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Hello All
I thought you may like to read this, and I must say, I agree 100%...
Written by Ted Nugent, the rock singer and hunter/naturalist, upon hearing that California Senators B. Boxer and D. Feinstein denounced him for being a "gun owner" and a "Rock Star". This was his response after telling the senators about his past contributions to children's charities and scholarship foundations which have totaled more than &#3613.7 million in the last 5 years!!

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I'm a Bad American-this pretty much sums it up for me. I like big trucks, big boats, big houses, and naturally, pretty women. I believe the money I make belongs to me and my family, not some midlevel
governmental functionary with a bad comb-over who wants to give it away
to crack addicts squirting out babies. I don't care about appearing compassionate. I think playing with toy guns doesn't make you a killer. I believe ignoring your kids and giving them Prozac might. I think I'm doing better than the homeless. I don't think being a minority makes you noble or victimized. I have the right not to be tolerant of others
because they are different, weird or make me mad. This is my life to live, and not necessarily up to others expectations. I know what SEX is and there are not varying degrees of it.

I don't celebrate Kwanzaa. But if you want to that's fine; I just don't feel like everyone else should have to. I believe that if you are selling me a Dairy Queen shake, a pack of cigarettes, or hotel room you do it in English. As of matter of fact, if you are an American citizen you should speak English. My uncles and forefathers shouldn't have had to die in vain so you can leave the countries you were born in to come disrespect ours, and make us bend to your will. Get over it.

I think the cops have every right to shoot your sorry butt if you're running from them after they tell you to stop. If you can't understand the word 'freeze' or 'stop' in English, see the previous line. I don't use the excuse "it's for the children" as a shield for unpopular opinions or actions. I know how to count votes and I feel much safer letting a
machine with no political affiliation do a recount when needed. I know what the definition of lying is, and it isn't based on the word "is"-ever.

I don't think just because you were not born in this country, you qualify for any special loan programs, gov't sponsored bank loans, etc., so you can open a hotel, 7-Eleven, trinket shop, or any thing else, while the indigenous peoples can't get past a high school education because they
can't afford it. I didn't take the initiative in inventing the Internet.

I thought the Taco Bell dog was funny. I want them to bring back safe and sane fireworks. I believe no one ever died because of something Ozzy Osbourne, Ice-T or Marilyn Manson sang, but that doesn't mean I want to listen to that crap from someone else's car when I'm stopped at a red light. But I respect your right to.

I think that being a student doesn't give you any more enlightenment than
working at Blockbuster or Jack In The Box. I don't want to eat or drink anything with the words light, lite or fat-free on the package. Our soldiers did not go to some foreign country and risk their lives in vain
and defend our Constitution so that decades later you can tell me it's a living document ever changing and is open to interpretation. The guys who wrote it were light years ahead of anyone today, and they meant what they said - now leave the document alone, or there's going to be trouble.

I don't hate the rich. I help the poor. I know wrestling is fake. I've never owned, or was a slave, and a large percentage of our forefathers weren't wealthy enough to own one either. Please stop blaming me because some prior white people were idiots - and remember, tons of white,
Indian, Chinese, and other races have been enslaved too - it was wrong for every one of them. I believe a self-righteous liberal with a cause is more dangerous than a ####'s Angel with an attitude. I want to know exactly which church is it where the "Reverend" Jessie Jackson preaches; and, what exactly is his job function. I own a gun, you can own a gun, and any red blooded American should be allowed to own a gun, but if you use it in a crime, then you will serve the time.

I think Bill Gates has every right to keep every penny he made and continue to make more. If it makes you mad, then invent the next operating system that's better and put your name on the building. Ask your buddy that invented the Internet to help you. I don't believe in
hate crime legislation. Even suggesting it makes me mad. You're telling me that someone who is a minority, gay, disabled, another nationality, or otherwise different from the mainstream of this country has more value as a human being that I do as a white male. If someone kills anyone, I'd
say that it's a hate crime. We don't need more laws! Let's enforce the ones we already have.

I think turkey bacon, turkey beef, turkey fake anything sucks. I believe that it doesn't take a village to raise a child-it takes a parent with the guts to stand up to the kid and spank his butt and say "NO!" when
it's necessary to do so. I'll admit that the only movie that ever made me cry was Ole Yeller. I didn't realize Dr. Seuss was a genius until I had a kid.

I will not be frowned upon or be looked down upon or be made to keep silent because I have these beliefs and opinions. I thought this country allowed me that right. I will not conform or compromise just to keep from hurting somebody's feelings. I'm neither angry nor disenfranchised, no matter how desperately the mainstream media would like the world to believe otherwise.

Yes, I guess by some people's definition, I may be a bad American. But that's tough.



(Edited by mcassill at 2:11 pm on Sep. 2, 2001)
 

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He doesn't beat around the bush does he? <!--emo&:)--><img src="http://beartoothbullets.com/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/smile.gif" border="0" valign="absmiddle" alt=':)'><!--endemo-->

Praise God for someone with some stature unabashedly sharing his opinions and beliefs.
 

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Ted is the Man.

I am a cert. Bowhunter Education instructor where our main purpose is to try to educate people about a positive influence on those 80 % of voters who decide wheather we get to hunt or not. Ted has been critisized for his non-apoligetic approach and his uncompromized attitude by hunters and non-hunters alike. I for one think we need to watch how we are proceved by the soccer Moms and others who have no opinion on hunting, but at the same time I think the time to sit back on your hands and not stand up and fight for right is long past.

Ted has this balance down as good as anyone and like so many who are critsized at first, when right is right even the critics have to adjust and usually become the strongest voice.

If you have never seen his Spirit of the Wild series, SEE IT. If you have never visited his web site, do it. Get involved.

Preaching to the choir again.

Politics-- I think I am quickly becoming a Libitarian.
 

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Chief,

Unless you are in favor of narcotic legalization, child pornography, and fewer criminals behind bars you are not a Libretarian. Don't be fooled by their generally pro-gun stance, they are not what they appear to be. More anarchist than anything.
 

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Bill, think about this before replying. See if I'm not correct.

First I want to publicly state that I think porn (of any sort, not just the kiddy version- why differentiate? Is one type OK?) and drug abuse is terrible and I make the personal choice of not partaking. I also want to state that I'm a Libertarian, as were our forefathers. That's what the Constitution is about. There is absolutely nothing wrong with legalizing drugs so that I can self medicate. In the past I've had codeine freely available in the medicine chest for years and self medicated myself as needed and was responsible and a big boy with the responsibility. Today, my doctor freely prescribes it for me (I don't need his OK to be responsible) and yes, I'm responsible with it's use. Not everyone needs laws at the point of a gun to be responsible.

OK, here's what I want you to think about. This life is about free will and choice, choosing to follow one path or another, good or evil. If I have the ability to choose evil, it in fact is a choice, but if the evil road isn't presented it really isn't choice is it? This is exactly why satan was allowed to operate in the garden and why his spirit is on the earth today. True, it allows truely evil folks to absorb the light bigtime, but it also allows us to shine to full brilliance. As it is written:

Rev 3:15-16
15I know thy works, that thou art neither cold nor hot: I would thou wert cold or hot.
16So then because thou art lukewarm, and neither cold nor hot, I will spue thee out of my mouth.
(KJV)

This lack of clear choice of path is exactly what is referred to. To not allow the choice of the evil path (to legislate it away) fights what FATHER set up so that we could be HIS children. Fight HIM if you must, but be ready for your reward for that.

In the past I tried to protect folks from everything as I didn't want anyone to be lost. But that just means they remain "neither hot or cold" and are spewed out, not what this life is about. Too, I have no control of things other than my choices, so I prefer not to have onerous, then more onerous laws passed to control things that can't be controlled. satan doesn't control me but he is a powerful influence in this world, I choose to put my effort in helping folks make proper choices despite the law. So yes, I'm a Libertarian in spirit (the reality is that I'm an "unaligned" voter)  and am not for porn or drug abuse, but for the right to choose to shine brightly while all around me absorbs the light if it chooses that. The world that surrounds me has the choice to go to #### if it so chooses.

Libertarians are not for drug abuse or porn, but for the right of the individual to decide his/her own fate. Non-Libertarian views got us exactly where we are today, and won't pull us out of the abyss that we are on the brink of.

Just because gov't doesn't set laws (Libertarian philosophy) doesn't mean there are no laws. Anyone who thinks otherwise shows their true bent. Frankly, to #### with mans gov't, I want my KING to set the law. Our rejection of the KING is what set us on this road many thouand years ago.

Choose what you will. Most things are not what they appear to be.
 

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I think Ted has the right attitude. I probably should have left politics out of it but you can't.

I vote Republican. Richard Millhouse Nixon I owe my life to. Ronnie brought respect back to the White House and George Senior was not afraid to do what had to be done in Desert Storm. George Junior has a good heart and I believe a strong resolve but what can any of them do. Congress is where it's at and they ( republican majority ) let me down. The Federal Government should not be involved with limiting my freedom. I believe state and communittee government should take the lead in directing by law the will of the people. That way you could live around like minded people and a more free society would again develope. The problem is the Federal Government being involved in limiting my freedom not presearving it as they are charged by the Constitution to do. We already live where we want to live or we can move to where we want but you can't get away from Big Brother.

I guess you can tell I'm disapointed with my elected officials in Washington. But what true southern boy wouldn't be.

Do I need to add after all that that Soveriegn Rule is definitely the correct form of government but we would never find a good King. Not until the King of Kings returns to claim his.
 

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Discussion Starter #7
While I agree with the sentiments of the above posts I believe human history has shown quite clearly that if the laws of man do not place at least some limits on human behavior the end result is anarchy...
Mark
 

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Brian,

I would certainly agree that pornography of any kind is repulsive. The only reason I mentioned child pornography is because of the Libretarian Party's support for the North American Man-Boy Love Association. I won't disgust our board members here with details on that organization, but I think you can get a solid idea of what they're about just from the name.

Yes I have heard all the arguments about freedom to choose for oneself and that drugs only hurt those who use them. Patently, provably false in the most obvious way. My neighborhood was once a fine community where anyone could be happy to raise a family in as much safety as society can provide. For a number of reasons I won't get into here, that is no longer the case. But the underlying thread is rampant narcotics use. Crack cocaine, heroin, etc. Now how can legalizing these same drugs make them any less dangerous to the users and my family? The addicts will become even more addicted because the price will go down and likely their drugs will be paid for by tax dollars. The young who may sit on the fence will now see that it's okay to use narcotics. Heck, the government says so! So now you have more addicts than before. Addicts who will steal from you, rob you at gunpoint, go berserk in a drug-induced fit, etc. I have seen it all. I have had threats made against me by such individuals. Even beyond criminal misuse, what happens when crack pipes become as common as cigarettes? Will "Libretarians" say
when the surgeon slips, or the school bus driver crashes, or whoever screws up under the influence of a now legal substance that their drug use harms no one but themselves?  

This is not a question of God's law. It is a question of common sense. God given common sense. Remember
Romans 7:17...

I know nothing good lives in me, that is, in my sinful nature. For I have the desire to do what is good but I cannot carry it out.

To make narcotics legal, acceptable, cheaper, and available is to make a chaotic nation even more so.


(Edited by Bill Lester at 7<!--emo&:0--><img src="http://beartoothbullets.com/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/wow.gif" border="0" valign="absmiddle" alt=':0'><!--endemo-->9 am on Sep. 4, 2001)
 

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Do it FATHERs way and the path to good reward is cleared ahead of the traveler. Don't do it FATHERs way and there are rewards to be reaped there as well.

Our gov't isn't doing it FATHERs way and the country and neighborhoods are reaping their just reward. More laws won't solve the problem. I won't discuss solutions, I already have, but they need to fall on fertile ground. I will say to study the WORD, that's where the plot was first written of and where the solutions are. I can't discuss things when words are assumed to be written by me that weren't penned by me.

In the meantime I wait for the KING OF KINGS, and pray for my country that the strong delusion it's under will be yanked away. Woe, Woe, Woe.
 

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Brian,

At no point did I inply you believe that widespread narcotics use is acceptable. What I did illustrate is what will happen if they are legalized, as the Libretarian Party supports. Among a righteous people the law of God is all we would need. However I believe we would both agree we are not a righteous nation. Much like new gun laws, new drug laws are not needed. Existing ones are fully sufficient if properly and equitably enforced. But that is another, lengthy issue entirely.

(Edited by Bill Lester at 7<!--emo&:0--><img src="http://beartoothbullets.com/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/wow.gif" border="0" valign="absmiddle" alt=':0'><!--endemo-->5 am on Sep. 4, 2001)
 

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Gentlemen!

I appreciate the post containing Ted Nugen'ts commentary!  Indeed it is a free country, and that freedom has repeatedly been paid in blood.  I too appreciate his sentiments concerning business grant handouts of my tax dollars to fresh minority immigrants to this country, as many like myself struggle to eek out a living with a non-subsidized family run business.

Ted Nugent is both a patriot and an advocate of our second amendment rights... a very vocal and effective voice reaching many that we can not just because of his rock star status... a plus for those of us who are not in touch with a new generation.

Unfortunately, it seems that we've gotten side-tracked on this thread, and diverted from it's original intent.  We have all enjoyed, and have become proud of the fact that this is a very civil, polite place to learn, share and fellowship with folks of like interests and convictions.  Differences of opinions and ideologies are what make us individuals, expressing those opinions and ideas are what shapes our character.  Both are good things, both are necessary.  What is not necessary are inferred slurs, or degredation when one openly expresses those convictions!

I rarely do this, but in the interest of civility and polite etiquite, I'm locking this thread to further posts.  Please don't take offense at this action, just understand that we want to preseve the civility and politeness that has made this a safe, sane, pleasant place to come for information and to exchange experiences.

Best regards to all, and God Bless,

Marshall
 

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OK,

I've been petitioned to unlock this thread.  In no way do I want to thwart the free expression of those on this forum, nor their privelige to expound upon those convictions they hold sacred!

Please, enjoy, feel free to post here, but by all means, be edifying in your comments!  

Thank you for the many emails, and yes, we do listen.

God Bless you all!

Marshall
 

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Hello,
     I'm going to stay out of the political/religious debate here. I just wanted to say that the commentary credited to Ted Nugent appears to be a paraphrase of something that I have seen credited to George Carlin, supposedly an excerpt from his book. So I'm not sure who actually said it, where or when. Like so much stuff on the internet, I take it with a grain of salt. You never know where this stuff comes from. Anyone can start an e-mail credited to just about anyone and there is no way to verify sources.
      In my "maturity" I've come to doubt most things that I don't see for myself, truth be told!     ID
 

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ID,

You are so right about the validity of so much on the 'net. A good example is a modernized version of the Ant and Grasshopper parable. You may have seen it yourself, where the industrious ant's warm shelter, stored food, etc. are taken away when the shiftless grasshopper sues in Federal court. Anyhow, the originator is a disc jockey-turned-conservative radio show host here in Pittsburgh by the name of Jim Quinn. He has proof of it, when he first aired it years ago. But now you can find it many places on the 'net without due credit or under someone else's name.

Marshall,

I'm glad you reconsidered locking this topic. I think that in light of incredibly close elections like we had last November the truth must be told about the Libretarian Party. While we gun owners pat ourselves on the back for putting W in the White House, that isn't the case. The numbers clearly show it was the Ralph Nader vote that put him there. If his Third Party effort hadn't existed, Al Gore would be President. Scary ain't it?

That's why I take great pains to show my conservative, Christian, freedom-loving friends like those who have posted to this thread that the Libretarians are not all they appear. That in many ways their platform does not jibe with our own beliefs. And that to vote Libretarian is to throw-away a vote for the wrong party that cannot be elected. Call it political evangelism if you will.

There is no malice in my heart to anyone whether we agree in this discussion or not, nor should it be inferred.
 

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Hi Bill, if I incorrectly thought things were being ascribed to my keyboard, please accept my apology.

One last point, and I'll not belabor this. Similar words can be used and have very different meanings. One of the those words is "libertarian". There is a libertarian philosophy, to which I subscribe, then there is a manmade institution to which you were referring called the "Libertarian Party" somtimes called "Libertarians" or "Libertarian". To make matters worse, I freely interchanged the capital "L" and confused the issue. Yes, I agree the Libertarian Party is twisted. That's exactly why I'm unaligned with them, there is a larger issue as to why I won't join other manmade organizations who choose to govern, but I already stated them.
 

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Brian,

Your words are quite true. I consider Liberty to be the overriding reason for our nation's founding and our Constitution. It is something worth fighting and dying for if necessary. The so-called "Libretarian Party" has capitalized, pun intended, on the word hoping potential supporters won't examine their positions under a microscope.  Unfortunatly many don't and that was my desire, to illuminate on the Libretarian Party's positions
 

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I guess I will stick my 2 cents worth in. I have been in law enforcement for 17 years and have asked the question; " Do you think that drugs should be legalized?" to thousands of people I have taken to jail for non-drug offenses but drugs were part of their life. Everyone of them told me "absolutely NOT!" .This is straight from the horses mouth so to speak. I agree that if we all followed the father's path then we wouldn't have to worry about it but human nature has shown me that we must never give up on driving drugs out of our society.
 
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