more experience with Ruger's Mini-30, as I have three of them, and a heavier short barrel with a flash hider hanging off the end can help a light weight auto loader like the Mini-30 turn in some groups, especially with handloads.
The same Nikon "Scout" (pistol) scope used on my Mini-30's for load testing.

For general use I prefer the Burris red dot, but then the Russian M43 cartridge the Mini shoots doesn't have near the range that the .308 in the GSR has. I like a scope for the GSR.
While a fixed 2.5x or 3x is nice, for longer range the Nikon can be cranked up to 8x.
 

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id it "It is so much more satisfying in the end to save money even for six months longer and buy that quality which is accurate "

I have Kimber, Ruger, and CZ 550. But also have rem 700, model 7, and Tikka and Sako and others. addicted to CF rifles.

308 is a good choice.

The scout concept isn't.

Scout Optics are limited and optical handling is poor for anything except 50-90 yards. remember it was developed and promoted as a semi-military rifle for the African black rebellions. and it might have been good for a sporting rifle that could quickly double down as a civil war rifle. Does sound like that mission is not in your goals.

Kimber 84M is outstanding, mine is sub MOA all day long. 3 of them in family all good, and very, very light. I have a Leupold vx3 4-10 and it comes up nice .

Ruger Hawkeye is also good choice.

Tikkas are heavier but accurate.

My CZ550FS is short (20 inch) with single set trigger, shoots sub MOA always and it is in 9.3x62.

If you like light weight the Kimber 84M and the Remington model 7 are outstanding, esp in 308.

The Kimber and the CZ are the best mauser type action around.
 

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308 is a good choice.

The scout concept isn't.

Scout Optics are limited and optical handling is poor for anything except 50-90 yards.
News to me since I routinely shoot out to 500 yards. 3 inch groups at 300. No problem hitting center of mass at 500.
50 to 90 yards I could just about do without aiming.

I'm not going to win a benchrest match, but shooting using my scout set up is certainly adequate for the intended usage. How much better do you expect for a short barreled .308 and 60 year old eyes ?

Scout optics are limited ? I know of at least a dozen choices. How many do you need ?
I only need one per rifle.
I like the rest of your reply though.
 

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For a very long time now, Ruger's have been much more accurate than most of the bozos jerking the trigger.

https://www.shootersforum.com/rifles-rifle-cartridges/88314-meanwhile-valley-sun.html

Ruger over Sako for me. Pay more for the privilege of dealing with Beretta, no thank you.
Yeah. Beretta does have some of, if not the worst customer service in the industry.

Still. I like a lot of their products. Beretta, Beneli, SAKO, Tikka, Steiner (great scopes), and Burris.

They own others but I only own products from those names. They’re all top of the line products, but if you do end up with the odd problem, Beretta does not back their product up enthusiastically. I had a brand new $1300 auto loader break the first time I fired it. The tabs on the forend that hold it into the receiver snapped off. Beretta does not have any replacement forends and can’t give me an ETA. After a series of Emails, me getting more frustrated at their evasive answers every time, they sent me a makeshift one that doesn’t match the shotgun in any way but gets it functioning.

Not real impressive for one of the oldest manufacturers in the world. Supposedly the oldest firearm manufacturer at that. Still. Broken products from them are rare so most folks will never have to deal with the poor service.
 

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"shooting out to 400 yds and...

doing most of my hunting at 25 to 100 yds" is kinda like saying I want good gas mileage and be competitive at the drag strip on weekends. You can't have it both ways. I ended up with a couple of 270's for my longer ranges and use the "point and shoot" scout setup for what it is intended to do, besides this way I end up with more guns :)
 

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I have heard great things about SAKO but dismissed them due to price.
The Tikka seems to come in two prices. The price on the Baretta site, and the price you will see at the LGS. It won't be much more, if anything more than the Ruger.
My T3X synthetic/7-08, weighs a bit less than 7 1/4lbs with a scope, sling, and loaded magazine with a 22" barrel.

Accuracy with a Ruger is "roll of the dice", Tikka has a guarantee. I have a beautifully accurate Hawkeye Predator .223, and sold a Hawkeye .243 that was minute of softball at 100yds, and nothing I tried fixed that. Both of my Tikka's easily make the MOA/3 shot promise.

The Ruger Guide gun does look nice though.
 
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