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  #1  
Old 09-14-2015, 09:12 AM
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Post REMINGTON-WALKER Class information--


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This has been idling along since last February. The Order was entered in April. Deadlines are approaching.

http://remingtonfirearmsclassactionsettlement.com

October 5.2015 is the last day for those that wish to opt out of the proposed settlement or to object to the terms of the settlement to speak up and send in your information. Notice the lawyers say "received by". The Clerk of the Court says, "postmarked by".

This covers all 7.83 million Remington triggers containing a "connector", the so-called "Walker triggers". It also covers guns that used to have a Walker but was replaced by an XMP, that is now under recall. Most of those guns get a new XMP trigger if you make a claim and send it back to the factory in NY.

It gives owners of Model 600,660, 721, 722, 725s $10 or $12.50 credit at the company store but not the option of a new trigger.

I know there are questions and all the answers are in the pdfs of Court filings and directions listed on the web page lrink above. I have read the documents, but I'm NOT a lawyer. I'll answer what I can IF I KNOW the answer and not legally restrained from doing so.

I have objected to the proposed settlement and will post the specific reasons why later. I have complied with page 9 of the notice. Anybody that's read my book knows why.

This is a DIFFERENT notice than the XMP notice of excess sealant last April. This notice covers all Walker triggers. If the face of the trigger has grooves in it, it's a Walker, unless it's on a M788. The 788 trigger is NOT affected.

You can be assured your comments on this thread are read and recorded by lawyers on both sides in this suit.
Just a reminder--You're obligated by what you say. You are a slave to what you write.
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Last edited by JBelk; 09-14-2015 at 09:14 AM.
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  #2  
Old 09-17-2015, 08:11 AM
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I'm adding information as it becomes available to post it.

Trial lawyers seek big payday in Remington rifle settlement

Scott Cohen has been a 'friendly' major news reporter to the 'Remington story' for many years and has more information than most of the lawyers involved. I've found him a sharp and fair but a tough reporter. You know you've been asked good questions after his interviews! He goes for the heart every time.
Please remember, CNBC is a business network and their programs are geared towards investors and stock oriented viewers. It is a side us gun-geared people usually don't see, but it's very important to the industry as a whole. Money greases the gears of commerce like nothing else.
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Old 09-17-2015, 05:54 PM
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I was on a temporary work assignment in Oregon this summer. On a social occasion, a professional acquaintance mentioned to a few of us that he had acquired a Remington 700, and that it would fire on its own each of the several times he closed the bolt. I asked a couple of questions, and then mentioned the class action suit and settlement offer. I do not know whether he did or plans to pursue the offered remedy/replacement of the trigger. He was very disturbed by the condition, naturally, and he seemed to me to want to be rid of the rifle more than anything.
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  #4  
Old 09-20-2015, 09:45 AM
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MZ5--You heard what I call a "Remington Story". It seems anytime five shooters get together somebody has a story to tell about a Remington failure. It's even made its way into testimony.

The proposal before the Federal Court is to notify Remington owners through the internet and publications that a group of lawyers in Philadelphia can get you a new X Mark Pro trigger installed at no charge, IF you register your rifle through the lawyers and then send the rifle to New York sometime next year for the new trigger.

Those that have BOUGHT a new XMP trigger from Remington in the last few years gets a refund of money.

Those that have Walker triggers on older guns (721,722,725 and 600,660) get a certificate worth up to twelve dollars at the Remington store.

As reported above, the lawyers have applied for $12.5 million in fees for putting the deal together.

I have objected to the proposed settlement on three basis and filed the necessary paperwork with the Courts.

This case is one of the prime reasons I wrote my book so shooters wouldn't be blind-sided with information without context. So-far, it's gathered very little attention so may be a moot point. Out of over seven million guns only 5,000 people have asked the lawyers about it. I contend it is the confusion of multiple messages coming from multiple sources that is keeping participation to near zero. Was it planned that way?
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Old 09-20-2015, 06:07 PM
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I struggle a great deal with the lack of a recall.

I wish I was more surprised that so few owners have contacted anyone about a new trigger. Even my associate seemed least interested in that option. A gunsmith was more agreeable to him than going through a bunch of 'stuff' and then still having to pack up and send the rifle off someplace far away. Mail-in rebates are structured in a way to discourage people from taking all the necessary steps to actually _get_ their rebate. This whole thing smells a bit like that.
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  #6  
Old 09-28-2015, 07:59 PM
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Walker trigger .....

I am an 86 year old retired engineer who has owned Remington 721,722,725,700 and 40X's since 1960. I've done stock work, barrel fitting, reloading and many things pertaining to the shooting sports. I've NEVER had a problem with a Walker trigger mainly because with few exceptions I've had to readjust "New From The Factory" triggers to my satisfaction. I maintained each with inspection and proper cleaning. I always felt that if I sold a rifle that the buyer should forever be safe with its use.

I read JBelk's warnings and understood what I had to do. I'm installing the new Timney 510 Thin triggers in all my Remington rifles as well as those that I have given to my son and a dear friend. I'm a firm believer in Murphy's Law that if something can go wrong, it will go wrong at the most inopportune time. Only 5000 out of millions have complained because no one has informed the vast majority. Mike Walker realized the fault many years ago and informed the Remington suits that it would cost only 5 cents to correct the matter. Pity! Good luck Mr.Belk.
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Old 09-30-2015, 10:10 AM
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I really appreciate it, Theo.
I've posted some more information gained just in the past week athttps://www.academia.edu/s/7c54d78c50
The Timneys seem a good choice at this point.
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  #8  
Old 10-04-2015, 10:07 AM
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In a continuing effort to educate the public, I post the following http://fm.cnbc.com/applications/cnbc...Rem_Doc_06.pdf link and hope it works. If not, it'll be edited until it does.
Until Rich Barber came along such information posted above was so secret it could have had the Nuke Football codes as a wrapper. CNBC did the redacting and it's on their website.

In 1989, working a new job in N. Nevada that involved selling and talking to a lot of people, I heard a cowboy ranting and raving about #$*@^%@ Remington (AND their horse) because he'd dropped his brand new rifle when it had an FSR. It scared him bad and he wanted a new stock and they refused and he was telling anybody that would listen what he thought about it. It was a classic "Remington Story" that I heard all the time.
In 1993, I was sent boxes of documents and a protective order by a lawyer with a promise of being struck by lightning or worse should I reveal the secrets they held. Among thousands of customer complaints I ran across the Nevada cowboy's letter to Remington telling about sitting up a big boulder looking for a buck and 'fiddling' with his new .300Win Mag's safety lever. When it fired it kicked the gun off his lap and down the boulder into a rock pile and it messed up the stock and he wanted a new one. They refused him with the standard, 'We never heard of such a thing' letter and it made him just a little hot as his next letter showed. It went on like that for several generations of increasingly frustrated letters until he wrote Remington just about word for word what I'd heard at the Cowboy Poet Gathering in Elko. Two other guys listening had Remington stories of their own. Do they think shooters don't compare notes, or what?

Since the link worked, here's Mike Walker talking about trigger problems in December 1946 http://fm.cnbc.com/applications/cnbc...Rem_Doc_02.pdf

And here's a memo I've read into the record many times from Wayne Leek telling of how the Walker trigger can be dangerous in early 1947. http://fm.cnbc.com/applications/cnbc...Rem_Doc_03.pdf

Wayne Leek went on to design the poorest excuse for a firearm yet, the Nylon 66.
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Last edited by JBelk; 10-04-2015 at 10:27 AM.
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  #9  
Old 12-20-2015, 09:40 AM
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CNBC has followed up on their Remington reporting. This was posted this morning--Under Oath: Inventor of controversial Remington trigger speaks There are three new vid. clips in that segment.

And tonight, Dec. 20th will introduce a new 'chapter': "Gunfight: Remington Under Fire" airs THIS SUNDAY at 9pm ET/7p MT on CNBC.

The Class Action final hearing has been delayed indefinitely and the Judge has entered an order for the lawyers to submit additional information in Jan. '16.

The CNBC investigations are undoubtedly having their desired effect. Just hours after this Remington hid dangers of controversial trigger: Documents aired on Dec. 8th, the judge waved off the final hearing until more information is gathered. "More information" leads to one of the world's largest corporations that owned Remington Arms lock stock and barrel (fitting for sure in this case) during the time the very worst of business decisions were being made. Is there a legal avenue to force accountability?

Please remember that CNBC is a business oriented TV channel and when a billion dollars in liabilities are 'floating' over several companies, investors want to know what's going on. CNBC is not a 'shooting show' and that's plain enough to see, but Scott Cohn has the basics and most of all, he knows the facts.
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  #10  
Old 12-26-2015, 10:07 AM
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One more update-- On Dec 20th, "Gunfight: Remington Under Fire aired on CNBC. You can catch it on the web in two places.
Watch CNBC Originals Online - Gunfight: Remington Under Fire | Hulu
or
CNBC - Watch Full Episodes | CNBC | Gunfight: Remington Under Fire
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Old 12-26-2015, 12:06 PM
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It was purdy good considering CNBC made it. Made everything clear enough for "Joe Public" I think.

You could have dress a little better, and maybe been abit more swavie and deboner. Not bad though! At least you didn't have hand grenades and magnum revolvers hanging out all over (or at least they did not print well enough for me to see on the small screen).

Very embarrassing for Eliphalet Remington and family. Good for their customers though.

Cheezywan
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Old 12-26-2015, 12:38 PM
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cheezywan--- It's always fun to see camera crews from New York show up in Montana and Idaho. They were dressed like the North Face catalog and it was springtime near Boseman! During that interview in early 2010, they had two cameras going. Scott Cohn 'breaks the ice' with easy questions about the weather and then he throws a dart. I was just preparing for another salvo when I noticed a beaver coming out of the pond just about between a sound guy's legs. There was a general rush of activity near a swamp and the little dam we were standing on got crowded for a few minutes as tripods were moved and the sound guy swapped sides.

In Kansas City last February, I had just walked two blocks in a ten degree wind and Scott and crew got out of a warm van for an interview. I had snot running down my face and my eyes wouldn't quit running and he was throwing hard balls! But, he's fair and he knows the subject matter inside out....literally.
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Old 02-22-2016, 08:41 AM
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To update the class action suit that's still in the last stages of a Court decision. This has become a rather serious slap fight between lawyers and it would take a team of lawyers to see through the dust and coat tails to see just exactly who's ahead at any given time. I was deposed in October in an obvious effort at intimidation and serious time wasting and now Remington lawyers want to depose another objector, but he's a lawyer with assistance of another lawyer and they're wanting information about who exactly is contacting the class lawyers about a new trigger and why so few respondents for $12.5 million dollars in efforts to get the word out. Part of their objection is the high fees paid the lawyers compared to 2800 respondents. It's fascinating to me because history is being made in civil and criminal courts across the country and Remington has some explaining to do.

The PACER system gives anybody access to court documents for $.15 a page, but there's no charge up to $12.50 a quarter, I think it is. This suit is in U.S. District Court
Western District of Missouri (Kansas City)
CASE #: 4:13-cv-00086-ODS

It is an excellent source of information about 'The Remington problem' that's been ongoing for nearly 70 years and in the courts for nearly 50 years. Information is now in the public domain due to the courageous move by this particular Federal judge and the folks at Public Justice.

The next hearing is a week from today, the 29th of Feb. This coming hearing should decide and set the date for the final hearing which might determine if there will be a recall of all Walker triggers and replace them with XMark Pros. Or not. Or maybe some variation of a multitude of choices of agreements that could be made between parties, but the judge has acknowledged his limited role Constitutionally and suggested a route through that mine field. This is a case affecting public safety and more than seven million American made and mostly owned rifles. This judge has taken it very seriously. We should too.
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Old 02-29-2016, 06:17 AM
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The hearing date has been set back another 60 days.

I download and read all the filings of this suit and the Court sends me a copy. I'm not a lawyer, never wanted to be one and I'm thankful for it, but reading between the lines here it seems the judge is really bearing down on Notification. He wonders why only 2800 people out of over seven million rifle owners called the lawyers to ask about replacing their Walker trigger.
Remington Trigger Class Action Settlement

It is my contention the lack of response is the result of confusion. It's very well illustrated on every gun forum on the 'net. I have said in print and in testimony that until REMINGTON tells their customers the truth, confusion will continue and just get worse with more and more law suits, rumors, public press articles and opinions expressed by the uninformed.

Fellow objectors to this suit filed motions to get information about the notification budget and the timing of the responses but the judge denied that last week. Public Justice has offered to enter the fray and show Remington how to tell people and get the point across, but that hasn't happened yet.

Remington refuses to acknowledge the Walker has a defect even though they can see it, duplicate it, and the designer of it wrote a memo explaining it in 1947.

It is my OPINION the lawyers and accountants are whipping a dead horse to get every nickle they can from his good name before he flops over dead forever. Judging by the guns coming from green boxes, that wont be long now.
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Old 02-29-2016, 06:48 AM
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Wow 17 million guns with faulty triggers , man i thaught alpacas were stubborn.
They are nuts for not changing it and i hope they cop it .
I feel like buying one so i can complain!
Any one who goes within a mile of a remington has a right to complain! Reason being they might get shot because of the dangerous triggers.
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Old 02-29-2016, 08:35 AM
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My Rem 700 is 1971 vintage. The class action settlement claim form was submitted several months ago. So, just waiting to hear from someone now.

I check the class action website from time to time for recent developments, but as of the time of this post, no new "Important Dates" seem to have been added to the website since Dec. 14, 2015.

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Old 02-29-2016, 01:15 PM
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Don't make it worse, Shreck. Seven million is plenty.

Bayou52--- You're a member of Class A and one of less than 3,000 that have gotten 'on the list'. In the mean time, please cut the bolt lock feature off that safety lever so it can be unloaded while on safe.
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Old 02-29-2016, 04:01 PM
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I've been nervous every time I lift the bolt on my 722 since I bought it late last fall. It sure keeps you mindful of good gun handling. So I just went online to register for the settlement( Remington Trigger Class Action Settlement) and WOW they are offering me $10.00 at the Remington store. Check the box to continue and except their terms. Where is the part about replacing or reimbursing? For $10.00 its no wonder people are not signing up
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Old 02-29-2016, 04:32 PM
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I quote directly from my objection to the settlement proposal.

"Speaking as the owner of several of the most
dangerous of the Walker triggers, I would rather have the truth from Remington than a twelve dollar
hat."
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Last edited by JBelk; 02-29-2016 at 04:35 PM.
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Old 02-29-2016, 05:39 PM
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Unfortunately, it's probably about a $1.20 hat. They mark them up quite a ways when they hit our shores, dontchaknow.
;-)
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