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Discussion Starter #1
I've been wondering about this ever since they stopped production of these awesome little 22's (they stopped production when they reintroduced the Model 70 again I think in 2009). My dad and grandpa bought me one for my 11th b-day. It has very nice reddish colored wood on it, and looks eerily similar to a Mosin Nagant. For a $200 rifle it shoots very well. At 50 yds. w/ Blaser 22 competition ammo (which is relatively cheap) it shot a 5 shot group about the size of a quarter. From the information I could gather Winchester was not even making them here in the USA, instead they were being made by Tula in Russia. So that is what I am wondering. Why did Winchester stop making such a great 22?
 

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I would bet Tula makes the same gun for someone else, just like the Chinese you find the exact gun with several differant badges.
 

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Over the past -30- some years, Winchester has done some very strange things.:confused: Seems like they introduce a certain model of rifle or shotgun (like their .22 Rifle Model 320 & 310) produced them a few years and then discontinue production. This has also occured with some variations of their Model 70rifles. Like what hapen to models: 670, 770, 70 Ranger, as well as some of their model 94's?? All were good sellers but they stop making them.:confused:
 

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Discussion Starter #5
Over the past -30- some years, Winchester has done some very strange things.:confused: Seems like they introduce a certain model of rifle or shotgun (like their .22 Rifle Model 320 & 310) produced them a few years and then discontinue production. This has also occured with some variations of their Model 70rifles. Like what hapen to models: 670, 770, 70 Ranger, as well as some of their model 94's?? All were good sellers but they stop making them.:confused:

Well in this case my Wildcat will be a collector's dream :)
 

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They are a neat little rifle but by the time that rifle was made, Olin was simply licensing the Winchester name out to companies that would make a rifle and put the Winchester name on it.

Sadly, Winchester is basically gone. Others own the name and guns are made in plants not owned by Winchester. I don't know if it will ever be a collector's item, but it is a curiousity. Hang on to it!
 

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Well in this case my Wildcat will be a collector's dream :)
I belive "Winchester's Wildcat" was made in Russia. I sure would like to see Winchester [IF they still exist] to re-introduce their Model 320 Bolt Action in .22 LR. Great little .22 rifle!!
 

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I think the simple answer is that "new and improved" ( I use that term very loosely, in this case ) is often the key to sales. I'm not saying it is in the best interest of the consumer, actual gun buyers, but how else do you explain some of the gun-making decisions of the last 20-30 years?
 

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Another theory...

Alright, thanks guys. At least we know some possibilities.
I bought mine in late 2008 (put a nice Leupold rimfire scope on it in 2009). What I noticed at the time was that even when it was "available" (like 2008-2009), it was REALLY hard to find - very limited supply. I got mine by going to Sportsman's Warehouse and they did a computer inventory search and finally located one in a different part of the state (I live in Washington). So, I got mine while I still could. I thought at the time the problem was probably getting enough supply from Russia to meet demand (remembering the issues NASA had with getting Russian contributions to the International Space Station).
Also, "Winchester" hasn't been Oliver Winchester's "Winchester Repeating Arms Company" since 1931, when it went bankrupt and was sold to Western Cartridge Co. and subsequently became "A Division of Olin Corporation." The main issue was over-expansion of production capacity to meet the demands of the First World War, followed by decreased demand and military surplus availability after the war. They tried to diversify into other product lines, but they ultimately couldn't recover. (Possibly also due to all the resources their primary stockholder, Sarah Winchester, was spending on her house - millions even in 1920s dollars). Then, (because of heavy costs due to labor disputes in the 1980s and other factors) Olin eventually sold the firearms manufacturing business unit (~1982-83?) but kept the ammunition side. The "new" Winchester was United States Repeating Arms Company (USRAC). USRAC went under around 1990 and was sold to FN (Belgium), along with Browning. After awhile, you almost have to flowchart out the different sales/mergers to figure it out. But, as best as I can figure out, its now owned by Belgian interests. Winchester has, over the years, made firearms in any one of several different foreign countries, not just at New Haven (which closed in 2006), including Canada, and now Japan and in the case of the 2008-09 Wildcat, Russia.
 

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Is this not "nationalistic nonsense"?

I bought mine in late 2008 (put a nice Leupold rimfire scope on it in 2009). What I noticed at the time was that even when it was "available" (like 2008-2009), it was REALLY hard to find - very limited supply. I got mine by going to Sportsman's Warehouse and they did a computer inventory search and finally located one in a different part of the state (I live in Washington). So, I got mine while I still could. I thought at the time the problem was probably getting enough supply from Russia to meet demand (remembering the issues NASA had with getting Russian contributions to the International Space Station).
Also, "Winchester" hasn't been Oliver Winchester's "Winchester Repeating Arms Company" since 1931, when it went bankrupt and was sold to Western Cartridge Co. and subsequently became "A Division of Olin Corporation." The main issue was over-expansion of production capacity to meet the demands of the First World War, followed by decreased demand and military surplus availability after the war. They tried to diversify into other product lines, but they ultimately couldn't recover. (Possibly also due to all the resources their primary stockholder, Sarah Winchester, was spending on her house - millions even in 1920s dollars). Then, (because of heavy costs due to labor disputes in the 1980s and other factors) Olin eventually sold the firearms manufacturing business unit (~1982-83?) but kept the ammunition side. The "new" Winchester was United States Repeating Arms Company (USRAC). USRAC went under around 1990 and was sold to FN (Belgium), along with Browning. After awhile, you almost have to flowchart out the different sales/mergers to figure it out. But, as best as I can figure out, its now owned by Belgian interests. Winchester has, over the years, made firearms in any one of several different foreign countries, not just at New Haven (which closed in 2006), including Canada, and now Japan and in the case of the 2008-09 Wildcat, Russia.
Things are not what they appear to be - and certainly not what they used to be in the (new?) world. Some frustrations can be attacked and managed and lives saved, even, and others just accepted as the new normal.

So the Russians have stopped supplying - but Yugoslavia Zastava sells a pleasingly accurate .22 LR, and a very nice 7x57 and an 8x57 of excellent quality. There always is growth in international exposure.
 

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The modern gun market is not primarily based on need or practical utility. It has gone the way of women's fashions and depends on novelty. Everyone wants the 'new model' or 'something different'. The utility based market has been filled and replaced by the 'boutique' model. There have been very few cases in recent decades where new guns and new cartridges have filled vital niches.
 

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The modern gun market is not primarily based on need or practical utility. It has gone the way of women's fashions and depends on novelty. Everyone wants the 'new model' or 'something different'. The utility based market has been filled and replaced by the 'boutique' model. There have been very few cases in recent decades where new guns and new cartridges have filled vital niches.
I dare you to say that in a woman's clothing store.

Making guns must be a really hard industry to make money in when you think how many companies go belly up trying.

When I crunched the numbers at my friend's gun store I just shook my head
And decided being in the gun store game was not for me.
It's sad to see guns that were available and are not now.

Cheers.
 

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Still no bids, guess that old world Russian craftsmanship isn't enough to get folks that excited about buying.
 
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