My advices would be to work with her some more. When you take her out shooting, have her wear ear plugs and ear muffs to block out most of the noise while she shoots. I've found noise is what really bugs people more than recoil. Learned this when we took some new shooters out and screwed some silencers on the pistols...

She is just going to have to keep practicing to get comfortable. I personaly don't think .22lr is a bad defensive round, it's just that the odds of getting malfunction with .22lr is greater than if using a centerfire cartridge. Maybe you could try and move her up to a .32 cal centerfire revolver cartridge or even a .38 special later.

For right now in the .22lr revolver though, I have some of these .22's I intend to run suppressed through my 10/22, they are from RWS and it's a 40gr subsonic HP. They have worked well on all the small game I have taken with them. You could give them a try, I purchased them at big5 sporting goods. I haven't seen them anywhere else for sale. They are very quiet and low flash and actually will work the action of a 10/22 fairly reliably.

 

I read your post careful. I would say a 40 grain solid target velocity (sub-sonic) is what I would look for. I can't know if they will shoot good or not.

Cheezywan

 

Avoid cheap 22s. Particularly Remington Thunder whazzit. You don't need to add unreliable ignition to all the handicaps you already have here.

 

i think any sv round will work.
at the range that gun is meant for, all rounds will be equally accurate. so, just spend enow to get reliable
performance. cci sv n up. i have never had a misfire with anything like wolf n i don't remember getting any with cheap cci sv either.
since she likes 22lr, it would be fun to introduce her to some quality full size guns.

for bulls eye, i use a tricked up 22/45 which is accurate out to 50 yards.
if she want's a revolver, my ruger single 10 is super fun to shoot, tho i limit it to 25 yards.
i own n use centerfires but my love has always been 22s.
just get her to have fun.
there's more carry over between 22s n centerfires than you think.
if she can shoot them, she can shoot anything in a pinch.
maybe you can rent a ruger or s&w 22 to see what she thinks.

 

I'd like something best suited to that short barrel that will maximize the stopping power and accuracy but minimize noise and flash. I have a short list but hope you guys have some experience and recommendations that will allow me to add to it. Lotta restrictions, I know, but there is almost always room for optimization even within fairly restrictive parameters.

Federal Champion, unplated.

HP's will not likely make a difference in a 2" barrel. It's faster than most SV.

 

Thanks. So far, all the names mentioned are already on the list or have been tried. Even found a few that were tested in ballistic gel, though none were standard velocity nor from a 2-inch barrel.

I had a ton of that Remington stuff when it was about all you could get and not a single misfire in my old Marlin .22 rifle.

As to other guns...fugedaboutit. Been thru all that. That case is closed in her mind. It's all I can do to get her to do the minimal practice required.

 

Even found a few that were tested in ballistic gel, though none were standard velocity nor from a 2-inch barrel.

I've checked the velocities from several loads over time. I've never had a 2" barrel to check, but I did check some speeds from a P/22, 3.5". Most of my checks were with a 6.5" Single Six.

Oddly, the hyper velocity ammo loses the most steam, and often velocities are lower than HS ammo. My P22 manual suggests avoiding the HV stuff as the slower burn rate is tough on the gun. It does OK from my 4" SP101, but is barely faster than HS. Look for 650fps-800fps.

If you look for a product known as Duct Seal, you can do a comparison bullet to bullet with that. It's soft and pliable, and can easily be reformed. It's cheap and non toxic, and is seen on millions of furnace and air conditioner installations. What you will see is that there's very little difference in a short barreled handgun. In a rifle the differences are far more apparent. My favorite fox shooting ammo, Aguila Interceptor HP is actually way more poke than anything else. It might be good in a 2" tube, it's not cheap.

But a .22 revolver is better than nothing. And ammo that's reliable would be my goal.

 

here's something interesting.
i did my own penitration test.
38 spc out of a 4'' barrel got thru 2 2x4s n in the 3rd, it buried itself
with the heel . 1/4'' under the surface.
i got exactly the same results with 22lr tho it was from a 5 1./2'' barrel.

so, 22lr may not have shock power, but it does have penetration.

 

As you probably know Single, with that short barrel and the cylinder gap, most of the power is burning outside the barrel. It is giving you all bang and flash. things you don't want.

My suggestion. just get Remington 22 short Golden bullets. No leading, no flash.

As for terminal performance, you really can't enhance what you got. Let her shoot the 22 shorts and get good with it. With your minimum setup, Accuracy is 10 times more important than a small increment in power.

 

Let her practice with any standard velocity ammunition you can find, as mentioned before Big 5 has a good selection now, Prime semi-auto would work well.. For her carry loads mini-mag hollow points mixed with regular round nose min-mags would be as good as anything, in a true self defense situation she'll never notice any flash or bang, some people report never hearing the gun go off and those are centerfires.

 

Anything will work. I don't understand why there is such a push for standard velocity. Most of the really cheap stuff I find is high velocity. A training technique I have used successfully is to put up a standard sheet of copy paper on a box with a little dirt and rocks in it and at about 5-7 yards empty the gun at the paper. Be sure you shoot as rapidly as you can while still aiming. This is simple and fun and gives the shooter instant feed back. I have had a 3" S&W 317 for several years and I love it. I don't see a lot of difference between 8 long rifles and a load of buckshot. The short barreled revolvers are really good snake medicine with the CCI shot cartridges out to 10 FEET. I think the 317 snubby is a great purse gun. I bought a set of Altamont rosewood laminated grips for mine and the combination is a winner. I don't feel unarmed with my 317, I keep larger pistols, rifles and shotguns around because they have to be somewhere.

 

My eventual plan is to collect samples of every type and chrono them. Not sure what I will do with the info... probably pick out the ones with the highest velocity and lowest "flash-bang" attributes.

I have tried the CCI shot shells in a .22 rifle and they were useless. I still have half a box so may add them to the mix for the pistol, though snakes are not an issue here. I can see how they might work better in the snubbie than a long barrel rifle. I have tried shooting bird shot thru my rifled shotgun barrel and it does some very strange and almost unpredictable things to the pattern.

The 317 is a nice little piece... well made, nice trigger... all that. Not what I would have picked, but she chose it after trying a number of other(smaller calibers up to .380) calibers and firearm types (revolver vs automatic).

 

I see it like this, SP, the bad actors are as scared at the encounter as the victim. They're not going to look at the size of the muzzle-they're going to see a S&W snubbie pointed at them! Since most encounters are resolved without actual shots fired, the mere presence of the gun, and the shooters willingness to use it are WAY more important than whether the gun is loaded with "Stingers" or Golden Bullets", or whatever! Besides-don't EVER underestimate the lethality of a 22 LR.! It just reminded me---About thirty years ago, my brother-in-law was down on the border screwing around in an area that was none of his business, when a "local" fella said to him, "Hey mon-you got a little something for me?", while flashing his knife! To wit my BIL pulled out a little North American Arms 22 "toy", and said, " yeah, I got something for you!" All he saw was the guy's butt, and the bottoms of his feet, after he "showed him the "toy"!!

 

Avoiding muzzle flash is not important with a 22. It encourages bowel and blatter evacuation in thugs and scares critters.

 

High velocity loads are always going to be linked with muzzle flash & noise with that short barrel.

The advice on using under powered loads (std vel, shorts, etc) for practice and High Vel for carry is good.

 

I suppose you were asking about pistol barrel length - - -

It has been my personal experience that the longer the barrel, the less muzzle flash you will get.

 

Hi. I was wondering if you could give a little more detail about your experience with the Aguila 60gr.
Did you start with a clean gun, then after firing 4 of these through the clean gun it locked up? I just want to make sure they weren't shot after having run other ammo through it w/o cleaning, because these would have been my recommendation otherwise.

Thank you.

 

Agree, something ain't right there. I've been using them in a cheap Iver Johnson 55 for yard varmints at "back porch" ranges. They hit a lot harder than SV, and are pretty quiet. These shots are often at night; no appreciable flash at all from a 6" barrel. This gun has a built-in timing error that causes it to lead with almost any ammo; the 60 grain SSS is no worse than anything else.

 

I would recommend reserving the .22 for shooting at cans. Try her with a .38Special, using 148 grain wadcutters, low noise, low recoil, and one **** of a lot better as a defensive weapon.

 

.

IMHO if she is happy with a 22LR and comfortable shooting why Change.

While a heavier bullet might have more Knock, It is no good if your wife won't shoot it. It is more important to be comfortable with your gun and practice, than carry a Dirty Harry Special that she can't use.

With a 1.875 inch barrel, a high velocity round can never achieve full power. A 6 inch barrel may be able to shoot super sonic rounds. But a short barrel can't. All a high velocity does in a 2 inch barrel is give more recoil. The last thing a women need when under stress is more recoil.

I am recommend just the opposite and suggest the CCI 0074 subsonic segmented hollow point. That right less powder but more shoot ability.

BTW When I shoot standard or high Velocity rounds in my Ruger 22/45. I don't get the sonic boom because the 4 inch barrel isn't long enough to burn all the powder. Fact is suppressed I get about the same sound level as subsonic ammo with the higher velocity ammo.

My person Carry uses the Train & Defend low recoil ammo by Winchester. These are segmented hollow points that go in, break apart but don't come out the back side.

.

 

BTW When I shoot standard or high Velocity rounds in my Ruger 22/45. I don't get the sonic boom because the 4 inch barrel isn't long enough to burn all the powder. Fact is suppressed I get about the same sound level as subsonic ammo with the higher velocity ammo.

I think the Beartooth "Powder Pro's" will tell you it all burns pretty much in the case. What doesn't happen is the gas produced has less time/volume to push.

I was surprised when I clocked a collection of Hyper V in my handguns. All were lower than HiSpeed, some are lower than Std V. Of the RF ammo I keep on hand, Federal Champion unplated HS was the fastest from my P22.

In general, I couldn't feel the difference in recoil with anything.

 

Short isn't that bad

I looked up the results over at Ballistics by the Inch. .22 velocities from short barrels weren't that bad. One commentator above suggested that anything over 750 fps would do it. Scroll to the bottom and only 2 loads fall under that with a 2" barrel.

.22 LR is lethal, but isn't known for being a stopper. That's about the only real criticism. I'll vote with the folks who say the bang and flash is a big deterrent for an intruder, just make sure your lady is good on her shot placement.

BBTI - Ballistics by the Inch :: .22 Results

 

My 13 year old granddaughter shoots my S&W .38 Special 4" barrel revolver with wadcutter ammunition. The heavier weight helps absorbs recoil well and the longer barrel helps suppress noise. IMO, it's a far better choice in starter guns than a .22 snubby. Snubbies are fine for experienced shooters. YMMV

 

If she is complaining about the flash and noise from a.22 rimfire, she's not ready for anything larger. If its unpleasant to shoot, she won't practice. The best gun for defense is the one she is most confident shooting.

.22 ammo with a velocity printed on the box assumes you are shooting it from a rifle. Chances are that any ammo you shoot with be "subsonic".

I have to ask if shes wearing hearing protection when she shoots. .22 from a pistol is a lot louder than from a rifle. If she is, and she is still not happy with the noise and the flash, Id find some .22 shorts to practice with, and then use some very reliable standard size bullet ammo for defense. In my opinion CCI has some of the most reliable and accurate rimfire ammo out there, and its not expensive. Mini Mags are excellent, but even the CCI Blazer often performs better than some of the expensive stuff. As was noted, if she ever uses it for defensive purposes, she will not notice the flash or the noise. My guess is if she shoots it often, wears good hearing protection, and eye protection, it probably wont be long before you can stop spending money on .22 shorts and shoot something cheaper and easier to find.

 

That little barrel to hit a thing is a pipe dream. Throw the gun. You get into a knife as best.

 

I would not recommend a fragmenting 22 LR bullet of any kind for self defense. All it will do is to severely reduce penetration. With the 22 LR penetration is the main thing going for it. With its 50% greater bullet weight he Aquila 60 grain round might give even better penetration. especially in short barreled handguns where the light bullet/high velocity loads will experience greater energy/momentum loss than the 60 grain bullets.

 

Once saw a study where they got the best penetration with Stingers. I once shot a dog with a Minimag hollow point which blew a hole completely through his chest. The dòg ran 50 yards before collapsing.

 

I've been through the whole deal with my wife over the years with different calibers for her, we/she finally decided this was the gun for her, no accessible hammer to confuse her or much recoil, a simple point and shoot revolver.
She shoots it very well.

https://www.gunbroker.com/item/751865180

 

I chrono’d sv and Hv .22s from my 1 7/8ths barreled model 317. SV was right around 790 fps the HV was a tad over 800 fps.
Aquila SSS 60 grain .22s : because of the length of the bullet, Aquila recommends using a faster rifling twist than is comonly found in .22s.....on the order of 1-10”. None of my .22 pistols or rifles will stabilize those bullets.
Pete