Winchester Model 12 Trench gun

727 Views 21 Replies 3 Participants Last post by Jasbucks, 23 d ago

Jasbucks

Discussion Starter · 2 mo ago

Well I'm just dazed and confused; I have been overwhelmed with the sale prices of this Winchester!! I have seen the price range from $1900-$20,000. Although the 20k model was an asking price some of the closed auctions show the sale prices at 10k-14k and of course the one I have is in better condition including the proof marks and the serial number is lower than most but 1. I did notice that the higher prices were realized at auctions rather than on the online sale sites so I wonder about everything.....so I figured I'd start here and ask what is a prudent way to sell this baby?? Any and all info would be appreciated! I'll take some pics when the sun comes out.

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JBelk

· #2 · 2 mo ago

If it has the flaming bomb mark, its worth more money. The better the description and pictures...LOTS of pictures, the more it'll sell for. I like sale sites better than the auctions.

DarkLord

· #3 · 2 mo ago

The challenge with those is the HUGE number of fakes, that's why prices are all over the place. Pick up a copy of Bruce Canfield's books, learn all the intricacies of that market, compare to guns selling on Gunsinternational.com and then take your best shot at setting a price.

www.amazon.com

Bruce N. Canfield's Complete Guide to United States Military Combat Shotguns: Bruce N. Canfield: 9781931464284: Amazon.com: Books

Bruce N. Canfield's Complete Guide to United States Military Combat Shotguns [Bruce N. Canfield] on Amazon.com. *FREE* shipping on qualifying offers. Bruce N. Canfield's Complete Guide to United States Military Combat Shotguns

www.amazon.com

JBelk

· #4 · 2 mo ago

Two weeks ago, I had a gunshow table in a small town show. I had a Model 97 'Trench Gun' with all the furniture but no flaming bomb. I had it priced as a Cowboy action shooter in 95% condition which is about a quarter of a genuine military gun. No takers but a LOT of lookers for the mark. No doubt a phony stamp (available for sale in places) would have sold it.
Genuine trench guns are not always good ones. I was battalion armorer in Korea and had six M12s and eight Model 530 Savages that were junk.

Reactions: 1

DarkLord

· #5 · 2 mo ago

Take down shotguns don't fare well in military service. When I look at a 1897 or M12 the first thing I do is snap the barrel off and see where the wear ring is. Old military guns, if they're not on the last notch, they've likely been shimmed. That take down seam just doesn't hold up to a gazillion rounds.

Reactions: 1

JBelk

· #6 · 2 mo ago

True THAT! the 530 Savage is a tongue and groove connection with no take-up provisions. Most were 'long parts' unless pressed into war service. Each firing battery had four shotguns. Some all Savage and some all Winchesters. I mixed them up to be sure they all had some real shooters. That's where I found the first hydraulic shim in a gun. It needed several more.

Reactions: 2

Jasbucks

Discussion Starter · #7 · 2 mo ago

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Office supplies Pen Writing implement Tints and shades Writing instrument accessory

Air gun Wood Trigger Musical instrument Shotgun

Table Furniture Wood Hardwood Gas

Wood Audio equipment Microphone Synthetic rubber Font

Office supplies Pen Writing implement Tints and shades Writing instrument accessory

Air gun Wood Trigger Musical instrument Shotgun

Table Furniture Wood Hardwood Gas

Wood Audio equipment Microphone Synthetic rubber Font

Office supplies Pen Writing implement Tints and shades Writing instrument accessory

Air gun Wood Trigger Musical instrument Shotgun

Table Furniture Wood Hardwood Gas

Office supplies Pen Writing implement Tints and shades Writing instrument accessory

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Jasbucks

Discussion Starter · #8 · 2 mo ago

Jasbucks said:
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Sorry the pics took so long. Let me know if you want more

JBelk

· #9 · 2 mo ago

What is the choke marking on the left side of the chamber section? Where is the flaming bomb acceptance mark. Need a close-up of that.

Jasbucks

Discussion Starter · #10 · 2 mo ago

Cyl is the choke marking on the left side of the receiver.

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Jasbucks

Discussion Starter · #11 · 2 mo ago

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Jasbucks

Discussion Starter · #12 · 2 mo ago

JBelk said:
What is the choke marking on the left side of the chamber section? Where is the flaming bomb acceptance mark. Need a close-up of that.

There are several flaming bombs on the shotgun...did I miss one?

JBelk

· #13 · 2 mo ago

I see an oblique angle of it on the barrel and maybe a shadow on the right receiver flat. Close-ups are valuable because it can be determined if the stamp was pre-blue or post blue. Both are genuine but point to different contracts.

DarkLord

· #14 · 2 mo ago

The markings look correct, but I'm no expert on trench guns. But it has the flaming bomb, and the inspectors mark. In some of the photos the bluing looks like a re-blue, but its hard to tell.

Reactions: 1

Jasbucks

Discussion Starter · #15 · 2 mo ago

That makes sense. I'll try to take some close ups by this time tomorrow....
Thanks very much

Jasbucks

Discussion Starter · #16 · 2 mo ago

Jasbucks said:
That makes sense. I'll try to take some close ups by this time tomorrow....
Thanks very much

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JBelk

· #17 · 2 mo ago (Edited)

I see nothing but an original trench gun, probably un-issued. VERY nice!
The 'tell' of a fake is usually how the stamp is applied. Only fakes were hit with a hammer.

Reactions: 1

DarkLord

· #18 · 2 mo ago

MUCH better photos...so yeah, that looks straight legit and in amazing condition. Assuming no catches, that one ought to go for top dollar.

www.gunsinternational.com

"Winchester Model 12 Trench Gun 12 gauge (W12092)"

"Winchester Model 12 Trench Gun 12 gauge (W12092)" for sale online.

www.gunsinternational.com

Reactions: 2

Jasbucks

Discussion Starter · #19 · 2 mo ago

Thank you very much DarkLord and J Belk. I really appreciate all your input. Now all I have to do is determine how and where I sell it. I'm leaning towards the Rock Island Auctions as they have realized significantly higher prices but I am open to any suggestions. JBelk you mentioned earlier that you preferred sites over auctions; Why is that?

JBelk

· #20 · 2 mo ago

I've had dealings with most of the 'high grade' gun dealers over the years and prefer to deal with people I know and trust to be most likely to place a gun with the right customer at the right price. With a gun such as yours, the late Leroy Mertz (shop still in business) handles collector grade guns, especially American made one and he always placed a premium on condition.

Reactions: 2

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